Drastic: I posed the questions I did for a specific reason. It was being argued in the Pit thread (which inspired this thread) that not too many people of faith really believe that God works in their everyday lives (even answering prayers on less crucial things - the example in the other thread was of a person believing that God helped her find her lost Bible). Or, that if some people do believe that God helps them in everyday things (He may answer their prayers regarding more everyday problems) they are “stupid”, (or even “dangerous”) to believe that, or that it is not according to Christian doctrine to believe that.
I’m only giving my interpretation of the discussion, of course. Best to read the entire Pit thread yourself, to get the full gist of what has been discussed.
But are people who do believe in God being “involved” in their everyday lives “morons”? The issue of you thinking it is “silly” is one thing. That’s your opinion and that’s obviously fine. But that’s not the same as thinking that anyone who does believe in God’s interaction in their everyday lives is “stupid”. (And I’m not saying that you, andros, have done that. I can’t recall all of what you posted on the Pit thread.)
Er, all right. I just don’t see how factual yes or no questions, where the factual answer (yes, in this case) render the inspiration material irrelevant, are particularly pertinent. I’ll just accept not seeing a particularly clear intent, even in a repetition of the original (and probably not in an upcoming third, but you never know).
People are stupid, or not, and dangerous, or not, because of what they do, or do not–not what they believe, or don’t. Beliefs may be correlated with actions (I don’t think it is with the “God was involved in finding my other sock” formulation of miracle), but correlation isn’t causation.
Andros, I can respect that. But if there is a God Who is, per the usual formulation, loving of His human children and desirous of their good, and if He is per spec. omnipotent, it makes more sense for Him to intervene, perhaps according to a principle of parsimony by making sure the need is met by the resource by means of an apparently coincidental “normal” event than for Him to sit back and wait, so to speak, for Elijah to be trapped on the mountaintop by 7,000 heathen Aramaeans before He does anything about the situation.
Besides, doing His will to help out our fellow man, and knowing that He knows what’s needed even when we don’t have the foggiest, makes those of us with a desire to help others (which was, it’s presumed, also a gift of His) feel good about what we’re doing.
The reason I mentioned the question about whether the belief that God works in our everyday lives is “part of Christian doctrine” because of something Jack Batty wrote on page 3 of the Pit thread:
So, since that issue had been brought up (and since it seemed to me that I kept on having to repeat "But many people believe that God works in their everyday lives!!!
OK. I obviously posted too soon. It’s just one of those days. I think you will get the gist of my last sentence there. I asked the question about Christian doctrine because some people seemed quite skeptical that people of faith do believe that God works in their everyday lives.
Ah, that’s a lot more clear, thanks. Jack’s quote seems a lot like a True Scotsman accusation; you see a lot of it amongst all groups, Christians accuse other Christians of not being “real” Christians, Buddhists do the same to other Buddhists…hell, plug in any group religious to temporal, and people within it will be doing it.
My problem is consistently forgetting just how much stock people put in those kinds of accusations–which seem more silly to me than taking a few spare moments to calm down via asking a power for a minor spot of help. I’m reminded of Ambrose Bierce’s definition of “self-evident”: evident to one’s self, and not to others. Sorry for the sidetracking, and not taking posting weirdness into account before.
You remember in “Oh, God!” when John Denver asks George Burns “Why did you make it rain inside the car?” and George answers “You’re the one with the doubts, why should I ruin everyone elses day?”
I don’t mind if God helps someone find their keys. I don’t ask Him for valet service much myself, but if He wants to do itfor someone else, I certainly don’t have any objections.
Tris
Oh, yeah, by the way, “Real Dopers” don’t consistently forgett.
Sorry for the sidetracking, and not taking posting weirdness into account before.