# What is a "nice" restaurant? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** food-cooking\ **Created:** [October 11, 2021, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320 "2021-10-11T20:54:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2021, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/222 "2021-10-16T14:43:50Z")
I tend to regard valet parking as a bug, not a feature. If I can’t find a parking space within reasonable walking distance of a restaurant, I’ll go elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2021, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/223 "2021-10-16T16:24:05Z")
Unfortunately I’ve been to Arthur Bryant’s. Twice. It tasted like baked meat with a weird sauce. Very little smoke on the brisket at all. I was disappointed and underwhelmed. I had heard such great things about Kansas City barbecue, and for one of the archetypical places to be so lackluster was kind of a shock. ---
**Author:** ![Briny\_Deep](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/briny_deep/32/17188_2.png) [@Briny\_Deep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Briny_Deep)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2021, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/224 "2021-10-16T18:12:27Z")
While stipulating that a “nice restaurant” may very well be a Denny’s at 6am after an all-night drive: to me, fine dining is about the tone of service, and is in almost exact inverse proportion to the number of words that come out of the server’s mouth. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2021, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/225 "2021-10-16T18:55:10Z")
Some cities just aren’t well designed for that sort of thing, if I was visiting or living in one I wouldn’t want to cut off such restaurants from my list of options. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2021, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/226 "2021-10-16T22:35:57Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > > [@Raucous84](#): > > > > Something with five Michelin stars in my book would be considered “ultra nice/ crème de la crème. > > Considering that three stars is their highest rating, I don’t think a five-starred restaurant could even exist on our plane of comprehension. You’d walk in and suddenly Nylaryahotep would be feeding you nightmares with a utensil that has a number of prongs between five and six, and which is made of a color your brain can’t process. Oh you’ve been to ‘Nylaryahotep’s’! The unicorn steak was fantastic but I was disappointed by the Tiramisu. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2021, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/227 "2021-10-16T22:41:02Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I was disappointed by the Tiramisu. While I appreciate the authenticity, I do agree that they are better made without using _real_ lady fingers. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2021, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/228 "2021-10-17T02:15:36Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > While I appreciate the authenticity, I do agree that they are better made without using _real_ lady fingers. And the less said about the ris du veau a la financiere, the better. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2021, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/229 "2021-10-18T23:26:16Z")
> [@peccavi](#): > > Pre-COVID, I have regularly eaten at two restaurants, one on the west side and one just south of the airport that have valet parking… Is the airport LAX? I know an IHOP just south of LAX, and I’m not suprised they’ve gone to valet parking. People going to the medical building across the street and airport employees fill up almost all the spots to avoid paying for parking. I’ve driven forever in that parking lot trying to find a spot. ---
**Author:** ![peccavi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peccavi/32/388_2.png) [@peccavi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peccavi)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2021, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/230 "2021-10-18T23:31:22Z")
> [@carrps](#): > > Is the airport LAX? Yup. It’s the IHOP just north of what used to be the Hacienda Hotel (back in the day, all the airline crews seemed to stay there). ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2021, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/231 "2021-10-18T23:35:01Z")
> [@peccavi](#): > > l (back in the day, all the airline crews seemed to stay there). And the L.A. Kings’ coach a number of years ago (Andy Murray). This was back before the Kings were as popular as they’ve become (and way before they won their Cups). Murray was standing on the sidewalk on Mariposa, and we were stopped at the red light on Sepulveda. We recognized him and waved, and I think he was shocked we recognized him. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2021, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/232 "2021-10-19T12:04:46Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > Honestly high end pasta is one of those things, if you’ve never tried it, it’s honestly difficult to put into words easily what you’re missing–this is one reason I’m a big advocate of people going out of their comfort zone and splurging from time to time on nicer restaurants like this. Pasta from scratch has been talked about here before. I absolutely love it, my Wife doesn’t really care one way or another. I think she likes the dried stuff better. I make it if my wife travels out of town. It aggravates me when I ask a waiter if the pasta is home made, and they say yes because they boil the dried noodles. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2021, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/233 "2021-10-19T15:34:53Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > It aggravates me when I ask a waiter if the pasta is home made, and they say yes because they boil the dried noodles. Just try to find a pasta recipe on the internet. Not saying that they don’t exist, but you have to shuffle through a dozen, “bring water to a boil, put pasta in the water” recipes before you find one on how to actually _make_ the pasta. Unfortunately, I lost all my cookbooks from culinary school, so I was looking up how to make it to make sure I got ratios right. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2021, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/234 "2021-10-19T17:20:47Z")
The devil is in the details of the Googling… Search for “fresh pasta recipe” , and you’ll get scads of recipes of how to make it from flour/semolina, water, and eggs. I don’t know if it’s _ **better** _, but I admit that if I’m paying $70 or more per person, I’m going to be miffed if some dude in the back is opening up a package of dried pasta, no matter how Italian it might be. I’m also not expecting grocery-store mozzarella, bread, etc… At the very least, they need to be sourcing it from good scratch sources. In a big city, I’d say local and artisanal as well; for example here in Dallas, I’d expect any Italian restaurant worth their salt to be getting their cheese from the [Mozzarella Company](https://www.mozzco.com/aboutus), their pasta from [Civello’s Raviolismo](https://www.dallasobserver.com/restaurants/civellos-raviolismo-is-a-piece-of-dallas-ravioli-history-9519426) and their bread from [La Spiga](https://www.laspigabakery.com/), as examples- there are more than just those three to choose from. No shame in not making everything in house, but they really ought to do their dead level damnedest to source it from the best suppliers. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2021, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/235 "2021-10-19T17:57:47Z")
> [@bump](#): > > The devil is in the details of the Googling… Search for “fresh pasta recipe” , and you’ll get scads of recipes of how to make it from flour/semolina, water, and eggs. Yeah, and I found it easily enough. I just was going to make some pasta, and couldn’t remember the exact ratios (and you do need to be pretty close or things go wrong), and had a laugh at all the “recipes” that started with “boil a pot of water.” ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/236 "2021-10-20T01:14:35Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Pasta from scratch has been talked about here before. I absolutely love it, my Wife doesn’t really care one way or another. I think she likes the dried stuff better. I make it if my wife travels out of town. > > It aggravates me when I ask a waiter if the pasta is home made, and they say yes because they boil the dried noodles. Pasta from dried is home-made only in the sense that you can also make it at home. Fine for a cheap restaurant, but anywhere that had the slightest aspirations to being “nice” would make its own pasta. It’s like claiming mashed potato made from instant granules is home-made mash. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/237 "2021-10-20T01:47:48Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > Fine for a cheap restaurant, but anywhere that had the slightest aspirations to being “nice” would make its own pasta. Well…I remember watching an episode of Top Chef set in the tiny and super-exclusive ( but not necessarily super-fancy) [Rao’s in NYC](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rao%27s). One Italian-style chef seemed slightly shocked when they told him they used dried pasta. He ended up trying to make his own, over-egged it in his rush and got criticized by the judges for trying to make his own instead of just using the smarter option of dried 😀. But I suspect the dried pasta they use is a slight bit fancier than your average supermarket fare. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/238 "2021-10-20T02:08:27Z")
Dried pasta for some types of pasta might be OK. Like the way even a lot of good chefs don’t make their own filo pastry. It’d still be “this is somewhere that aspires to nice,” and it can be a lovely place to go. But it’s not “nice.” ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/239 "2021-10-20T13:31:14Z")
I don’t know if I’d go that far; I’d be content with a place that sourced good, locally made fresh pasta, especially if it wasn’t a high-end variant of a red sauce place. Sticking to your core competencies and all that jazz. It’s like bread; I’m sure that nearly every restaurant _can_ bake their own bread, but it’s not necessarily their strength, and making bread would take away from other prep work. So why not just outsource that, if you have a good local bakery? Same with pasta, sausage-making, butchering, and so on. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2021, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/240 "2021-10-20T13:39:46Z")
Back in the day of the Mobil (no e, I’ll remember) guide, they had requirements in order to get the higher stars. I don’t remember all of them, or even many of them, but a fair amount of it was that things were made in house. It may not make a difference to the diner in the end, but it made a difference to the review. Can still be “nice” and get your pasta from a local vendor, but you can’t be 5 star (or 4 or even 3, IIRC). I don’t think that there would be a requirement that cheeses are made in house, as that’s something that’s quite a bit more involved, and requires a fair amount of storage space for culturing and aging that a restaurant wouldn’t want to give up. But pretty much else is not that complicated, as long as you have the tools and skills to use them. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2021, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320/241 "2021-10-21T00:28:45Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > > [@SciFiSam](#): > > > > Fine for a cheap restaurant, but anywhere that had the slightest aspirations to being “nice” would make its own pasta. > > Well…I remember watching an episode of Top Chef set in the tiny and super-exclusive ( but not necessarily super-fancy) [Rao’s in NYC](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rao%27s). So, would a restaurant qualify as “nice” if it used Rao’s pasta sauce that it got from a supermarket? 🤔 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-nice-restaurant/952320.md?page=13)