# What is a religion? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 27, 2015, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082 "2015-03-27T02:47:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![dstarfire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dstarfire/32/5762_2.png) [@dstarfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dstarfire)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/21 "2015-03-27T21:14:39Z")
Check out (i.e. read up on, or research) the universal life church. It’s a legally a religion (afaik), but it doesn’t have a specific dogma, hierarchy, etc. . It’s more like a template of religion than what I (and many other people, it seems) think of as an actual religion. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/22 "2015-03-27T21:32:30Z")
> [@barbitu8](#): > > Secular humanism is, of course, a belief that there is no God (atheism). Pretty sure you are flat out wrong on both counts there. Secular humanism doesn’t claim there is no god and in any case “atheism” is not a belief that there is no god. ---
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/23 "2015-03-27T22:55:21Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > I’m an atheist, what “defitinite statement” am I making? That there is no such thing as “God”? Perhaps you define atheism differently, but that’s the general consensus on the meaning, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/24 "2015-03-27T23:06:13Z")
I would define Atheism a la Matt Dillahunty. _Atheism is a lack of belief in a supernatural being or force._ Which is often expanded to say: Atheism doesn’t postulate that there is no god so much as “we don’t see any good evidence to suggest a god’s existence.” Neither definition would meet that of “a religion,” any more than NOT collecting ceramic frogs is a hobby. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2015, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/25 "2015-03-28T08:04:03Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > That there is no such thing as “God”? > > Perhaps you define atheism differently, but that’s the general consensus on the meaning, isn’t it? See the reply below yours. I don’t claim there is no such thing as god and that is the definition I’ve always used. It is a lack of belief not a claim. I can’t be expected to to take a definite position on any and all things that _could_ be true so until any evidence is presented I’ll remain without a belief (a-theist). ---
**Author:** ![sbunny8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@sbunny8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sbunny8)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2015, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/26 "2015-03-28T14:50:48Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > Originally Posted by Novelty Bobble View Post > I’m an atheist, what “defitinite statement” am I making? > > That there is no such thing as “God”? Perhaps you define atheism differently, but that’s the general consensus on the meaning, isn’t it? I don’t think you can say there’s consensus on that, no. Some people define atheism as the lack of belief in any gods, others define atheism as the belief that there are no gods. Some people even differentiate the two groups by using Atheism-with-a-capital-A to mean the second and atheism-with-a-lowercase-a for the first. More to the point, SCOTUS ruled that the concepts discussed in the 1st Amendment also apply as negatives. Freedom of speech also includes the freedom to remain silent, and freedom to practice any religion also includes the freedom to NOT practice religion. So regardless of whether you define atheism as a belief or a lack of belief, either way it’s protected by the 1st Amendment. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2015, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/27 "2015-03-28T16:04:30Z")
Buddhism is a religion that is atheistic. Not sure how that would help the claim that atheism is a religion. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2015, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/28 "2015-03-28T16:28:17Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > **Moderator Note** > > **boffking** , religious jabs are not permitted in GQ, and your response in no way answers the OP. No warning issued, but do not do this again. > > George Huh, I always thought of you more as an Anthony. ---
**Author:** ![Enola\_Straight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dec6dc/32.png) [@Enola\_Straight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enola_Straight)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/29 "2015-03-30T14:50:50Z")
Religeon is the _organized_ relationship with the Supernatural. At it’s core, Buddhism isn’t a religeon at all…it is a philosophy. The Four Noble Truths and the 8-fold Way [http://www.sasana.org/sangha\_noble.shtml](http://www.sasana.org/sangha_noble.shtml) No mention of gods, souls, or the afterlife. ---
**Author:** ![get\_lives](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@get\_lives](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/get_lives)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/30 "2015-03-30T16:24:21Z")
> [@Steken](#): > > Dude, “the supernatural” is not the preferred nomenclature. As one scholar has pointed out, the term “presupposes an ontological division expressly denied by many of our sources.” But not all religions are dualistic like that, with a “non-magical” natural world and a “magical” supernatural world. Perhaps in theory, but in practice I am correct. ---
**Author:** ![get\_lives](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@get\_lives](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/get_lives)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/31 "2015-03-30T16:28:07Z")
> [@Enola\_Straight](#): > > Religeon is the _organized_ relationship with the Supernatural. > > At it’s core, Buddhism isn’t a religeon at all…it is a philosophy. > > The Four Noble Truths and the 8-fold Way > [http://www.sasana.org/sangha\_noble.shtml](http://www.sasana.org/sangha_noble.shtml) > > No mention of gods, souls, or the afterlife. Buddhism is \*extremely \* rich in explicitly supernatural-based practices. Extremely. The pre-existing spiritual practices in Buddhist countries have been thoroughly mixed in with the original Buddhist teachings. There’s not a thing about Buddhism that’s atheistic or agnostic, if you are talking about how it’s actually practiced in Buddhist countries. ---
**Author:** ![Steken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Steken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steken)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/32 "2015-03-30T16:29:08Z")
> [@get\_lives](#): > > Perhaps in theory, but in practice I am correct. What? ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/33 "2015-03-30T16:32:11Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > By that standard I guess atheism is a religion but agnosticism is not. The former makes a definitive statement and the latter does not. It seems to me both or neither should be. No, agnosticism makes a pretty definitive statement: no one knows whether a god of any kind does or does not exist. ---
**Author:** ![Enola\_Straight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dec6dc/32.png) [@Enola\_Straight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enola_Straight)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/34 "2015-03-30T16:41:51Z")
> [@get\_lives](#): > > Buddhism is \*extremely \* rich in explicitly supernatural-based practices. Extremely. The pre-existing spiritual practices in Buddhist countries have been thoroughly mixed in with the original Buddhist teachings. There’s not a thing about Buddhism that’s atheistic or agnostic, if you are talking about how it’s actually practiced in Buddhist countries. Well, that’s why I said “at it’s core”: other native traditions and beliefs had been incorporated/grafted/blended into it as it spread. I wonder…is there any Buddhist/Christian blends out there? (btw…in Frank Herbert’s DUNE series, the Fremen believe in a Buddhist/Islamic blend.) ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/35 "2015-03-30T16:48:01Z")
> [@Enola\_Straight](#): > > Well, that’s why I said “at it’s core”: other native traditions and beliefs had been incorporated/grafted/blended into it as it spread. > > I wonder…is there any Buddhist/Christian blends out there? > … We can make similar comments about Taoism, with its “core” being the [Tao Te Ching](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tao_Te_Ching). Local religious beliefs, and a practice of divination (the I Ching) have appropriated Taoist philosophy. ---
**Author:** ![yabob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yabob/32/2821_2.png) [@yabob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yabob)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/36 "2015-03-30T16:55:08Z")
Re: atheism / agnosticism. If we’re going to play this game, we need to bring ignosticism / igtheism to the table as well: > **[Ignosticism](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Ignosticism)** > > Ignosticism, or igtheism is a theological position. If followed to its logical end, it concludes that the entire question about God's existence is a non-question and that taking a yes, no or even ambivalent position is absurd. It can be summarized as... ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/37 "2015-03-30T17:45:58Z")
The answer to this question depends on the purpose for which it is asked. The IRS will want a different answer than a philosophy professor. ---
**Author:** ![Billdo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/billdo/32/315_2.png) [@Billdo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Billdo)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/38 "2015-03-30T18:11:42Z")
The IRS considers churches to be tax exempt organization. The [IRS Tax Guide for Churches and Religious Organizations (.pdf)](http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p1828.pdf) gives a definition the IRS uses for what a church is: > [@](#): > > Church. Certain characteristics are generally attributed to churches. These attributes of a church have been developed by the IRS and by court decisions. They include: distinct legal existence; recognized creed and form of worship; definite and distinct ecclesiastical government; formal code of doctrine and discipline; distinct religious history; membership not associated with any other church or denomination; organization of ordained ministers; ordained ministers selected after completing prescribed courses of study; literature of its own; established places of worship; regular congregations; regular religious services; Sunday schools for the religious instruction of the young; schools for the preparation of its ministers. The IRS generally uses a combination of these characteristics, together with other facts and circumstances, to determine whether an organization is considered a church for federal tax purposes. > > The IRS makes no attempt to evaluate the content of whatever doctrine a particular organization claims is religious, provided the particular beliefs of the organization are truly and sincerely held by those professing them and the practices and rites associated with the organization’s belief or creed are not illegal or contrary to clearly defined public policy. In other words, if you can establish that your group has a number of the characteristics listed above, it may be treated as a tax-exempt church by the IRS. However, this does not mean that you, as the religious leader of the church are exempt from personal income taxation, though as the linked publication notes, there are special tax benefits that ministers and similar clergy members may take advantage of. Be aware, however, that the IRS does prosecute individuals who improperly use an allege “church” structure to avoid taxation. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/39 "2015-03-30T18:45:35Z")
> [@yabob](#): > > Re: atheism / agnosticism. > > If we’re going to play this game, we need to bring ignosticism / igtheism to the table as well: > > [Ignosticism - RationalWiki](http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Ignosticism) [that is absurd](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absurdism) ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082/40 "2015-03-30T21:10:01Z")
> [@Enola\_Straight](#): > > Religeon is the _organized_ relationship with the Supernatural. > > At it’s core, Buddhism isn’t a religeon at all…it is a philosophy. > > The Four Noble Truths and the 8-fold Way > [http://www.sasana.org/sangha\_noble.shtml](http://www.sasana.org/sangha_noble.shtml) > > No mention of gods, souls, or the afterlife. I’d call nirvana/enlightenment a supernatural concept, but I know others are less picky on that front. Certainly beliefs in reincarnation and ending the cycle of life and death are supernatural. Or the [different realms of existence.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_realms) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-a-religion/716082.md?page=3)