# What is does "Ivy League" mean? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 14, 2005, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920 "2005-11-14T01:45:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/1 "2005-11-14T01:45:28Z")
What is an Ivy League school? I know Yale, Harvard, Dartmouth etc… are, but what qualifies one as such? Is it an actual League or just a figure of speech? ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/2 "2005-11-14T01:57:41Z")
It refers to a group of 8 private schools – once open only to men – including Harvard, Princeton, Dartmouth, Columbia, Yale, Brown, University of Pennsylvania, and Cornell. The association actually began as a sports league but grew to refer to the colleges themselves. Of Univeristies founded before the American revolution, only Rutgers and the College of William & Mary are **not** members. 7 women’s colleges – known as the Seven Sisters – partnered socially and at times educationally with the Ivy League. These were Radcliffe, Bryn Mawr, Vassar, Barnard, Mount Holyoke, Smith and Wellsley. However “Ivy” as a colloquial term has been associated with excellence, as in the term “Public Ivy” which includes such public universities as UC Berkeley and the University of Virginia. In this sense it just means “selective/difficult/prestigious” all qualities associated with the Ivy League. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/3 "2005-11-14T02:03:04Z")
The original use of the term was merely one made up by a sportswriter, as far as we’ve discovered. [http://www.wordorigins.org/wordori.htm#ivy](http://www.wordorigins.org/wordori.htm#ivy) ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/4 "2005-11-14T02:07:42Z")
> [@Hello Again](#): > > It refers to a group of 8 private schools – once open only to men – including Harvard, Princeton, Dartmouth, Columbia, Yale, Brown, University of Pennsylvania, and Cornell. The association actually began as a sports league but grew to refer to the colleges themselves. Ummmm . . . Penn is a public school. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/5 "2005-11-14T02:12:46Z")
> [@SaintCad](#): > > Ummmm . . . Penn is a public school. Perhaps you are thinking of [Penn State](http://www.psu.edu/)? AFAIK [Penn](http://www.upenn.edu/) is a private institution. ---
**Author:** ![Ezstrete](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ea924/32.png) [@Ezstrete](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ezstrete)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/6 "2005-11-14T02:14:20Z")
> [@Stinkpalm](#): > > What is an Ivy League school? I know Yale, Harvard, Dartmouth etc… are, but what qualifies one as such? Is it an actual League or just a figure of speech? Originally there were only four schools in the group--------and with the ,then, common usage of Roman numerals it became lnown as,guess what,The IV league. Elemenary m’dear watson! EZ ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/7 "2005-11-14T02:16:57Z")
Incorrect, grasshopper. You see anything [here](http://www.admissionsug.upenn.edu/paying/budget.php) about in-state tuition? ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/8 "2005-11-14T02:18:28Z")
Argh. My previous post referred to **Saintcad** ’s post. And I previewed any everything. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/9 "2005-11-14T02:22:19Z")
> [@Ezstrete](#): > > Originally there were only four schools in the group--------and with the ,then, common usage of Roman numerals it became lnown as,guess what,The IV league. > > Elemenary m’dear watson! > > EZ Did you read \*\*samclem’s \*\* link? There were originally 10 schools in the group. ---
**Author:** ![ombre3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/da6949/32.png) [@ombre3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ombre3)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/10 "2005-11-14T02:39:47Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Did you read \*\*samclem’s \*\* link? There were originally 10 schools in the group. All interesting info- But where the hell does the “Ivy” part come from? ---
**Author:** ![hermann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b487fb/32.png) [@hermann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hermann)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/11 "2005-11-14T02:46:40Z")
The “Ivy” part means that the schools are so old that ivy is growing on the walls. Just like Wrigley Field. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/12 "2005-11-14T02:48:27Z")
Because the buildings were covered with ivy – meant as an indication of their venerable status. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/13 "2005-11-14T03:23:11Z")
> [@SaintCad](#): > > Ummmm . . . Penn is a public school. [University of Pennsylvania FAQ #2 (“Is Penn a state university?”)](http://www.upenn.edu/about/faq.php#02): > [@](#): > > No. The University of Pennsylvania is a private institution with no connection to Pennsylvania State University. ---
**Author:** ![Catalyst](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@Catalyst](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Catalyst)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/14 "2005-11-14T03:42:29Z")
[The Straight Dope](http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mivyleague.html). ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/15 "2005-11-14T03:44:09Z")
Cornell, my own _Alma Mater_, is in part a state school, however. The Colleges of Arts and Sciences, Architecture, Engineering, and Hotel Administration are private, while the Colleges of Agriculture, Human Ecology, and Industrial and Labor Relations are state schools. I was proud to be an Ivy-League Aggie! 🙂 (At least we could look down on the benighted Hotelies.) ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/16 "2005-11-14T04:14:04Z")
I could have sworn that Penn was public school, kind of like the reverse od Stanford (the one private school in the Pac-10). ---
**Author:** ![R.P.McMurphy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7993a0/32.png) [@R.P.McMurphy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R.P.McMurphy)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/17 "2005-11-14T04:54:05Z")
The “Ivy League” is an athletic conference. So are the Big 10 and the Pac 10. The truth of the matter is that, while admission standards might be more restrictive, getting a degree from any of them is about on par. A “student” from a Big 10, a Pac 10, one of the “little Ivy’s” or a whole lot of other colleges, is probably far more qualified than a “legacy” from an Ivy League school. But hey, you have to maintain the myth. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/18 "2005-11-14T05:06:14Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Cornell, my own _Alma Mater_, is in part a state school, however. The Colleges of Arts and Sciences, Architecture, Engineering, and Hotel Administration are private, while the Colleges of Agriculture, Human Ecology, and Industrial and Labor Relations are state schools. I was proud to be an Ivy-League Aggie! 🙂 (At least we could look down on the benighted Hotelies.) And, of course, Cornell as a whole was New York’s land grant university. ---
**Author:** ![David\_Simmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9de053/32.png) [@David\_Simmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/David_Simmons)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/19 "2005-11-14T05:31:30Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > I was proud to be an Ivy-League Aggie! 🙂 (At least we could look down on the benighted Hotelies.) Everybody needs someone they can look down on. 😉 In my case it’s those plow jockies from Iowa State. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2005, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920/20 "2005-11-14T05:32:39Z")
> [@SaintCad](#): > > I could have sworn that Penn was public school, kind of like the reverse od Stanford (the one private school in the Pac-10). Last I checked, USC claimed to be a private school, too. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-does-ivy-league-mean/330920.md?page=2)