# What is existentialism? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 11, 2016, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412 "2016-08-11T04:56:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![TipTapTwo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/34f0e0/32.png) [@TipTapTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TipTapTwo)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2016, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/61 "2016-08-14T21:48:49Z")
[http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/1989-02-05/news/8902070052\_1\_intolerance-new-orleans-fanny](http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/1989-02-05/news/8902070052_1_intolerance-new-orleans-fanny) [QUOTE=Sara Isaac] In 1919, when she turned 22, Ventadour left her art studies at Tulane University in New Orleans and went to France. She ended up staying half her life. Since then, Ventadour has traveled throughout the world, learning to speak French, Spanish and German. But it was her home base _in the Parisian community of existentialists_ - including philosophers Jean Paul Sartre and her first husband, Jacque Ventadour - that shaped her beliefs and values. Existentialism led her to the concept of one world: that there is a global unity of mankind, and that basic human nature is not changed by skin color, nationality, or other artificial barriers. Her philosophical studies also led her to the belief that ‘‘one is what one makes of oneself,’’ and she has since set out to make herself a positive asset to the world. [/QUOTE] italics are mine So, around 1919 in Paris, an existentialist community did exist, for at least half of a lifetime. Enough to instill its beliefs/values into its new community members. What impossible things/interactions happened in that community? > **[Piri Reis's Map - and other big dates in world history](http://turkeyfile.blogspot.com/2013/01/piri-reiss-map-and-other-big-dates-in.html)** > > I don't remember much from my school days, to tell you the truth. I was a moderately successful student, but by no means a hardwor... [QUOTE=] Danish intellectuals, I suppose, and the international community of existentialists, will be gathering in smoke-filled rooms to commemorate the 200th birthdayof Sören Kierkegaard, founding father of their movement [/QUOTE] Also, it appears that there are enough adherents to existentialism that there is an international community of them that did join up in Turkey in 2013 to commemorate it’s founding philosopher’s birthday. What is so impossible about such a massing/meeting of existentialists and their interacting with each other? ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2016, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/62 "2016-08-14T23:07:54Z")
> [@TipTapTwo](#): > > [http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/1989-02-05/news/8902070052\_1\_intolerance-new-orleans-fanny](http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/1989-02-05/news/8902070052_1_intolerance-new-orleans-fanny) > > italics are mine > > So, around 1919 in Paris, an existentialist community did exist, for at least half of a lifetime. Enough to instill its beliefs/values into its new community members. What impossible things/interactions happened in that community? > > [Turkey File: Piri Reis's Map - and other big dates in world history](http://turkeyfile.blogspot.com/2013/01/piri-reiss-map-and-other-big-dates-in.html) > Also, it appears that there are enough adherents to existentialism that there is an international community of them that did join up in Turkey in 2013 to commemorate it’s founding philosopher’s birthday. What is so impossible about such a massing/meeting of existentialists and their interacting with each other? Existentialism doesn’t state that humans are one kind, and human nature is changed in a sense based on skin color and other barriers (in fact much of what we call “nature” is actually learned). Also one is a product of environment and genetics, so she is also incorrect there. Also the human nature is a flexible concept that only gets pulled up when a shift in behavior around the world takes place, it’s meant to resist change. I call it impossible but it would require them to ignore many facts of psychology. ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2016, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/63 "2016-08-14T23:08:54Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Another alleged fact! Instead of mentioning where you get the first one from, you just throw a second one right out there, huh? Thrilling stuff! It’s called society. People give up total freedom so everyone can have basic freedoms. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2016, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/64 "2016-08-14T23:19:57Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > It’s called society. People give up total freedom so everyone can have basic freedoms. Uh, yeah; so you\* point that out\* to an existentialist, and _he acts accordingly,_ right? I mean, here we all are – living in a society and stuff – and somehow the existentialists among us decide to carry on as though they’re willing to give up total freedom, and we all manage to have basic freedoms! _Amazing,_ isn’t it? It’s almost as if, in some weird way, an existentialist can reason about his situation to reach a sensible conclusion! How do you explain that away? I can’t wait to hear! ---
**Author:** ![Machinaforce](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aeb1de/32.png) [@Machinaforce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machinaforce)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2016, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/65 "2016-08-14T23:40:51Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Uh, yeah; so you\* point that out\* to an existentialist, and _he acts accordingly,_ right? > > I mean, here we all are – living in a society and stuff – and somehow the existentialists among us decide to carry on as though they’re willing to give up total freedom, and we all manage to have basic freedoms! _Amazing,_ isn’t it? It’s almost as if, in some weird way, an existentialist can reason about his situation to reach a sensible conclusion! > > How do you explain that away? I can’t wait to hear! Then they would be going against the philosophy and act in bad faith. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2016, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/66 "2016-08-15T00:26:24Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Then they would be going against the philosophy and act in bad faith. How is that acting in bad faith? Can’t an existentialist choose – in good faith – to so live in society? Didn’t they do that back when, while writing at length about bad faith and authenticity and thus and such? Don’t they likewise do that now? Sure, you can do that with a dose of self-deception; you can do it while falsely claiming you have no choice, you can do it while pretending someone else has the authority to make the decision for you. But you can, instead, do it in _good_ faith; you can do it with authenticity, you can do it with clarity and sincerity; you can do it by constantly and consciously taking responsibility for your actions and refusing to take refuge in easy excuses: no _“I do this because my father told me it’s right,”_ and no \* “I do this because my pastor told me it’s right”\* – but still doing it, while never passing the buck to anyone else, is all. ---
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2016, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/67 "2016-08-15T02:01:34Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > That is actually not contradictory. I’m saying that if something has meaning to just you then it’s the same as being meaningless. It only has meaning of a group recognizes it as having meaning. Again, this doesn’t make any sense. If an individual’s assignment of meaning is worthless, then a group’s assignment of meaning would also have to be worthless, as a group is nothing more than a collection of inidividuals. As I already stated, 0 + 0 = 0. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2016, 8:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/68 "2016-08-15T08:49:33Z")
> [@Machinaforce](#): > > Then they would be going against the philosophy and act in bad faith. Sorry, what? Do you have “existentialist” confused with “antisocial” now? Since you’ve already shown you have no idea what existentialism actually is, I don’t think you get to decide for us what is and isn’t authentic with our beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/69 "2016-08-23T05:59:47Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > The best example is language. It’s a pretty well-accepted fact of linguistics that words are intrinsically meaningless. Most words, aside from obvious onomatopoeia (that is, words which attempt to mimic the sounds other things make), have no inherent connection to what they describe. What about the bouba/kiki effect? > [@MrDibble](#): > > And that’s self-evidently not true to me. I’m assuming the same is true of everyone. P-zombies don’t exist. This made my c-fibers fire. The first person subjective is like religious witnessing at this point, no? There’s no expectation of an objective third person accounting of it anytime soon. So we’re p-zombies until science says otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2016, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412/70 "2016-08-23T06:59:00Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > This made my c-fibers fire. They fire very slowly, then. It’s been almost a fortnight 🙂 > [@](#): > > The first person subjective is like religious witnessing at this point, no? [No.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterophenomenology) > [@](#): > > There’s no expectation of an objective third person accounting of it anytime soon. Why are you equating “subjective” with “not scientific”? > [@](#): > > So we’re p-zombies until science says otherwise. Science isn’t the right tool for the job. It’s a philosophy question, with a [philosophical answer](http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/zombies/#4.2). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-existentialism/762412.md?page=3)