# What is going on with the antisemitism from these college heads? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 6, 2023, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173 "2023-12-06T12:40:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/1 "2023-12-06T12:40:26Z")
I just watched clips from hearings with these college heads and their inability to say that calling for the genocide of Jews is not necessarily wrong has me shaking with emotion. What on earth is going on? Here’s one cite, but there are plenty more on google. Seriously, wtf? > **[College presidents face tough questions from Congress over antisemitism on...](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/antisemitism-campus-harvard-pennsylvania-mit-presidents-testify-congress/)** > > Colleges and universities have been criticized for their handling of antisemitic incidents since the Oct. 7 terrorist attack by Hamas on Israel. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/2 "2023-12-06T12:47:33Z")
Because systemic antisemitism is older than western civilization, and most people have an implicit understanding that violence against Jews is just how the world works. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/3 "2023-12-06T12:54:33Z")
This is from the article you quoted: > [@](#): > > In one of the more tense exchanges during the hearing, Stefanik pressed Gay on some Harvard students’ chants of “intifada,” a reference to Palestinian uprisings in Gaza and the West Bank against Israel. Gay said that “type of hateful speech is personally abhorrent to me” and “at odds with the values of Harvard.” I’m not seeing a failure to condemn the rhetoric, and also not seeing discussion of “genocide of Jews”. Honestly, nobody is well-served by Israel-backers’ very well established habit of conflating each and every criticism of Israel, or support for Palestinians, as “rabid anti-Semitism.” Hiding behind that trope is partially why it’s become so hard to separate truth from fact. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/4 "2023-12-06T13:00:18Z")
The “genocide of Jews” comment is in the very next paragraph. Yeah, I kinda agree any criticism of Israel’s behavior, no matter how justified, since 10/7 is being slammed as antisemitic. I think these college Presidents are trying to dance on a fine line of allowing free speech while waiting to take any real action until someone is physically harmed. I guess that’s the deal we made with 1A. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/5 "2023-12-06T13:07:16Z")
Criticism of Israel isn’t (necessarily) anti-Semitic. Some critics of Israel are, obviously, but students protesting Israel’s treatment of Palestinians or Israel’s conduct in the war? Doubtful. Just because Republican lunatics like Elise Stefanik accuse college heads of being anti-Semitic doesn’t make it so. Anyway, to the OP, please point out the anti-Semitism of the college heads. Allowing student protests is not anti-Semitism. Let’s not forget that Stefanik is in the party that cozied up to people chanting “Jews will not replace us”. Republicans are the ones who shout “you’re suppressing free speech!” when students protest against actual white supremacists giving speeches at colleges. ETA: The “genocide of Jews” comment is from the Stefanik, backed by nothing. It’s not students calling for that genocide. It’s exhausting to have to say this, but none of what I wrote is meant to justify what Hamas did in any way, or to say that Israel doesn’t have a right to defend itself. ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/6 "2023-12-06T13:15:52Z")
I apologize if I’ve gone off the rails with this. I mistakenly provided a cite that failed to show the part I was reacting to. I thought it did. This is what I saw. (I didn’t want to use twitter, but these direct questions seemed easy to answer and I don’t like Stefanik.) > ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/7 "2023-12-06T13:33:18Z")
What was their answer? Does calling for any genocide violate their codes of conduct? I would think that bullying and harassment has to be against specific people – that is, you would have to tell a Jewish person that you’d like that person to be killed – in order to violate the code of conduct. I mean, I’m sure students call for the elimination of the Republican party or conservatives all day long, and that’s not bullying or harassing conservative or Republican students, right? This seems like a “have you stopped beating your wife” type of question to me. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/8 "2023-12-06T13:37:19Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Criticism of Israel isn’t (necessarily) anti-Semitic. Tell that to Israel. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/9 "2023-12-06T13:41:27Z")
I agree that Netanyahu and other Israeli leaders play this card all day long and twice on ~~Sunday~~ Saturday. I know two Jewish Israeli people pretty well – a close neighbor and a family member. Both of them criticize Israel’s actions in the Palestinian territories all the time and they both can’t stand Netanyahu. Their criticism is more muted after the atrocities that Hamas committed, but it’s still there. They think that Netanyahu is a disaster and the wrong person to be conducting this war. According to Stefanik, they must be anti-Semitic. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/10 "2023-12-06T13:50:37Z")
These congressmembers essentially were asking in a very roundabout way, _“why did you not expel/fire these people on the spot and remove them from campus the moment they said ‘intifada’ or ‘from the river to the sea’?”_ They are defining any pro-Palestinian slogan as Hate Speech **and seeking to shame the institutions into admitting they “allow Hate Speech” after all**. It’s not about antisemitism it’s about their scorn for Academia. (The answer IMO: because then we will have to do so to anyone who says “MAGA!”) ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/11 "2023-12-06T14:04:08Z")
Problem the First: Colleges are not in the least bit interested in the free exchange of ideas. They routinely protect their students and faculty from unpopular ideas. They allow the expression of any concept no matter how hateful as long as it receives applause, and not in the form of any sort of academic argument. Shouting down unpopular people and ideas is commonplace. Coherent rational arguments are rarely found at all, largely because they are not required as part of the educational program. Problem the Second: Within this environment of promoting ignorance people are divided into groups labeled as _oppressed_ and _oppressors_. Related to the subject of this thread that would be Palestinians are _oppressed_, ergo Jews must be _oppressors_. And criticism of the oppressed is not allowed. Even extremely hateful and violent behavior at most can be personally opposed by the college administration but those engaging in it can not be criticized. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/12 "2023-12-06T14:09:53Z")
I disagree with a lot of what you said here, but I would rephrase this: > [@TriPolar](#): > > Related to the subject of this thread that would be Palestinians are _oppressed_, ergo Jews must be _oppressors_. I think you meant to say “_Israelis_ must be _oppressors_”, or maybe even “_the Israeli government_”, right? I don’t think the students protesting this think that Jews must be oppressors, rather the Israeli government. I think that the folks chanting “Jews will not replace us” or who believe that Jews are causing wildfires _do_ think that Jews are the oppressors. Those are Stefanik’s buddies. ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/13 "2023-12-06T14:15:12Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > Yeah, I kinda agree any criticism of Israel’s behavior, no matter how justified, since 10/7 is being slammed as antisemitic That was a thing long before 10/7 I actually heard some Israeli politician say that it was only OK to criticize Israel in private, because in public it was indistinguishable from anti-Semitism. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/14 "2023-12-06T14:15:23Z")
> Stefanik later asked Gay if “calling for the genocide of Jews” constitutes bullying and harassment, according to Harvard’s rules. Gay said the language is “antisemitic,” but did not say it necessarily constitutes bullying and harassment. The only appropriate answer to this question is “yes,” even if it’s “yes, and if that happens - and it isn’t currently - we will address it on those terms.” ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/15 "2023-12-06T14:16:43Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > I think you meant to say “_Israelis_ must be _oppressors_”, or maybe even “_the Israeli government_”, right? I don’t think they are intelligent enough to understand that. Saying “it’s the Israel government” is just an excuse for otherwise hateful speech. Then they turn around and condemn Jews for their support of the Israeli government. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/16 "2023-12-06T14:17:11Z")
Well, I think the antisemitism on college campuses lumps all Jews into one block, and all Jews must be sympathetic to and supportive of anything the state of Israel does. Of course that is false, and as false as thinking all Arabs condone and support what Hamas did. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/17 "2023-12-06T14:24:14Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I don’t think they are intelligent enough to understand that. Saying “it’s the Israel government” is just an excuse for otherwise hateful speech. > [@snowthx](#): > > Well, I think the antisemitism on college campuses lumps all Jews into one block, and all Jews must be sympathetic to and supportive of anything the state of Israel does. I disagree that this is what the college protests are about. College students protest all the time to “protect the downtrodden” and they see the Palestinians that way. I disagree entirely that anti-Semitism is running wild among progressive college students. I’m sure you can find lots of anti-Israel sentiments, of course. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/18 "2023-12-06T14:29:50Z")
Agree the protests are mostly againt the violence and the war in general, but there is a vein of hatred in all that when some protesters are calling for violence against Jews, posting swastikas, etc. People are assuming Israel = Jewish people - I agree most aren’t smart enough to see the difference. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/19 "2023-12-06T14:40:25Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > I think these college Presidents are trying to dance on a fine line of allowing free speech while waiting to take any real action until someone is physically harmed. Harvard President Claudine Gay, quoted in the linked article in the OP: > [@](#): > > We embrace a commitment to free expression, and give a wide berth to free expression, even of views that are objectionable, outrageous and offensive. Debatable. “Harvard gets worst score ever in FIRE’s College Free Speech Rankings… this year, Harvard completed its downward spiral in dramatic fashion, coming in dead last with the worst score ever: 0.00 out of a possible 100.00. This earns it the notorious distinction of being the _only school ranked this year_ with an “Abysmal” speech climate.” “What’s more, granting Harvard a score of 0.00 is _generous_. Its actual score is -10.69, more than six standard deviations below the average and more than two standard deviations below the second-to-last school in the rankings, its Ivy League counterpart, the University of Pennsylvania.” > **[Harvard gets worst score ever in FIRE’s College Free Speech Rankings](https://www.thefire.org/news/harvard-gets-worst-score-ever-fires-college-free-speech-rankings)** > > Harvard has never performed well in FIRE’s College Free Speech Rankings, finishing below 75% of the schools surveyed in each of the past four years. While there’s considerable overlap between anti-Israel views and antisemitic bigotry, Harvard should be more concerned with preventing and punishing bad acts than with suppressing speech deemed offensive. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173/20 "2023-12-06T14:43:45Z")
Liberal antisemitism usually runs in the direction of graciously affording Jewish liberals the opportunity to denounce Israel. It’s a loyalty test. If they pass it, then all is good, so long as they’re willing not be _too_ Jewish in the presence of the real liberals. You also have to be willing to deny your status as a minority, since Jews - who are basically just white people as far as they’re concerned - are oppressors and not the oppressed. And you always, always have to be willing to denounce Israel on command. What’s wild is that American liberals have made amazing strides in forwarding understanding of systemic racism, implicit bias, and privilege. We accept that confronting these things can be deeply uncomfortable because they require changing beliefs you were taught through societal inertia. But those lessons are generally not applied to liberal antisemitism, because one of its aspects is that Jews are white oppressors rather than members of an oppressed minority. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-the-antisemitism-from-these-college-heads/994173.md?page=2)