# What is going on with UFOs in the NY Times and Politico? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 16, 2017, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686 "2017-12-16T23:09:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/21 "2017-12-19T05:17:27Z")
I heard about this program on the NYT daily podcast and found myself a bit shaken. I had always dismissed the likelihood of visitors from outer space as negligible. But this sounded serious. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/22 "2017-12-19T07:14:15Z")
> [@wevets](#): > > There’s a story in today’s NY Times - [Glowing Auras and ‘Black Money’: The Pentagon’s Mysterious UFO Program](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/16/us/politics/pentagon-program-ufo-harry-reid.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=photo-spot-region®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0) and a story in Politico - [The Pentagon’s Secret Search for UFOs](https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/12/16/pentagon-ufo-search-harry-reid-216111). It seems like UFO stories are pretty faddish, and there was a spate of them in the 1990s (and of course before that in the 1950s-1970s) so maybe we’re just due for the fad to come back. > > But there is a fascinating story of an encounter with F/A-18s in 2004 where cameras captured some interesting-looking UFO footage. I’m not inclined to believe an outer-space-alien explanation for this phenomenon - the distances and time involved in interstellar travel reduce the chance of such a visit dramatically. > > What do folks think - the return of an old fad? Is that a mischaracterization and there’s something different about the reports now vs. the reports in the 1990s or the 1960s? Believe there’s a Truth Out There? Just another odd finding that probably lead to inconclusive government reports which are very unsatisfying because the phenomenon isn’t repeatedly observable? Something else? Really just interested in random opinions on this, I don’t expect us to be able to nail down anything definable. It seems like the government is inching closer by the year to lower the shock value. With individual companies doing space work, it is becoming harder by the year to pull the wool over our eyes. Are they out there? Not sure, my guess is yes, but the real action might be with USO’s, Unidentified Submerged Objects in the oceans, UFO’s in the artic, and Ufos in the mountains. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/23 "2017-12-19T14:42:54Z")
Is it just me, or does that footage have a remarkable resemblance to “object close to the camera”-artifacts like the “orbs” and “rods” of paranormal claims? Of course I don’t know enough of the technical setup, or what the pilots saw with their own eyes, but either that camera has perfect tracking, or whatever that is it’s stuck inside the camera dome. ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/24 "2017-12-19T15:08:08Z")
If we had go-pros that were small enough, we could explore ant society from the inside by strapping a camera to an ant’s thorax and letting it wander back to the colony. Therefore, aliens wouldn’t be using anal probes to monitor human society. All they would see is flowing feces. Maybe the term “anal probe” is actually a cynical metaphor for how human society tends to evaluate itself. See shit, and assume it’s progress. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/25 "2017-12-19T16:11:40Z")
> [@Declan](#): > > Did’nt some city have something like five glowing lights flying around its airspace, not too long ago, so over ocean flights cannot be solely their purpose. Yea, [that was my city](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoenix_Lights). And despite all the happy hooey surrounding it, they were almost assuredly 5 planes, not one alien spacecraft. The day it happened, there was one person that said he viewed the lights with his telescope or binoculars, and, seeing that it was just planes, went back to what he was doing. No one talks about that witness anymore. My theory was it was five military planes that decided to prank everyone by flying in formation with their landing lights on during a routine flight. Probably never told anyone, either. “UFOs? No, we didn’t see anything. ;)” ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/26 "2017-12-19T18:24:59Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > The day it happened, there was one person that said he viewed the lights with his telescope or binoculars, and, seeing that it was just planes, went back to what he was doing. No one talks about that witness anymore. Uh huh. What they didn’t mention was exactly what he went back to doing. I have it on good authority that he was tweaking on his Illudium Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2017, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/27 "2017-12-19T19:10:27Z")
> [@Doctor\_Jackson](#): > > Uh huh. What they didn’t mention was exactly what he went back to doing. I have it on good authority that he was tweaking on his Illudium Q-36 Explosive Space Modulator. The lights were obstructing his view of Venus. But Arizona has a lot of wascially wabbits that made a wrong turn at Albiqoikee. Don’t try your earth shattering kaboom experiments here. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2017, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/28 "2017-12-20T18:33:41Z")
Old report given new weight by the imprimatur of the the US government. Harry Reid had a friend who was a big donor and had an interest in UFOs. So he gave his friend 22 million dollars of the pentagon budget to look into UFOs. Simple pork barrel politics. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Krupe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Leo\_Krupe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Krupe)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2017, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/29 "2017-12-21T13:47:02Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > Old report given new weight by the imprimatur of the the US government. Harry Reid had a friend who was a big donor and had an interest in UFOs. So he gave his friend 22 million dollars of the pentagon budget to look into UFOs. Simple pork barrel politics. Makes sense. Plus, look at the cost. $22 million spent by the government? Over five years? If my math is right, 22 million / 300 million (conservative, there are over 310 million Americans, but I'm rounding off to make the point) = .07 spent for each American over the course of the investigation. Divide that by 5 years, and you get just over one cent per American per year. According to [this](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/01/19/us/budget-proposal.html) article from the NY Times (2014, but bear with me…just making a point), both the House and Senate combined cost each American $7 to run (federal budget, 2014). The same article lists Amtrak grants at $4 for each American. So one cent per American per year for five years looks to me like a conciliatory gesture, and if cost is any measure, wasn’t meant to prove anything. Not that the search by the US government is wasted, it’s always possible, though unlikely, that ET will visit Earth. It’s just more likely that a hostile Earth government will try to get the better of us, or there may be some natural catastrophe (asteroid) we need to be aware of. ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2017, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/30 "2017-12-22T17:22:25Z")
> [@Declan](#): > > Sorry that was a Whoosh, was speaking of the recent sky writing by naval aviators Sorry about that - it is particularly appropriate to be whooshed when talking about jet fighters, though. 🙂 > [@](#): > > It follows that any interstellar vehicle will have a reactor, if any aircraft of extra terrestrial origin exists. For us to go beyond the moon and go off into the wild black yonder to Mars, that ship will have some sort of nuclear reactor. But we don’t know that what the pilots saw was an extraterrestrial vehicle. Even if made by aliens, the aliens could presumably have some separate vehicle that carries the smaller vehicles, refuels them, perhaps builds them out of local materials - something I might call a mamaship. If we ever do encounter extraterrestrial vehicles, I suspect we’re more likely to encounter the smaller equivalent of a Space Segway first, as it would be scouting and/or there would be more of them. > [@](#): > > Did’nt some city have something like five glowing lights flying around its airspace, not too long ago, so over ocean flights cannot be solely their purpose. [I see](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoenix_Lights). I dunno - I’m not sure that the Phoenix Lights are in the same category as the video released. I had to look it up to find out what it was, and I don’t really have any useful thoughts about it at the moment. > [@](#): > > Regarding psyops, simply put its a means to transfer money from a known program, into a black program. The military says they spent 22 mil on research, but did the GAO see where every penny went too. I agree, corruption is a bigger threat here than unexplained sightings. We know for sure that people like [Alain de Villegas](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Oil_Sniffer_Hoax) exist, but we don’t know for sure what, if anything, was recorded over the Pacific. But psyops can have another meaning - psychological operations to disorient or misinform an adversary. It might be in someone’s interest to have the Pentagon wasting time and money trying to figure out what happened over the Pacific rather than on other efforts - in which case, the people involved in the program wouldn’t be the ones pulling off the scam here. > [@](#): > > If its human, its corparate. Something like that does not get built in Seattle and not have someone notice it. I would put more money on a military black program, than extra terrestrial. But your mileage may vary. But what if it wasn’t built in Seattle, but in Komsomolsk-on-Amur or Chengdu? It wouldn’t be out of the realm of possibility that a foreign power could build drones that could test US air defense or detection capabilities. Over and above that, even the [US produces some aircraft that are well-kept secrets](http://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/14058/this-northrop-grumman-exec-has-some-very-interesting-airplane-models-on-his-desk), but that seems inconsistent with the story as reported in the Times and Politico. > [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > Pilots see stuff in the skies all the time. I mean, all the time. None of them ever seem to land or crash and do damage in inhabited areas or come down to building level so they probably are either atmospheric effects or optical illusions, or, at the end of spectrum of possibility, spycraft from other countries. How many of our spy planes get shot down and revealed? But more to the point, what’s the best explanation for the video? Is it possible there was no physical object there at all, and radar ghosts and IR images were errors? Or is it more likely there was some physical object present, but with a relatively prosaic explanation like a Chinese test of US naval sensors and interception capability? ---
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2017, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/31 "2017-12-25T19:15:42Z")
I read another article that provided some additional detail: > [@Robert Beckhusen](#): > > With orders to intercept the object, Fravor in his jet — callsign FASTEAGLE 01 — headed toward with aid from an E-2 Hawkeye early warning and control plane. > > The Hawkeye’s sensors, however, couldn’t detect the object and vector him toward it, so Princeton directed FASTEAGLE 01 and Fravor’s wingman, FASETEAGLE 02 to the location, and even asked Fravor whether he was carrying weapons — he wasn’t. and > [@Robert Beckhusen](#): > > The Navy report cited a source who indicated the object maneuvered in a manner “that seemed to defy the laws of physics” and “‘tumbled’ into nonsensical angles that made any engagement by the F-18 impossible.” From [War Is Boring](https://warisboring.com/the-u-s-militarys-ufo-program-is-actually-awesome/) It seems to me that the combination of showing up on the ship’s radar, but not on the Hawkeye’s radar, and the seeming defiance of the laws of physics makes it more likely this was some sort of ephemeral phenomenon rather than a physical object that was detected, although the pilot seems to think it was an actual object (although he describes it as featureless.) ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2017, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/32 "2017-12-25T19:43:45Z")
I hope these mysterious sightings do, in fact, turn out to be simply terrestrial vehicles or atmospheric illusions, rather than visiting aliens. Green alien chicks with big boobs and tentacles? Eww! ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/33 "2017-12-26T02:16:20Z")
My dad was driving in an unfamiliar town one dark night and saw a UFO that scared the everliving piss out of him. It was bright white and near-spherical, just floating there right over the horizon, hovering. Then he came around a bend and realized it was a water tower. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/34 "2017-12-26T06:07:18Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > My dad was driving in an unfamiliar town one dark night and saw a UFO that scared the everliving piss out of him. It was bright white and near-spherical, just floating there right over the horizon, hovering. Then he came around a bend and realized it was a water tower. :smack: 😛 That’s hilarious! In the early 1990s, I had a pen pal who had been in the military, and she said that when she saw a Harrier jet after it was declassified, she knew immediately that it accounted for a huge percentage of UFO sightings near military bases. She also said that years earlier, she and a friend had been driving from Terre Haute to Indianapolis at dusk on Memorial Day weekend, and they saw a cigar-shaped object floating in the sky. They were apprehensive enough to pull the car over, and at that point, it lit up and the word “GOODYEAR” appeared on its side. :o They resumed their journey and didn’t discuss it further. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/35 "2017-12-26T14:09:44Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > My dad was driving in an unfamiliar town one dark night and saw a UFO that scared the everliving piss out of him. It was bright white and near-spherical, just floating there right over the horizon, hovering. Then he came around a bend and realized it was a water tower. The one and only time I’ve had that alarmed feeling of something weird in the sky it was equally stupid. On a drizzly foggy night I stepped out of a suburban restaurant where I often ate dinner. And there in the indeterminate distance was a couple of slender lights almost touching at an odd angle just hanging there in space. WTF? Emotions sound the alarm, intellect says it’s nothing unusual, but what is it? Think think think. Looks nothing like an airplane. I try taking a step to each side and it appears to move with me. Whatever it is, it must be nearby! :eek: A moment later I recognize it. It was one of the parking lot lights on a tall pole. :smack: There are 15-20 of them in the parking lot, same as every other night I’d been there. It was just drizzly and foggy enough the pole and most of the fixture was hidden, so all I saw was the lamp. No sooner did I recognize it than suddenly I saw all the others. Somehow I’d fixated on just that one. Yup. An Unidentified Street Light. USL. I blame the margaritas; that place’s bartender was generous. ---
**Author:** ![TSBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@TSBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TSBG)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/36 "2017-12-26T18:16:30Z")
I would say equipment malfunction combined with tricks of perception. Ghosts used to be immaterial but corporeal-looking creatures. Now everybody’s got a cellphone camera and “orbs” are supernatural creatures, i.e. willingness to believe combined with a lens flaw or light trick. No ghosthunter ever tries to peddle a picture of Jacob Marley wearing the chains he forged in life. Anecdote: I worked on a ghosthunting pilot once. The ghosthunters were super excited because their E-meters or whatever we’re going crazy. I realized pretty quickly that I could goose the needles by keying my walkie talkie if things ever got slow. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2017, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686/37 "2017-12-26T19:13:56Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > I have no doubt that both actually believe in the value of this effort, and putting money into a UFO thank tank it is certainly no more wasteful than [burning up billions of dollars in Afghanistan for programs and infrastructure the Afghans can’t afford to maintain](https://projects.propublica.org/graphics/afghan) > > Stranger Wow. Thanks for the link, as depressing as it is. How could we be so short-sighted? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-going-on-with-ufos-in-the-ny-times-and-politico/804686.md?page=1)