# What Is Gopher (Internet) **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 6, 2012, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284 "2012-06-06T16:06:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![AndyLee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/898d66/32.png) [@AndyLee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AndyLee)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/1 "2012-06-06T16:06:48Z")
I looked it up on Wikipedia > **[Gopher (protocol)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gopher_(protocol))** > > The Gopher protocol (/ˈɡoʊfər/) is a communication protocol designed for distributing, searching, and retrieving documents in Internet Protocol networks. The design of the Gopher protocol and user interface is menu-driven, and presented an alternative to the World Wide Web in its early stages, but ultimately fell into disfavor, yielding to HTTP. The Gopher ecosystem is often regarded as the effective predecessor of the World Wide Web. > The Gopher protocol was invented by a team led by Mark P. M... It seems that it was a way to access text documents from one computer to another before the world wide web allowed pictures. Looking at the Wikipedia article I tried to DL a client to read them, but I can’t get it working right. So I thought I’d ask here for tips using Gopher. Is there anything left to see? Any info you would care to share I’d appreciate it. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/2 "2012-06-06T16:13:35Z")
> [@AndyLee](#): > > I looked it up on Wikipedia > > [Gopher (protocol) - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gopher_(protocol)) > > It seems that it was a way to access text documents from one computer to another before the world wide web allowed pictures. Pretty much. Although Gopher predates HTTP by a little bit. > [@](#): > > Looking at the Wikipedia article I tried to DL a client to read them, but I can’t get it working right. What doesn’t work? > [@](#): > > So I thought I’d ask here for tips using Gopher. Is there anything left to see? Any info you would care to share I’d appreciate it. Not really. There’s maybe a half dozen Gopher sites still sitting around because the cleaning lady hasn’t tripped over the power cable yet. I doubt you’d find anything interesting on them. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/3 "2012-06-06T16:50:28Z")
I think a regular browser will be able to access Gopher sites, if there are any still around. [No, scratch that, according to [Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gopher_%28protocol%29#Stagnation), none of the current major browsers does so natively, although it seems that there is a Firefox addon.] Certainly, back in the early days of the web, Netscape could access Gopher sites. The hard part will be finding any Gopher servers. Gopher was simply a text based menu system. Anything you could do with Gopher you could do as well, or better, with HTML, plus a whole lot more that Gopher could never do. There really were zero advantages to keeping it around after HTML was developed. (although Gopher itself was a fairly big advance in convenience over what people had to do before to access stuff on the Net, such as using [Archie](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archie_search_engine) and FTP). Despite that, according to [Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gopher_%28protocol%29#Stagnation), the number of Gopher servers out there has risen from a low of about 100 in 2007 to 160 now. It seems to be a nostalgia thing. (As some one who once used it, I don’t get the attraction.) ---
**Author:** ![Sofis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Sofis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sofis)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/4 "2012-06-06T16:51:56Z")
There’s a gopher proxy server [here](http://gopher.floodgap.com/gopher/). Mentioned on that page are also a number of gopher plugins for various browsers (all named some variant of Overbite). ---
**Author:** ![Kevbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e47774/32.png) [@Kevbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kevbo)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/5 "2012-06-06T16:55:26Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > There really were zero advantages to keeping it around after HTML was developed. Well, HTML is kind of useless until you have a browser! I for one recall using Gopher to download the first couple of copies of Mosaic that I installed. I think I may have had to first download the Gopher client via FTP…don’t actually recall doing that though. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/6 "2012-06-06T17:12:14Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > Despite that, according to [Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gopher_%28protocol%29#Stagnation), the number of Gopher servers out there has risen from a low of about 100 in 2007 to 160 now. It seems to be a nostalgia thing. (As some one who once used it, I don’t get the attraction.) I’m imagining various vinyl collectors using Gopher to keep track of their Victrola platters. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/7 "2012-06-06T17:32:38Z")
IIRC, Gopher could read HTML files. At least HTML as it was circa 2004. I used to use it from work to websurf so if the boss came up it would look like I was coding in a terminal. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/8 "2012-06-06T17:38:04Z")
**Simplicio** , you’re probably thinking of Lynx, not Gopher. Lynx is a browser; Gopher is a protocol. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/9 "2012-06-06T17:43:46Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > **Simplicio** , you’re probably thinking of Lynx, not Gopher. Lynx is a browser; Gopher is a protocol. Ah your right. I got my antiquated, animal named networking programs muddled. They should’ve named more of them after muppets to avoid confusion ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/10 "2012-06-06T19:13:38Z")
One of these days, someone is going to hit the internet way-back switch and you’ll wish you still had Gopher to kick around. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/11 "2012-06-06T19:37:50Z")
Imagine the Internet if it was entirely text-based and every single page was nothing but a bulleted list of other pages on that same server, and there was no search function, and everything was anime porn, bomb recipes, and CS400 course materials. That was Gopher. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/12 "2012-06-06T21:01:22Z")
I admit I don’t see the purpose of Gopher in a world that already had FTP. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/13 "2012-06-06T21:22:50Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > I admit I don’t see the purpose of Gopher in a world that already had FTP. It was menu-driven. With FTP you’d have to list out all the directories, choose the one you wanted, change into it, and list the contents of that subdirectory. Arguably, the real advantage of Gopher was that it tended to force people to curate the content into a more coherent tree structure of fewer nodes per level. Arguably. Then came hypertext, and the structure didn’t really matter anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/14 "2012-06-06T21:25:10Z")
> [@Cosmic Relief](#): > > Imagine the Internet if it was entirely text-based and every single page was nothing but a bulleted list of other pages on that same server, and there was no search function, and everything was anime porn, bomb recipes, and CS400 course materials. That was Gopher. You had CS400 course materials? Luxury! We had to cobble together our _own_ course materials out of ASCII art! And we _liked_ it! ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2012, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/15 "2012-06-06T21:33:48Z")
> [@Mr.Excellent](#): > > You had CS400 course materials? Well yes, but not for my university, and it was all written in Flemish. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/16 "2012-06-07T03:53:23Z")
> [@Cosmic Relief](#): > > It was menu-driven. With FTP you’d have to list out all the directories, choose the one you wanted, change into it, and list the contents of that subdirectory. Arguably, the real advantage of Gopher was that it tended to force people to curate the content into a more coherent tree structure of fewer nodes per level. Arguably. Then came hypertext, and the structure didn’t really matter anymore. I’m remembering the Info-Mac Digest. We got an email that listed all the newly submitted files and gave the FTP path to each. And you could open a text file in any major directory and read a comprehensive listing of what was in the archives. Seems like as long as you upload a table of contents sort of text file, FTP would be sufficient. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/17 "2012-06-07T04:38:12Z")
The main selling point for Mosaic and other early web browsers was that they could access everything on the Internet, from Gopher (which was fairly popular for a while), to email, to the brand-new Web protocol, from one graphical interface. (Or one textual interface, if you used Lynx.) One side-effect of this is that people began to send HTML documents over all of the protocols their browsers spoke, including in contexts where it’s frankly more trouble than it’s worth, like email. So Gopher sites _can_ be just as friendly and advanced as websites, but, in practice, people running Gopher sites now do it because they want to run them in the simple old-fashioned Gopher model. So, **AHunter3** , you _could_ make FTP sites as friendly as HTTP sites, but you’d waste a lot of resources on [the inherent crappiness of FTP as a protocol](http://mywiki.wooledge.org/FtpMustDie), which you cannot fix without making something that isn’t FTP. ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/18 "2012-06-07T05:40:05Z")
FTP also has a limit of not allowing search features inside the client. With Gopher you could search resources and see links to them within the gopher client without exiting the FTP client and telneting to an archie server. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/19 "2012-06-07T05:45:20Z")
> [@rat\_avatar](#): > > FTP also has a limit of not allowing search features inside the client. Not necessarily, although modern dedicated FTP clients don’t have search features. ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2012, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284/20 "2012-06-07T05:47:55Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > Not necessarily, although modern dedicated FTP clients don’t have search features. OK let us be more exact Server Side Search. I guess some FTP clients would grep through archie files. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-gopher-internet/624284.md?page=2)