# What is in the "unspecified document" that Trump and Kim signed? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 12, 2018, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949 "2018-06-12T06:49:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/21 "2018-06-12T21:09:46Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > If you’ve got nuclear weapons, the United States will back down, suck up to you, and stop trying to push you around. Nuclear weapons are vital for leverage. Huh, maybe Trudeau needs to get himself some Nukes. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/22 "2018-06-12T22:24:24Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The United States had a good-sized army and navy stationed in Japan, Guam, and the Aleutians, plus nuclear weapons, in 1949. But only a token force in Korea. > > The result was North Korea felt safe in invading South Korea and almost succeeded in overrunning the entire country before American troops could be brought in. > > Kim publicly wants to return to the situation that existed in 1949. We should be considering the possibility he secretly wants to return to the situation that existed in 1950. Yes, military occupation has worked well so far, let’s keep it going for another half century and check back in. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/23 "2018-06-12T22:27:20Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Huh, maybe Trudeau needs to get himself some Nukes. 😃 May, Macron & Merkel have nukes, but they didn’t get treated any better by Trump. I think you have to actually threaten to use it against the US to get any respect from Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/24 "2018-06-12T22:46:20Z")
**WillFarnaby** , what military occupation? ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/25 "2018-06-12T22:52:51Z")
They probably both agreed not to tamper with the [Risk board](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyNWVdExM24). ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/26 "2018-06-12T23:13:31Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > How the North Koreans see the situation: > > If you’ve got nuclear weapons, the United States will back down, suck up to you, and stop trying to push you around. Nuclear weapons are vital for leverage. Think the Iranians are taking notes? ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2018, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/27 "2018-06-12T23:27:54Z")
According to a news clip of a Trump speech I saw on TV tonight having nice beaches where condos might be built will also get you on a fast track to executive diplomacy. What a fucking disgrace. At the same news conference Trump admirably spoke of how “tough” Kim was. God damn I can only hope Republicans take an ass whooping in the midterms. I wish there was a party that could deliver one. ---
**Author:** ![DavidwithanR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@DavidwithanR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidwithanR)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/28 "2018-06-13T01:00:31Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > Think the Iranians are taking notes? Of course they are. Think Trump is thinking? Nope. ---
**Author:** ![DavidwithanR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@DavidwithanR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidwithanR)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/29 "2018-06-13T01:03:22Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > According to a news clip of a Trump speech I saw on TV tonight having nice beaches where condos might be built will also get you on a fast track to executive diplomacy. What a fucking disgrace. At the same news conference Trump admirably spoke of how “tough” Kim was. > God damn I can only hope Republicans take an ass whooping in the midterms. I wish there was a party that could deliver one. They absolutely are getting their asses whooped, right this very second, by the Workers’ Party of Korea. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/30 "2018-06-13T02:08:18Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The result was North Korea felt safe in invading South Korea and almost succeeded in overrunning the entire country before American troops could be brought in. It was the Chinese entry into the Korean war that resulted in the longest retreat of the US army far down into the south of Korea. My father fought and walked every mile of that retreat starting from close to the Yalu river. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/31 "2018-06-13T02:09:29Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > The art of the deal > > What Kim gets: > > • No more joint military exercises > • Increased status and legitimacy in North Korea > • Increased status and legitimacy internationally > > What Trump gets > > • Vague promises. > > How the North Koreans see the situation: > > If you’ve got nuclear weapons, the United States will back down, suck up to you, and stop trying to push you around. Nuclear weapons are vital for leverage. Great summary. Just to add that ripping up the substantive Iran deal shows how much the US follows up on nuclear agreements. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/32 "2018-06-13T13:26:31Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > **WillFarnaby** , what military occupation? Whatever you call the presence of US forces in South Korea, you’re apparently in favor of continuing it for another half century since it is working so well, correct? ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/33 "2018-06-14T03:36:30Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Whatever you call the presence of US forces in South Korea, you’re apparently in favor of continuing it for another half century since it is working so well, correct? Has the DPRK launched any further attacks on the ROK, with whom they are still at war? Yep. working quite well, actually. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/34 "2018-06-14T12:08:59Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > … I also note one interesting discrepancy in how the US and NK are discussing this: The US keeps talking about removing NK’s nuclear weapons, while NK always, _always_, refers to the “complete denuclearization of the Korean peninsula”. That would include US nukes. > > I’m betting that this will ultimately be the reason this process will fail. I watched an interview of some Trumpist (Giuliani, I think) who referred to the “North Korean peninsula.” :smack: So Thumpy has a ready-made excuse — Fox & Friends forgot to tell him the Peninsula extends into South Korea. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/35 "2018-06-14T12:21:47Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > “he declined to describe it, saying the details would be revealed later.” And five minutes later: > [@Smapti](#): > > [Here’s a photo.](http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnnnext/dam/assets/180612073059-trump-kim-summit-signing-document-full-169.jpg) Did the White House respond quickly to **Snowboarder Bo** ’s request for details? Or was this just Nitwit-in-Chief, incapable of even remembering the document he’d just signed, trying to add mystique to boilerplate already in the public record? And get a load of those signatures! Any graphologists in the house? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/36 "2018-06-14T12:35:08Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > And get a load of those signatures! Any graphologists in the house? “Humpty” and “Dumpty”. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/37 "2018-06-14T12:38:47Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Whatever you call the presence of US forces in South Korea, you’re apparently in favor of continuing it for another half century since it is working so well, correct? In what way has it failed? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/38 "2018-06-14T12:41:02Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > And get a load of those signatures! Any graphologists in the house? Kim used a Mont Blanc, Trump used a Sharpie. Interpret that as you wish. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/39 "2018-06-14T12:49:06Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Kim used a Mont Blanc, Trump used a Sharpie. Interpret that as you wish. A Sharpie leaves a bigger and wider line therefore it’s better. Plus it has the advantage of not poking eyes out. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949/40 "2018-06-14T14:02:58Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > I’m not sure what Mr. Kim envisions regarding “denuclearization”. After all, if the nukes we have aren’t in Korea, but are in Japan, or on Guam, or in the Aleutians, or, hell, on our substantial fleet, does it really matter? > [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > Denuclearization doesn’t equate to demilitarization. > Yet… :dubious: How many people here remember when [New Zealand declared themselves a nuclear-free zone?](https://nzhistory.govt.nz/page/uss-buchanan-refused-entry-new-zealand) This caused significant problems with their relationship with the US, because: > [@](#): > > New Zealand’s Labour government refused the USS Buchanan entry because the United States would neither confirm nor deny that the warship had nuclear capability. How would the US react to a NK demand that they allow NK inspectors onto every US ship that approaches Korea, so as to ensure that the US is meeting its obligations under the “Complete Denuclearization” agreement? There’s also the issue of how to use the weapons you have available. A cruise missile launched from SK is a different beast to an ICBM launched from somewhere in the Pacific. For one, China is much less likely to interpret the cruise missile as an attack on China. Do you really want to be in a situation where you have to worry about what China will decide in the next 15-30 minutes when you’re trying to nuke NK? > [@septimus](#): > > I watched an interview of some Trumpist (Giuliani, I think) who referred to the “North Korean peninsula.” :smack: So Thumpy has a ready-made excuse — Fox & Friends forgot to tell him the Peninsula extends into South Korea. I’m shocked, shocked, that Trump has an ignorant moron as an advisor. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-in-the-unspecified-document-that-trump-and-kim-signed/815949.md?page=3)