# What is it about the Catholic Priesthood that attracts so many pedophiles? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 21, 2010, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212 "2010-03-21T05:05:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/81 "2010-03-22T23:45:57Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > … maybe not being around women makes them more likely to molest children. They have just as much access, in the same situations, for the same reasons, to women as to kids. If they want women, they can get them just as easily as they could kids. Plain and simple, if they get kids, it’s because it’s kids they want. ---
**Author:** ![thirdwarning](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecccb3/32.png) [@thirdwarning](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thirdwarning)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/82 "2010-03-23T02:51:31Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > My apologies. I thought Methodist ministers were hired and fired by their congregations. I didn’t check that out, and I should have. I thought the congregataions were more independent – that it was more of a “ground up” authority structure than the RCC’s “top down” system. No problem. I just think that the RCC is not as different as it looks in a lot of ways. It’s just more single structure, so to speak, so it’s sometimes more visible. ---
**Author:** ![thirdwarning](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecccb3/32.png) [@thirdwarning](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thirdwarning)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/83 "2010-03-23T02:53:44Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > That may be true. It’s not entirely a bad thing – men who labor under the discipline of celibacy will no doubt find support in a community of men who share that life. I think it’s probably a very good thing for those for whom it works. Support from like-minded friends is almost always helpful. But it isn’t going to work for everyone. And I do think they need to take a better look at their priest candidates. Looking for support is one thing, trying to escape from themselves is another. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/84 "2010-03-23T02:57:49Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > They have just as much access, in the same situations, for the same reasons, to women as to kids. If they want women, they can get them just as easily as they could kids. Plain and simple, if they get kids, it’s because it’s kids they want. Well, right, I’m not really saying anything either way–I was just using those as examples for what people could mean in either explanation. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/85 "2010-03-23T07:26:06Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > I could buy the argument that a pedophile who normally keeps their urges under wraps might have a hard time doing it under times of stress. But I don’t think an otherwise normal person non pedophile who’s stressed out might think, “Hm, maybe groping a young girl would help.” Doesn’t compute. Nevertheless, that’s the data. Most likely the two factors that you’d see would be either inherent sociopathic tendencies or having himself been molested as a child and so have it registered as an outlet for frustration in his head. It’s very hard to say because there’s a motive for people to come up with excuses so as to get more favorable treatment, so you end up getting lots of people saying that they were raped as a child when quite possibly they’re just naturally amoral bastards. Some people just are _bad_ people. If they’re feeling cranky and they see someone who they think they can safely abuse, they’ll do it. That number just happens to appear to be a larger number than the number of people who desire underaged partners for sexual purposes to such a large extent as to actively live their life around it. It’s estimated that 0.6% to 1% of the population is clinically sociopathic. Assuming a fairly even spread among occupations, 0.6-1% of teachers will be sociopathic. An even greater amount will have some sort of sociopathic tendencies (i.e. non-clinically sociopathic). Do you have any particular reason to think that a sociopath wouldn’t take advantage of his students? ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/86 "2010-03-23T07:42:47Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > I could buy the argument that a pedophile who normally keeps their urges under wraps might have a hard time doing it under times of stress. But I don’t think an otherwise normal person non pedophile who’s stressed out might think, “Hm, maybe groping a young girl would help.” Doesn’t compute. Agreed 100%. The exact sentiment of my earlier post. Edit: Also, I love your username. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/87 "2010-03-23T08:56:04Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > Of course it doesn’t compute. This is blindingly obvious to nearly everyone. See, Sage Rat is merely raging against 😕, by making the argument that 😕, to prove 😕 to 😕. If you can’t think of any particular motive I might have, isn’t that sort of evidence that I don’t have one? > **[The Psychology of Sexual Orientation, Behavior, and Identity](https://books.google.com/books?id=5IdO6wisyUUC&lpg=PA357&dq=Howard%2BBarbaree%2Bpedophilia&pg=PA361&hl=en)** > > This comprehensive overview of research, issues, and theories relating to sexual orientation, behavior, and identity by experts in various disciplines is unique in providing both historical perspectives and a synthesis of the recent advances in... [http://books.google.com/books?id=RyMwvgB\_cgIC&lpg=PA60&dq=pedophilia%20situational&pg=PA61#v=onepage&q=&f=false](http://books.google.com/books?id=RyMwvgB_cgIC&lpg=PA60&dq=pedophilia%20situational&pg=PA61#v=onepage&q=&f=false) [http://books.google.com/books?id=rqsyiThQQrMC&pg=PA88&dq=pedophilia+situational&hl=en&ei=rH2oS6qeO4SotgP-3\_Bs&sa=X&oi=book\_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CEsQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=pedophilia%20situational&f=false](http://books.google.com/books?id=rqsyiThQQrMC&pg=PA88&dq=pedophilia+situational&hl=en&ei=rH2oS6qeO4SotgP-3_Bs&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CEsQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=pedophilia%20situational&f=false) [http://books.google.com/books?id=uea7nHelctIC&pg=PA15&dq=pedophilia+situational&hl=en&ei=rH2oS6qeO4SotgP-3\_Bs&sa=X&oi=book\_result&ct=result&resnum=10&ved=0CGIQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=pedophilia%20situational&f=false](http://books.google.com/books?id=uea7nHelctIC&pg=PA15&dq=pedophilia+situational&hl=en&ei=rH2oS6qeO4SotgP-3_Bs&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=10&ved=0CGIQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=pedophilia%20situational&f=false) ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/88 "2010-03-23T10:55:17Z")
> [@thirdwarning](#): > > I think it’s probably a very good thing for those for whom it works. Support from like-minded friends is almost always helpful. But it isn’t going to work for everyone. And I do think they need to take a better look at their priest candidates. Looking for support is one thing, trying to escape from themselves is another. Absolutely. And I think it would be interesting, and perhaps instructive, for the Church to take a look at the various orders of priests (not talking about parish priests here, but rather priests who live in community, like, for example, Jesuits or Franciscans). Many of the orders run large educational institutions (I went to Jesuit school myself) and have at least equal access to young boys and girls as do parish priests. But I think the incidence of accusations of sexual abuse is lower among the orders. Could that be because the men live in a supportive community, rather than on their own or with just one or two other men, like parish priests? It’s also true that some of the orders are much more selective about who can join (the Jesuits particularly so). ---
**Author:** ![martu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@martu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/martu)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/89 "2010-03-23T14:39:27Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > Actually, the Pope just apologized on Friday to Irish Catholics: > > [Pastoral Letter of His Holiness Benedict XVI to the Catholics of Ireland (March 19, 2010)](http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/letters/2010/documents/hf_ben-xvi_let_20100319_church-ireland_en.html?hpid=topnews) Not being a religious person myself I’m having trouble with this ‘apology’ specifically: [QUOTE=The Pope] I recognize how difficult it was to grasp the extent and complexity of the problem, to obtain reliable information and to make the right decisions in the light of conflicting expert advice. [/QUOTE] What were the difficulties involved in grasping the fact that molesting children is wrong and that any person, priest or not, that does such a thing should be in jail? What am I missing here? ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/90 "2010-03-23T14:57:52Z")
> [@martu](#): > > Not being a religious person myself I’m having trouble with this ‘apology’ specifically: > > What were the difficulties involved in grasping the fact that molesting children is wrong and that any person, priest or not, that does such a thing should be in jail? What am I missing here? At least he is offering some concrete solutions. > [@](#): > > 1. I now wish to propose to you some concrete initiatives to address the situation. > > At the conclusion of my meeting with the Irish bishops, I asked that Lent this year be set aside as a time to pray for an outpouring of God’s mercy and the Holy Spirit’s gifts of holiness and strength upon the Church in your country. I now invite all of you to devote your Friday penances, for a period of one year, between now and Easter 2011, to this intention. I ask you to offer up your fasting, your prayer, your reading of Scripture and your works of mercy in order to obtain the grace of healing and renewal for the Church in Ireland. I encourage you to discover anew the sacrament of Reconciliation and to avail yourselves more frequently of the transforming power of its grace. > > Particular attention should also be given to Eucharistic adoration, and in every diocese there should be churches or chapels specifically devoted to this purpose. I ask parishes, seminaries, religious houses and monasteries to organize periods of Eucharistic adoration, so that all have an opportunity to take part. Through intense prayer before the real presence of the Lord, you can make reparation for the sins of abuse that have done so much harm, at the same time imploring the grace of renewed strength and a deeper sense of mission on the part of all bishops, priests, religious and lay faithful. Yea - more Sky Fairy Mumbo-Jumbo. That’ll do the trick. ---
**Author:** ![Cumberdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8c91f0/32.png) [@Cumberdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumberdale)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/91 "2010-03-23T15:04:41Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > At least he is offering some concrete solutions. > > Yea - more Sky Fairy Mumbo-Jumbo. That’ll do the trick. What he needs to do is step down because he is responsible for covering up and moving child rapists around so they could destroy as many lives as possible. After that he needs to turn himself into the police and thrown in prison where hopefully karma will deal with that vile piece of garbage. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/92 "2010-03-23T15:11:45Z")
> [@Cumberdale](#): > > What he needs to do is step down because he is responsible for covering up and moving child rapists around so they could destroy as many lives as possible. After that he needs to turn himself into the police and thrown in prison where hopefully karma will deal with that vile piece of garbage. Quite. He and the RC have been aiding and abetting child abuse for decades. The RC is guilty of institutionalised child abuse. His ‘apology’ even manages to blame Vatican II as if that in some way made the whole ‘Abusing kiddies - right or wrong?’ question obscure. And still no word on co-operating with the Irish Inquiry. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/93 "2010-03-23T15:57:21Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Nevertheless, that’s the data. Most likely the two factors that you’d see would be either inherent sociopathic tendencies or having himself been molested as a child and so have it registered as an outlet for frustration in his head. It’s very hard to say because there’s a motive for people to come up with excuses so as to get more favorable treatment, so you end up getting lots of people saying that they were raped as a child when quite possibly they’re just naturally amoral bastards. But couldn’t, “I’m really stressed out” be just as much an excuse? Pedophiles and predators do tend to be very self justifying. It seems to me that that could be a justification. Like, “I"m not really attracted to kids, I was just having a bad day at work…” ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/94 "2010-03-23T16:19:58Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > And still no word on co-operating with the Irish Inquiry. There’s this: > [@](#): > > Nevertheless, it must be admitted that grave errors of judgement were made and failures of leadership occurred. All this has seriously undermined your credibility and effectiveness. I appreciate the efforts you have made to remedy past mistakes and to guarantee that they do not happen again. Besides fully implementing the norms of canon law in addressing cases of child abuse, continue to cooperate with the civil authorities in their area of competence. Clearly, religious superiors should do likewise. ie. The Catholic hierarchy in Ireland is at fault for letting this thing go on, and they should cooperate with civil authorities. ---
**Author:** ![thirdwarning](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecccb3/32.png) [@thirdwarning](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thirdwarning)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/95 "2010-03-23T17:35:31Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > But I think the incidence of accusations of sexual abuse is lower among the orders. Could that be because the men live in a supportive community, rather than on their own or with just one or two other men, like parish priests? Just speculating here, obviously, but I’m wondering if that also could come from greater accountability, in the group setting, and less of the feeling of being set apart and special that seems to go along with being a parish priest sometimes. It’s harder to think you deserve what you want when all your compatriots are just like you and you’re not the one everybody looks to. Might it help, do you think, if priests were re-assigned more frequently? Or if they had somewhat regular assignments to a group setting? Say, four years or so in a parish and then six months with the Order, or some such as that. It seems to me that serving a parish could be pretty isolating. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/96 "2010-03-23T19:53:57Z")
> [@thirdwarning](#): > > Just speculating here, obviously, but I’m wondering if that also could come from greater accountability, in the group setting, and less of the feeling of being set apart and special that seems to go along with being a parish priest sometimes. It’s harder to think you deserve what you want when all your compatriots are just like you and you’re not the one everybody looks to. > > Might it help, do you think, if priests were re-assigned more frequently? Or if they had somewhat regular assignments to a group setting? Say, four years or so in a parish and then six months with the Order, or some such as that. It seems to me that serving a parish could be pretty isolating. I don’t know. It might help, I guess, but I don’t see how the Church could rotate people in and out of religious orders – it just doesn’t work that way. Yes, serving a parish can be isolating, especially today, when so many parishes have only one priest. I think of all the Jesuits I knew who lived in a group in the city where they worked, and they were going home at the end of the day (typically teaching), to what was essentially a dorm, with people around, and perhaps a communal dinner, certainly a bit of free time to talk and just hang out, and then I think of the parish priest, who’s often just rattling around in a big old empty rectory. That kind of isolation can’t be good. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/97 "2010-03-23T23:38:49Z")
> [@martu](#): > > What were the difficulties involved in grasping the fact that molesting children is wrong and that any person, priest or not, that does such a thing should be in jail? What am I missing here? A great deal. For a start did he say that molesting children wasn’t wrong? I doubt it. For every complex problem there is someone who thinks strawmanning and simplistic ranting is a solution. ---
**Author:** ![Caveat\_lector\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@Caveat\_lector\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caveat_lector_1)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2010, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/98 "2010-03-23T23:59:20Z")
> [@thirdwarning](#): > > I think it’s probably a very good thing for those for whom it works. Support from like-minded friends is almost always helpful. But it isn’t going to work for everyone. And I do think they need to take a better look at their priest candidates. Looking for support is one thing, trying to escape from themselves is another. I can’t speak for every diocese or seminary, but the only way the Church could have scrutinized me more to have interviewed all my relations. I had a psychological evaluation, multiple interviews by both the diocese and the seminary, two background checks, and then there would have been further six years of observation and reviews during my seminary formation. I only stayed for a year and a half (I liked seminary, but it just wasn’t my calling), but I was evaluated at least half a dozen times. In fact the knowledge that we were under constant scrutiny was a little stressful. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2010, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/99 "2010-03-24T00:11:16Z")
> [@fubbleskag](#): > > Hard to say: it’s either the altar boys or the communion wafers. “You’ll come for the communion wafers, you’ll stay for the altar boys” was a popular priest recruitment slogan for a while. Sounded much better in Latin though. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Fight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/90ced4/32.png) [@Cat\_Fight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Fight)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2010, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212/100 "2010-03-24T03:17:33Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > But couldn’t, “I’m really stressed out” be just as much an excuse? Pedophiles and predators do tend to be very self justifying. It seems to me that that could be a justification. Like, “I"m not really attracted to kids, I was just having a bad day at work…” Or, just as likely, ‘I was seduced by a wicked child!’ Of course, this doesn’t work quite as well when the child is a boy. Which may explain why, as in several cases including those in the aforementioned documentary _Deliver Us From Evil_, molesting girls was often overlooked, but molesting boys got, well, got them moved to another town. So almost overlooked. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-it-about-the-catholic-priesthood-that-attracts-so-many-pedophiles/533212.md?page=6)