# What is life like in the Federation from Star Trek? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 14, 2014, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112 "2014-04-14T21:02:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2014, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/101 "2014-04-27T15:08:44Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > In the animated episode with Robert T April, he and his wife refuse the opportunity to rejuvenate themselves after they’ve restored the _Enterprise_ crew to their proper ages, all on the grounds that “We’ve lived a good life; we don’t need to repeat it,” or words to that effect. He’s offered a chance like that, and he turns it down? For both himself and his wife? And she doesn’t object in the slightest? Holy crap, we’re talkin’ some real moral high ground here! :eek: Did Roddenberry have anything to do with the animated series? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2014, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/102 "2014-04-27T15:18:37Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Did Roddenberry have anything to do with the animated series? Good question. I don’t know that it’s ever been dealt with in detail, but there are some interesting quotes here: > **[Star Trek canon](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek_canon)** > > The Star Trek canon is the set of all material taking place within the Star Trek universe that is considered official. The definition and scope of the Star Trek canon has changed over time. Until late 2006, it was mainly composed of the live-action television series and films before becoming a more vague and abstract concept. From 2010 until 2023, the official Star Trek website's site map described their database, which listed both animated and live-action series and films as its sources, a Al... So many of the original writers worked on the animated series under Dorothy’s direction, does it really matter? Those two short seasons beat the hell out of _ **TOS** _’s third! ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2014, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/103 "2014-04-27T19:35:27Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Most Earthlings probably have a pretty decent standard of living. Any issues related to pollution, food, environment, housing can be managed by technology. There are still hierarchies and different social classes. If you did absolutely nothing in life, you would probably still end up with what we consider a decent apartment in some [arcology mega-structure in the middle of Iowa](http://onceuponageek.com/images/star_trek_03.jpg). A famous starship captain OTOH, might have a [sweet apartment in San Francisco with bayside views](http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090525035513/memoryalpha/en/images/a/a4/Kirk's_apartment.jpg). As prime locations (and certain other resources) would still be scarce in the future, there would still be some form of currency or economy. Maybe one amasses “credits” for various accomplishments on behalf of humanity whenever you save the Earth from invasion or cure some retrovirus. People obviously still have jobs in the future and they aren’t all aligning warp cores on starships. My sense is that a lot of service jobs like running the Picard family vineyard or tending bar on 10-Forward are more like hobbies than based on any real economic need. Sounds close to what James Corey proposed in “Caliban’s War” a novel set mostly in space, but Earth has a post-scarcity society. If you don’t want to work at all you get “basic” which covers your food, clothing, housing, communications in a non-luxurious sort of way. If you want to work you need advanced education. And in order to prove you WILL work once you have that advanced education, you have to spend a year or two amassing “work credit” doing menial jobs like waiting tables, etc. Once you have amassed enough work credits, then you can study advanced topics … at no charge … and go on to do interesting work. A very ingenious approach to handling menial labor in a post-scarcity society, I think. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2014, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/104 "2014-04-27T22:44:55Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > (b) In the animated episode with Robert T April, he and his wife refuse the opportunity to rejuvenate themselves after they’ve restored the _Enterprise_ crew to their proper ages, all on the grounds that “We’ve lived a good life; we don’t need to repeat it,” or words to that effect. He’s offered a chance like that, and he turns it down? For both himself and his wife? And she doesn’t object in the slightest? Holy crap, we’re talkin’ some real moral high ground here! :eek: One of Roddenberry’s edicts about the (TNG-era) Federation was apparently that people didn’t mourn or fear death—it was accepted as a “natural part of life.” This was used to quash a script submission (By future writer Ron Moore, no less!) about a newly orphaned little boy on the _Enterprise_ who was found to be spending all his time on the Holodeck with a simulated version of his dead mother. The script was later reworked into “The Bonding,” with the efforts of lead writer Michael Piller—perhaps it’s just as telling about Roddenberry’s mindset about his Perfect 24th Century Humans that he wouldn’t even go for a story about them treating holo-grieving as an _unhealthy problem_ once they’d found someone doing it! Even worse is the crew’s attitude in the first season episode, “The Neutral Zone,” in which several 20th century humans are found frozen on a Cryonics satellite, and revived. As the command staff’s briefing went— > [@](#): > > PICARD: So what’s their condition? > CRUSHER: Right now, they are all sleeping. Each of them needed minor medical attention. Minor now, but then their conditions were obviously terminal. One had a heart problem, another had an advanced case of emphysema with extensive liver damage. You know the most surprising thing of all, is that each of them had been frozen after they died. > PICARD: After they died? > CRUSHER: Cryonics. It was a kind of fad in the late twentieth century. People feared dying. It terrified them. At the moment of death, they would be frozen, so that later, some time in the future, when presumably medical science had a cure for whatever killed them, they could be thawed back to life, healed, and sent on about their business. In other words, their immature, fearful attitude towards defeating their own mortality with technology…_worked perfectly_. Their fatal maladies are now cured, and they’re free to “go about their business.” One of them was an artist. Another was a woman still of (unaided, 21st century) child-bearing age. The [_oldest_ survivor](http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Ralph_Offenhouse) was only 55—given the [extended](http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Felisa_Howard) [lifespans](http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Leonard_McCoy) we’ve seen in other humans in the 24th century, even _that_ man could live a hundred years more! It’s tempting to suppose that this attitude against “heroic” life-extending measures might be some kind of [insidious social-engineering plot](http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Section_31) to keep a decadent, unproductive human population down to a maintainable level—but personally, I don’t think any human society _needs_ a conspiracy to keep doing some damnfool practice or attitude, long after the point where it might have been genuinely useful. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/105 "2014-04-28T04:14:37Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > …I have to think post-Eugenics war, Federation society is a bit leery about too much generic modification… Indeed it is, as seen by what happened to Dr. Bashir’s dad on DS9: [Richard Bashir | Memory Alpha | Fandom](http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Richard_Bashir) ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/106 "2014-04-28T06:33:48Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > Even worse is the crew’s attitude in the first season episode, “The Neutral Zone,” in which several 20th century humans are found frozen on a Cryonics satellite, and revived. What pissed me off the most during the first season was Picard basically ordering Riker not to revive a child who had been killed moments before, after he had been given such power by Q. He then says something like “Thank heaven you didn’t revive her!” Pontificating asshole! You can use every means at your disposal to try and revive your dead Security Officer, who was all but begging to get zapped, but not a little girl who died in an accident? If I had been there with a phaser, I’d’ve blown him away point-blank! ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/107 "2014-04-28T06:40:37Z")
I also fail to find anything admirable (or healthy) about someone (or some society) that _doesn’t_ fear death. That’s … just … plain … crazy! What degree of societal control is required to brainwash people to that extent?!? ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/108 "2014-04-28T06:48:49Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > I also fail to find anything admirable (or healthy) about someone (or some society) that _doesn’t_ fear death. That’s … just … plain … crazy! What degree of societal control is required to brainwash people to that extent?!? Well I don’t know anyone who fears death at the end of the human lifespan, terrified of dieing at 85 for example. But yea a society that doesn’t fear premature death is kind of creepy. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 10:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/109 "2014-04-28T10:19:13Z")
> [@grude](#): > > Well I don’t know anyone who fears death at the end of the human lifespan, terrified of dieing at 85 for example. That would depend on your state of health, and a number of other factors, I imagine. I can understand someone suffering from a terminal disease, or just a generally shitty life, welcoming death at any age. But to not have any trepidation _at all_ is weird. Why bother saving anyone from death if it’s not to be feared? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/110 "2014-04-28T10:32:40Z")
Also, I have no particular desire to die at age 85, though I realize it’s pointless to worry about it. When your time comes, it comes. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/111 "2014-04-28T11:44:23Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > Sounds close to what James Corey proposed in “Caliban’s War” a novel set mostly in space, but Earth has a post-scarcity society. If you don’t want to work at all you get “basic” which covers your food, clothing, housing, communications in a non-luxurious sort of way. If you want to work you need advanced education. And in order to prove you WILL work once you have that advanced education, you have to spend a year or two amassing “work credit” doing menial jobs like waiting tables, etc. Once you have amassed enough work credits, then you can study advanced topics … at no charge … and go on to do interesting work. A very ingenious approach to handling menial labor in a post-scarcity society, I think. Sounds to me like Corey never realized there’s people who actually like menial work (I promise there are). ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/112 "2014-04-28T15:01:13Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Sounds to me like Corey never realized there’s people who actually like menial work (I promise there are). Corey didn’t address it in the novel, but I’m sure that anyone who wanted to do menial work could get credit for it and live a more lavish lifestyle than those who do basic. The part where they (Corey is actually a pseudonym used by two collaborating writers) explained how education worked was just a little side note in the book, a couple of sentences in one paragraph, as a barista explains to a space marine why she works. I’m sure the idea could be fleshed out more. My thought when I read it was that there was, even in an automated future, probably a lot more menial work than university students spending a year or two prepping for work could handle. So your idea might flesh things out. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/113 "2014-04-28T15:03:35Z")
In the Federation, doctors can fix almost **anything.** In fact, in _TNG,_ I don’t even recall seeing any fat people. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/114 "2014-04-28T16:07:45Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > In the Federation, doctors can fix almost **anything.** > > In fact, in _TNG,_ I don’t even recall seeing any fat people. Or any ugly ones either. But they’re seldom shown on TV anyhow. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/115 "2014-04-28T17:00:11Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > In the Federation, doctors can fix almost **anything.** > > In fact, in _TNG,_ I don’t even recall seeing any fat people. Brainwashing, again: love of excercise and other healthy habits. No smoking, for example. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2014, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112/116 "2014-04-28T17:15:44Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > That would depend on your state of health, and a number of other factors, I imagine. I can understand someone suffering from a terminal disease, or just a generally shitty life, welcoming death at any age. But to not have any trepidation _at all_ is weird. Why bother saving anyone from death if it’s not to be feared? [Seems like they have a lot of shit to worry about dying from in the future.](http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Category:Medical_conditions) I would assume that premature death on Earth is a fairly rare phenomenon. Not just because of great futuristic health care. There’s no extreme weather. Presumably no other natural disasters. I would even assume accidents of any kind (other than those involving a transporter) are pretty rare. Probably not a lot of murders either due to the fact that it would be nearly impossible to get away with it, given the level of surveillance and forensic technology. Really, unless you entered into a high-risk profession like Starfleet Security, the expectation is you will probably live until whatever age Federation folk typically live until. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-life-like-in-the-federation-from-star-trek/686112.md?page=5)