# What is perfect pitch? Also unsingable words? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 26, 2003, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607 "2003-10-26T03:20:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Asympotically\_fat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e47c2d/32.png) [@Asympotically\_fat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asympotically_fat)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2013, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/21 "2013-11-14T01:08:11Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Last time my spouse was tested he was consistently accurate to 1 hertz. Which would be within about 6-7 cents of middle C and also means I probably have better absolute pitch than I thought, though still a way from perfect pitch. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2013, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/22 "2013-11-14T06:20:32Z")
> [@Floater](#): > > If by “symphonies” you mean “symphony orchestras”, no they don’t. The pitch is usually higher than 440 and if they use a piano it is also tuned accordingly. Cite. ETA: ? ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2013, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/23 "2013-11-14T09:28:51Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > Cite. > ETA: ? Musician friends, newspaper articles, radio programs, [Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concert_pitch). You will have to take my word for it. The pitch used to be way below 440 a couple of hundred years ago and has crept higher and higher since then. One problem with this are instruments that can’t be tuned, like xylophones, marimbas and such. If it’s only a matter of two-three Hz it’s no problem, but if it’s more than that the orchestras have to buy instruments with a higher pitch and they’re not cheap. This is also a problem for singers who have to strain their voices to reach the higher tones. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2013, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/24 "2013-11-14T14:42:27Z")
Doesn’t everyone in an orchestra tune to match the untunable instruments? ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2013, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/25 "2013-11-14T14:56:07Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Doesn’t everyone in an orchestra tune to match the untunable instruments? No, they tune to the pitch the conductor wants and, as I wrote, the audience won’t notice if they are not too many Hz off. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2013, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/26 "2013-11-14T17:28:52Z")
You know about the singer who was so flat she threw the piano out of tune… Just to be clear, pitch did not increase as some lockstep march. High pitch organs (hence everyone else) were all over the place simultaneously, by locality and organ style. In addition, wind players of all persuasions (despite the clarion oboe) tune a little low and blow a teeny tiny tad harder at the beginning of the concert, monitoring how their instruments expand as they heat up, and even the air temperature of the venue, which also messes with the pitch. People, and the subset of performing musicians, take this quite seriously, huh? /not sarcasm ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2013, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/27 "2013-11-14T18:33:38Z")
> [@xnylder](#): > > _Ch-ch-ch-Changes (turn and face the stranger) > Ch-Ch-Changes > Don’t want to be a richer man…_ > > David Bowie, Changes “Turn and face the stranger”? I’m giggling like crazy right now. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2013, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/28 "2013-11-14T18:38:53Z")
> [@Floater](#): > > This is also a problem for singers who have to strain their voices to reach the higher tones. If my math is right, between A440 and A444 that’s only a raise of about 16 cents (with 100 cents being a half step). Does that very slight raise in pitch really make that much difference to a singer? I mean, I guess if you’re operating at the very edge of your limits, but it still seems surprising. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2013, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/29 "2013-11-14T23:42:33Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > If my math is right, between A440 and A444 that’s only a raise of about 16 cents (with 100 cents being a half step). Does that very slight raise in pitch really make that much difference to a singer? I mean, I guess if you’re operating at the very edge of your limits, but it still seems surprising. _…vor Gott…_ You try that in the Ninth and be ethereal for a good while. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2013, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/30 "2013-11-15T00:13:28Z")
> [@Floater](#): > > No, they tune to the pitch the conductor wants and, as I wrote, the audience won’t notice if they are not too many Hz off. And the good conductor picks the pitch of the untunable instruments. “The audience won’t notice” is a horrible standard, and no conductor I’ve ever worked with thinks that’s okay. ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2013, 8:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/31 "2013-11-15T08:22:46Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > And the good conductor picks the pitch of the untunable instruments. “The audience won’t notice” is a horrible standard, and no conductor I’ve ever worked with thinks that’s okay. As I have stated over and over again: NO. Read the Wikipedia article I linked to earlier. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2013, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/32 "2013-11-15T14:35:04Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > And the good conductor picks the pitch of the untunable instruments. “The audience won’t notice” is a horrible standard, and no conductor I’ve ever worked with thinks that’s okay. > [@Floater](#): > > As I have stated over and over again: NO. Read the Wikipedia article I linked to earlier. Perhaps you two have different ideas on what makes a good conductor, but really neither you or Wiki contributors can deny **BigT** ’s history, save those who were there, his intimates, and confessors. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2013, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/33 "2013-11-15T16:33:21Z")
> [@CookingWithGas](#): > > K-K-K-K-K-K-Katmandu > > –Bob Seger > > T-t-t-t-t-they say the heart of rock & roll is still beatin’ > > –Huey Lewis and The News B-b-b-baby… — (many examples) P-p-p-p-p-Papageno… (the implication of the stutter) —Wolfgang Mozart S-s-s-s… — (isn’t this from the middle of some Billy Joel song?) ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2013, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/34 "2013-11-15T16:39:23Z")
K-K-K-Katie, beautiful Katie, you’re the only w-w-w-one that I adore… …You tell her, you t-t-t-tell her, 'c-'c-'cause I stutter too much. ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2013, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607/35 "2013-11-15T16:57:03Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > Cite. > ETA: ? Just as a point of data, the St. Louis Symphony tunes to 442. (I know this by association with people who work for the symphony, and as a member of the symphony chorus.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-perfect-pitch-also-unsingable-words/209607.md?page=1)