# What is "personal insurance" in England? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 23, 2013, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697 "2013-03-23T00:05:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/1 "2013-03-23T00:05:05Z")
Background: I am thinking about doing the [Cotswold Way Challenge](http://www.100milerun.com/cotswold-way-challenge/thegallery/), a 100 mile, 4-day run/hike across the Cotswold Way. I have never been to England or Europe but when I do, the two things on my agenda are to see the Prado and to see some English countryside, preferably at a more than 5 mile a day pace, and the pace of that run is _almost_ perfect even though I’d prefer 15-20 miles a day rather than 25. However, the [terms and conditions](http://www.100milerun.com/terms-and-conditions/) mention that > [@](#): > > Each Participant is responsible for taking out any applicable or suitable personal insurance cover for his participation in the Event, and he shall provide a copy of his insurance certificate to the Organiser if requested. I can’t find any definition for “personal insurance” in England other than the one we use over here in America, namely, insurance for an individual such as health or life. I have already emailed the race organizer asking what would be considered “suitable insurance”, but is there a definition that people use in England that I am not getting? I’d shrug it off as liability disclaimer boilerplate except for the fact that they say they might be checking insurance cards! ---
**Author:** ![Filbert](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/filbert/32/3433_2.png) [@Filbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Filbert)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/2 "2013-03-23T00:18:51Z")
It looks like it is just them using a generic sports event form- it mentions complying with speed limits, and adhering to the Highway Code a few paragraphs further on, which generally aren’t relevant for those running… ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/3 "2013-03-23T00:29:06Z")
Disclaimer: I have no type of insurance, except for travel abroad. It sounds to me like accident insurance. As presumably a US citizen, you would not be covered by the NHS or EU medical cards entitling you to free treatment – although the NHS would definitely treat you in an emergency, they would later demand costs. Travel insurance covering medical treatment must be available from your travel agent, or bought off the internet, or from American Express etc. etc.; but it may be covered by your existing insurance if you enquire for temporary travel insurance for the weeks you are away. Same as with car insurance when driving abroad. You pay more for a temporary extension. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/4 "2013-03-23T03:02:22Z")
> [@Claverhouse](#): > > Same as with car insurance when driving abroad. You pay more for a temporary extension. This one may be obtainable with the car - in many locations the main “object” of the insurance is the car, not the driver (you insure the car for one or more drivers, not the driver for one or more cars); compulsory insurance will come with the rental, increased coverage will cost more. What will not be covered by the kind of insurance you get from a rental company is insurance/lawyers’ services in case of tickets. It’s best to check ahead what will be covered by any insurance that comes with the car, to avoid double-payment. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/5 "2013-03-23T21:45:52Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > I can’t find any definition for “personal insurance” in England other than the one we use over here in America, namely, insurance for an individual such as health or life. It’s personal accident insurance. Basically, short term disability coverage. ---
**Author:** ![si\_blakely](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@si\_blakely](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/si_blakely)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2013, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/6 "2013-03-23T23:33:50Z")
Additional to the above - your insurance needs to specifically cover an extreme event like the one you are planning to enter (in the same way that winter sports cover is a seperate premium on travel insurance). You need to ensure your insurer know what you are about to attempt so they can adjust the risk factors and get the premium right. Otherwise your claim could be denied. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/7 "2013-03-24T08:14:35Z")
As a Brit (but with no specialist knowledge) I agree it’s just accident insurance, for if you fall and break a leg or something. I also agree it’s a boilerplate - basically, the event organisers want to ensure that you won’t sue them if you have an accident that harms you. It’s fairly common for such policies to be provided automatically by large employers for if you have an accident at work, for example, and the ones I have seen are for lump sum compensation-type payouts - £2,000 if you lose a finger, £10,000 for a thumb (those opposable thumbs are important!), £50,000 for total loss of eyesight - that sort of thing. Now, if I were taking on this race, to be honest I don’t think I’d take out any special insurance. But that’s because I am entitled to free NHS medical care as a UK resident, and I have other insurances already arranged (although I doubt I have anything that would cover one of the examples I mentioned above, unless it happened on work time - I’m not sure). I also wouldn’t sue the organisers if I had such an accident, and if I tried I’m sure they would say “we told you that you had to be insured, and you weren’t, so you’re SOOL.” If I were competing in such an event in another country where I would not be entitled to free medical care, I would do what others have said and make sure it was covered by the travel insurance for the trip, or arrange insurance specifically for the event if necessary. Final thought - the fact that the terms say “if requested” suggests to me that it is highly unlikely they will make a check on the insurance. If they said “must be presented on entry” or something, that would be different. On the other hand, it would be a shame to make all the effort to get there and then have your particpation withdrawn by a random spot-check… ---
**Author:** ![blindboyard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindboyard/32/2833_2.png) [@blindboyard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blindboyard)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/8 "2013-03-24T11:49:13Z")
I’m pretty sure the NHS doesn’t try to charge people for treatment for accidents if they’re in the country legally. I think theu’re just saying that if you die theyu won’t be paying out. ---
**Author:** ![Charley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/97f17d/32.png) [@Charley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charley)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/9 "2013-03-24T13:16:39Z")
It depends - they don’t charge for the accident/emergency care, but if the person was admitted to hospital they’d charge for that. For the OP, I agree that the general requirement is to have some sort of personal accident coverage. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/10 "2013-03-25T12:03:25Z")
You just need to get travel insurance that covers your event, because it might not be included under all travel insurance (but it might be - you just need to check and be upfront with the insurance company). There’s no specific thing known as “personal insurance” in the UK, which I think was your quite reasonable question. They just mean insurance that is arranged and paid for by you. If they’d just said “insurance” some people might think the event organisers offer insurance themselves, as some do. > [@blindboyard](#): > > I’m pretty sure the NHS doesn’t try to charge people for treatment for accidents if they’re in the country legally. I think theu’re just saying that if you die theyu won’t be paying out. It does. It bills the person’s US insurance company later on. If they’ve provided the details, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/11 "2013-03-25T13:05:35Z")
> [@Charley](#): > > It depends - they don’t charge for the accident/emergency care, but if the person was admitted to hospital they’d charge for that. They _will_ charge for accident/emergency care for a non-covered patient. They just don’t do it up front. ---
**Author:** ![Charley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/97f17d/32.png) [@Charley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charley)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/12 "2013-03-25T16:04:12Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > They _will_ charge for accident/emergency care for a non-covered patient. They just don’t do it up front. They’re not supposed to: [section 6](http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2011/1556/made). ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/13 "2013-03-25T16:34:22Z")
> [@Charley](#): > > They’re not supposed to: [section 6](http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2011/1556/made). Which part of that act says so? I couldn’t find it. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/14 "2013-03-25T16:45:12Z")
It’s under Part 3: > [@](#): > > Services exempted from charges > > 1. No charge may be made or recovered in respect of any relevant services provided to an overseas visitor which fall within the following paragraphs— > > (a)accident and emergency services, whether provided at a hospital accident and emergency department, a minor injuries unit, a walk-in centre or elsewhere, but not including any services provided— > > (i)after the overseas visitor has been accepted as an in-patient; or > > (ii)at an outpatient appointment; > > (b)services otherwise than at, or by staff employed to work at, or under the direction of, a hospital(6); > > (c)family planning services; > > (d)treatment in respect of a disease listed in Schedule 1; > > (e)treatment for sexually transmitted infections, but in the case of services which relate to infection with Human Immunodeficiency Virus, only to the extent that they consist of a diagnostic test for evidence of infection with the Virus and counselling associated with that test or its result; > > (f)services provided to an overseas visitor who is liable to be detained in a hospital or, received into guardianship under the Mental Health Act 1983(7) “(the 1983 Act)” or any other enactment authorising detention in a hospital by reason of mental disorder, or subject to a community treatment order under the 1983 Act(8); > > (g)treatment which is provided in circumstances where— > > (i)a requirement to submit to the form of treatment concerned is imposed by, or included in, an order of a court; and > > (ii)paragraph (f) does not apply. Thanks for the correction, **Charley**. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/15 "2013-03-25T16:57:57Z")
Hmm. I think that may not be true if said overseas visitor has travel insurance. After all, if you have private health insurance in the Uk, or your visit is covered under some other insurance (like driving), they will also try to recover the costs from them. It’s just that you’re never going to personally billed. ---
**Author:** ![mascaroni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dc4da7/32.png) [@mascaroni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mascaroni)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/16 "2013-03-25T19:53:12Z")
It could mean Public Liability Insurance; i.e. insuring yourself so that, in the unlikely case of you accidentally injuring or killing someone or causing damage to property during the course of the event, it is your insurers that are liable. The rise of “No win No Fee” law firms over here in the UK has sent insurance premiums for the organizers of this kind of event through the roof, so participants often have to insure themselves. Could be wrong… it wouldn’t be the first time… ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/17 "2013-03-25T19:57:03Z")
What firms are those? Contingency fees won’t be allowed until April. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/18 "2013-03-25T20:17:00Z")
Thanks for the replies, everyone. The event organizer finally emailed me back and confirmed that it is indeed personal health insurance that would specifically cover this event. I have pretty good regular health insurance which does cover certain overseas trips, I’ll just have to look more into a firmer assurance from my insurance that I’m covered for this, or look into travel insurance. ---
**Author:** ![Charley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/97f17d/32.png) [@Charley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charley)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/19 "2013-03-25T20:19:28Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > What firms are those? The ‘no win/ no fee’ firms? There are dozens of them. They’ve been allowed since the Access to Justice Act in 1999. I think they’re changing the rules with regards to fees charged, but the principle is a fairly longstanding one now. I’m on fire today 😃 ---
**Author:** ![mascaroni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dc4da7/32.png) [@mascaroni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mascaroni)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697/20 "2013-03-25T21:45:20Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > What firms are those? Contingency fees won’t be allowed until April. The Cotswolds Run takes place well after that. Contingency fees have been allowed for some time in the workplace. Unless people are sending spam “I’ve heard about your injury at work, you could claim £3000” are doing it for fun. The threat of litigation, rather than the much maligned HSE is the main reason for the huge hikes in insurance for such events. It’s only about twenty five years ago that solicitors weren’t even allowed to advertise their services. As I said, " I could be wrong, I often am", but I think the ‘compensation culture’ is a US import that we could have done without. And, yes, I know you’re a Brit. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-personal-insurance-in-england/653697.md?page=2)