# What is the difference between Methodists and Presbyterians? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 26, 2015, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722 "2015-02-26T22:15:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2015, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/61 "2015-03-04T21:18:47Z")
> [@Canadjun](#): > > As did the Congregationalists. We’re just one big happy family! 😃 That would be the United Church of Canada, yes? Which seems to accommodate an incredibly broad range of beliefs. On the one hand, you’ve got [Gretta Vosper](http://www.grettavosper.ca/), and on the other, I’ve run into UCC ministers who refuse to officiate at same-sex weddings and aren’t really down with women ministers. I’ve heard that at UCC services, prayers are addressed to “to whom it may concern.” ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2015, 7:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/62 "2015-03-05T07:53:51Z")
> [@Claverhouse](#): > > the old English ( applied to the Scots ? ) joke There is a tale of a Royal Navy ship finding an elderly Scot marooned on a desert island for years, who proudly showed the officers round everything he had built for himself, huts for sleeping, cooking, washing and so on, and even his own little kirk. “And what’s that hut over there?” “Oh, that’s the kirk I \*don’t \*go to.” ---
**Author:** ![Francis\_Vaughan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/francis_vaughan/32/3093_2.png) [@Francis\_Vaughan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francis_Vaughan)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2015, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/63 "2015-03-06T07:11:19Z")
My father likes to tell the story of the village Methodist minister who bought a lottery ticket. That would hardly have mattered had he not won, but he did, and his name was published in the local paper. He had to resign. ---
**Author:** ![Weeping\_Wyvern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/858c86/32.png) [@Weeping\_Wyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weeping_Wyvern)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 8:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/64 "2015-03-07T08:02:13Z")
This is probably less of a distinction now than it was in past centuries, but Methodists (being descendants of Anglicans) have never had a problem with the traditional holidays of the liturgical year, whereas Presbyterians have historically considered Christmas and Easter and the like to be Popish/pagan superstitions. In terms of the liberal-to-fundamentalist spectrum, I think that while both denominational families have lots of super-liberal groups claiming the name, and both also have lots of middle-of-the-road orthodox believers, there seem to be a lot more hardcore conservative Evangelical fellows in Presbyterianism than in Methodism these days. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 9:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/65 "2015-03-07T09:09:20Z")
The [second most prominent](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Wesley) “Methodist” (he didn’t consider himself such) is known for writing songs. The [second most prominent](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Knox) (proto) Presbyterian was known for carrying around a gigantic sword to smite heretics. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/66 "2015-03-07T17:57:30Z")
> [@Weeping\_Wyvern](#): > > This is probably less of a distinction now than it was in past centuries, but Methodists (being descendants of Anglicans) have never had a problem with the traditional holidays of the liturgical year, whereas Presbyterians have historically considered Christmas and Easter and the like to be Popish/pagan superstitions. > > In terms of the liberal-to-fundamentalist spectrum, I think that while both denominational families have lots of super-liberal groups claiming the name, and both also have lots of middle-of-the-road orthodox believers, there seem to be a lot more hardcore conservative Evangelical fellows in Presbyterianism than in Methodism these days. I can assure you that we Presbyterians celebrate Christmas and Easter the same as other Christians. ---
**Author:** ![Doug\_K](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5ac83/32.png) [@Doug\_K](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doug_K)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2015, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/67 "2015-03-08T00:28:07Z")
> [@Gary\_T](#): > > I was raised Methodist. My mother was an observant true believer who drank, gambled, and smoked (all in moderation). I never heard anything from the minister or other church members against drinking or gambling, so I wonder where this notion comes from. From the Book of Discipline [http://www.umc.org/what-we-believe/economic-community#gambling](http://www.umc.org/what-we-believe/economic-community#gambling) > [@](#): > > As an act of faith and concern, Christians should abstain from gambling and should strive to minister to those victimized by the practice. > **[Book of Resolutions: Alcohol and Other Drugs | UMC.org](https://www.umc.org/en/content/book-of-resolutions-alcohol-and-other-drugs)** > > The United Methodist Church supports abstinence from alcohol and all illegal drugs and commits to helping persons recovering from use and abuse of them. > [@](#): > > Alcohol is a drug, which presents special problems because of its widespread social acceptance. We affirm our long-standing conviction and recommendation that abstinence from alcoholic beverages is a faithful witness to God’s liberating and redeeming love. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2015, 8:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/68 "2015-03-08T08:53:41Z")
I have to say, I was raised Presbyterian (Presbyterian USA denomination, specifically). Up until I was 16 or 17, and I went to week long Presbyterian church summer camps almost every year. Including one that was a gigantic assembly with multiple churches from every state. I literally never heard a single word about Presbyterians believing in predestination until years later on the internet. I’m sure it’s a thing in some churches or denominations, but I never heard of it. If anything, the best way I can describe Presbyterian USA sermons and camps is “a pop psychology self help book with Jesus”. In fact, some TED talks still kinda creep me out sometimes from the similarities… ---
**Author:** ![Doug\_K](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5ac83/32.png) [@Doug\_K](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doug_K)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2015, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/69 "2015-03-08T14:42:35Z")
> [@Jragon](#): > > I have to say, I was raised Presbyterian (Presbyterian USA denomination, specifically). Up until I was 16 or 17, and I went to week long Presbyterian church summer camps almost every year. Including one that was a gigantic assembly with multiple churches from every state. I literally never heard a single word about Presbyterians believing in predestination until years later on the internet. I’m sure it’s a thing in some churches or denominations, but I never heard of it. If anything, the best way I can describe Presbyterian USA sermons and camps is “a pop psychology self help book with Jesus”. In fact, some TED talks still kinda creep me out sometimes from the similarities… It’s in PCUSA’s [The Book of Confessions](http://www.pcusa.org/site_media/media/uploads/oga/pdf/boc2014.pdf) (PDF) Chapter X starting on page 91(131 of the PDF) ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2015, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/70 "2015-03-08T16:09:04Z")
Or in Chapter Three of **The Westminster Confession**. It is also one of **The Five Points** : _unconditional predestination, limited atonement, total depravity, irresistible grace, and the perseverance of the saints._ **[The Reformed Faith and Arminianism](http://www.westminsterconfession.org/the-doctrines-of-grace/the-reformed-faith-and-arminianism.php)** ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2015, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/71 "2015-03-08T18:01:31Z")
> [@Claverhouse](#): > > Or in Chapter Three of **The Westminster Confession**. > > It is also one of **The Five Points** : > _unconditional predestination, limited atonement, total depravity, irresistible grace, and the perseverance of the saints._ > > **[The Reformed Faith and Arminianism](http://www.westminsterconfession.org/the-doctrines-of-grace/the-reformed-faith-and-arminianism.php)** Yes. The shorthand is TULIP: **T** otal depravity **U** nconditional predestination **L** imited atonement **I** rresistible grace **P** erseverance of the saints Edit: For some reason, I didn’t see the header of your post. You’d already mentioned that. Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2015, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/72 "2015-03-08T18:55:36Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > Edit: For some reason, I didn’t see the header of your post. You’d already mentioned that. Sorry. 😃 … For some reason, when written out, those propositions look really stupid. No wonder the Great King wiped the floor with Alexander Henderson at Newcastle. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2015, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/73 "2015-03-08T19:07:31Z")
“Total depravity” might actually be a selling point for some individuals …. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2015, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/74 "2015-03-08T20:37:19Z")
> [@Doug\_K](#): > > It’s in PCUSA’s [The Book of Confessions](http://www.pcusa.org/site_media/media/uploads/oga/pdf/boc2014.pdf) (PDF) Chapter X starting on page 91(131 of the PDF) Well, I never said it wasn’t on the books, just that it was never mentioned. Even when I went through confirmation nobody mentioned it. Not the pastor or assistant pastor, not any of the deacons, none of the elders. It was simply not a thing anybody at my church or any camps talked about. ---
**Author:** ![Umbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Umbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Umbridge)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2015, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/75 "2015-03-09T16:26:11Z")
> [@jebert](#): > > I am not a member of either one of these churches, but I have always wondered about the differences among the various mainstream Protestant denominations. There are many of them, but for the purposes of this thread I’d like to see what the differences might be between just the two named in the thread title, especially in the theological realm. I’m not so much interested in trivial differences, for example if one church’s pastor wears a collar and the other doesn’t. (unless the only differences _are_ trivial ones) Presbyterianism gets its name from the Presbyterian polity in the Church of Scotland. Methodism gets its name from its theology, as described by its opponents. It arose from the Church of England, which is an independent denomination. I wouldn’t be surprised if people of Scottish descent would have a Presbyterian ancestor or be Presbyterian or would be raised Presbyterian, or if people of English descent would have a Methodist ancestor or be Methodist or would be raised Methodist. Many of these Christian denominations are tied to ethnicity, family history, and cultural background. ---
**Author:** ![Dendarii\_Dame](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bbce88/32.png) [@Dendarii\_Dame](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dendarii_Dame)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2015, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/76 "2015-03-09T17:59:17Z")
> [@Umbridge](#): > > Many of these Christian denominations are tied to ethnicity, family history, and cultural background. Or in my family’s case, whichever Protestant church happens to be closest… ---
**Author:** ![Umbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Umbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Umbridge)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2015, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/77 "2015-03-09T18:22:04Z")
> [@Dendarii\_Dame](#): > > Or in my family’s case, whichever Protestant church happens to be closest… In England, the land is divided into religious and civil parishes, and there is usually one church (normally affiliated with the Church of England) in every parish. Non-conformists are not affiliated with the established Church of England, and thus may not be entitled to the same social benefits as everybody else (people who are affiliated with the established church). In America, European Lutherans, like other Christians from other European countries, were pressured to conform to a new way of life, which also undermined their ethnic ties to their home countries’ established churches and helped them forge a new Lutheran identity. So, I wouldn’t be surprised that a given American suburb would have several churches, each belonging to a different denomination. That is just an expression of American religious pluralism and tolerance of these denominations co-existing together. With the onset of ecumenism efforts, these Christian churches unite by accepting each other’s baptisms and allowing communion for all (Trinitarian Christian) believers. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2015, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/78 "2015-03-09T19:21:00Z")
> [@Umbridge](#): > > In America, European Lutherans, like other Christians from other European countries, were pressured to conform to a new way of life, which also undermined their ethnic ties to their home countries’ established churches and helped them forge a new Lutheran identity. Always knew the Lutherans were weak-willed. My wife grew up in a Kansas City, KS neighborhood that had apparently had a Catholic church every four blocks or so - the Slovaks had one, the Croats had another, no one was hanging with the Irish, etc. No abandoning ethnic ties for those folks. Actually, a quick Google implies that the Slovaks at least had three, so maybe they were more like the Presbyterians in the joke above then I thought . . . ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2015, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/79 "2015-03-09T19:42:29Z")
Lutherans, even in the US, are likely to be named Ole or Greta or Sven. Part stereotype, but part true: those ethnic ties are still pretty strong. ---
**Author:** ![Umbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Umbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Umbridge)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2015, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722/80 "2015-03-09T19:53:08Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > Lutherans, even in the US, are likely to be named Ole or Greta or Sven. Part stereotype, but part true: those ethnic ties are still pretty strong. Are you Lutheran or raised Lutheran, and if not, do you have a Lutheran ancestor? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-difference-between-methodists-and-presbyterians/713722.md?page=5)