# What is the most signicant political text ever written? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 9, 2008, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444 "2008-08-09T23:01:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Laudenum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7993a0/32.png) [@Laudenum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laudenum)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2008, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/1 "2008-08-09T23:01:06Z")
What is the most signicant political text ever written? Using a broad definition of significant ie. Hitler’s _Mein Kampf_ would be acceptable (although its an awful book 😛 ) I would say it would be _On Liberty_ by John Stuart Mill. The basic ideas put forth in it underlie every political discussion that occurs in most world democracies, it strongly reinforced the women’s movement in England, and it was a huge deviation from the accepted theories of individual and state interaction that were prevalent in Victorian England. What others are in the running? ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2008, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/2 "2008-08-09T23:02:00Z")
Communist Manifesto or Das Kapital. No question. The Bible is probably up there somewhere too. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2008, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/3 "2008-08-09T23:07:28Z")
No love for John Locke? ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2008, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/4 "2008-08-09T23:16:16Z")
Without question is should be John Locke’s _Two Treatises of Government: In the Former, The False Principles and Foundation of Sir Robert Filmer, And His Followers, are Detected and Overthrown. The Latter is an Essay concerning The True Original, Extent, and End of Civil-Government_. The execution of an Athenian democracy described in Plato’s _The Republic_ (and to a more pragmatic extent in _Statesman_ and _Laws_) is an idealized conception of democracy and mannered governance, but Locke dealt with the practicalities of implementing a truly functional representative republic run along democratic institutions in the real world using the concept of a “social contract” and undercutting the Hobbsian basis for unregulated monarchy. Given that most modern Industrial and post-Industrial nations either are or give lip-service to the value of democratic ideals (while monarchism, fascism, and the various bitter flavors of Communism have melted away like ice cream on a hot day) I’d argue that Locke authored what is to date the most significant and influential text in applied politics and governance. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2008, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/5 "2008-08-09T23:52:27Z")
I’d have to say that it’s Locke or Wealth of Nations. Hell, it could be both. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2008, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/6 "2008-08-09T23:57:47Z")
Then of course, there is the non-European speaking world. Sun Zi’s Art of War is arguably the most important political track to influence China and the Chinese influenced Asian countries. ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/7 "2008-08-10T00:11:13Z")
[QUOTE=China Guy] Then of course, there is the non-European speaking world. Sun Zi’s Art of War is arguably the most important political track to influence China and the Chinese influenced Asian countries. [/QUOTE] You know, I just hopped back over to the forum and saw your name and that made me think of “The Art of War”. Good call on that one. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/8 "2008-08-10T00:44:19Z")
[QUOTE=China Guy] Then of course, there is the non-European speaking world. Sun Zi’s Art of War is arguably the most important political track to influence China and the Chinese influenced Asian countries. [/QUOTE] The _Art of War_ is not a political work, however, and has very little to do with politics. Sure, it may have _something_ there, but it’s impact on political systems is limited. Now, if you want to talk Confucius or Mencius, you may have something. ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/9 "2008-08-10T00:58:48Z")
I’d give consideration to the _Magna Carta_ or the _Charter of Liberties_. ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/11 "2008-08-10T08:12:13Z")
I think that one of the most honest would be Machievellis “The Prince” ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 8:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/12 "2008-08-10T08:22:10Z")
_Il Principe_ by Niccolò Machiavelli. \*On War \* by Carl von Clausewitz. And while they’re not nearly as significant as the texts mentioned above, at least in a theoretical sense, I’d say that _Judenstaat_ and _Altneuland_ by Theodor Hezl had a major influence on the history of the latter half of the 20th Century and onward. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/13 "2008-08-10T10:01:41Z")
No doubt the Communist Manifesto. It’s inconceivable to picture how the modern world would be without it. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/14 "2008-08-10T10:35:57Z")
[QUOTE=smiling bandit] The _Art of War_ is not a political work, however, and has very little to do with politics. Sure, it may have _something_ there, but it’s impact on political systems is limited. Now, if you want to talk Confucius or Mencius, you may have something. [/QUOTE] Mao would beg to differ…“Political power comes from the barrel of a gun” Reading Sun Zi as a military text does not reflect the way it influenced China, Korea, Japan, etc ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/15 "2008-08-10T10:51:29Z")
This question is all over the place. The influence of Machiavelli’s ‘The Prince’ can hardly be compared to the influence of Marx’s ‘The Communist Manifesto’. Both books changed and influenced our understanding of how politics is practiced or should be practiced. However, The Manifesto contains no hands-on advice to individual leaders - why would it, communism is inevitable and does not depend on the efforts of individuals but rather on the class struggle as the motor of history. The Prince, on the other hand, does contain hands-on advice to leaders, but Machiavelli made no effort to describe what the policy goals to be achieved should be like. To him, those are given, and all he does is make an argument about how to best reach your goals as a leader. As such, I think they’re both influential in their own right and cannot be compared. I think the OP needs to be more specific about what he/she means by ‘the most significant political text ever written’. ---
**Author:** ![Laudenum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7993a0/32.png) [@Laudenum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laudenum)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/16 "2008-08-10T11:52:59Z")
I would rate Machiavelli’s Discourses as superios, and more relevant to modern goverment, than the Prince (I mean come on, he dedicated it to a man who had him tortured) ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/17 "2008-08-10T11:55:35Z")
Come on, that doesn’t make it inferior or less relevant in and of itself. What really makes _Discorsi_ better than _Il Principe_? ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/18 "2008-08-10T15:33:20Z")
Martin Luther’s 95 Theses. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/19 "2008-08-10T15:40:26Z")
[QUOTE=China Guy] Mao would beg to differ…“Political power comes from the barrel of a gun” Reading Sun Zi as a military text does not reflect the way it influenced China, Korea, Japan, etc [/QUOTE] It may hav led to states being more stable through the use of effective military, but the sole political aspect is the relationship of the state/monarch to the military. More to the point, Mao’s saying has… nothing to do with Sun Tzu. Or any later commentator I am aware of. And as far as I am aware, not translation worth mentioning has ever been found i Japan. There are some ridiculously bad ones, but they’re barely comprehensible. ---
**Author:** ![mutantmoose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a87d85/32.png) [@mutantmoose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mutantmoose)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/20 "2008-08-10T16:03:44Z")
I’m going to nominate Tom Paine. It always amazes me how overlooked he is and yet his first book, Common Sense, is the cornerstone of American democracy and sparked off two revolutions - the American and the French. He invented the phrase “The United States of America”. His second book, The Rights of Man, established the concepts of human rights and republicanism and his third book, The Age of Reason, ushered in the age of secularism and was a kick in the teeth for organised religion. sigh…what a guy. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2008, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444/21 "2008-08-10T16:52:29Z")
[_The Book of the SubGenius_](http://www.subgenius.com/bigfist/classic/classics/X0003_botsg-intro.html) (the most significant text ever written – there is no need for a qualifier) expounds, among other things, the doctrine of pyschopatriotic anarcho-materialism: “Every yard a kingdom, every child and dog a serf!” [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-most-signicant-political-text-ever-written/459444.md?page=2)