The US was early on to the credit card world; & therefore, had some antiquated technology (signature cards). Since other countries came to credit cards later, they started on a newer, more secure standard, Chip & PIN. The US was finally mandated, at a cost in the $ billions*, to upgrade to…outdated Chip & Signature standard. :smack:
Think about a single grocery store or Target & how many checkout lanes they have, especially with ½ dozen self-checkout lanes, now multiply that by how many stores they have & each terminal needing to be upgraded. Even the small retailers needed to spend a few hundred dollars for their one machine. Why we weren’t forced to the latest tech is beyond me. If we’re spending that kind of money, it would have been a relatively minimal amount more to go to Chip & PIN, which some terminals can do, but not all of them.
I set someone up with a Square system on Thursday and was very impressed with how polished and quick it was to set up. It only took a couple of hours to go from “lets’s do this” to putting items in inventory and taking our first test payment, and that included going to the bank and going to Staples to buy the larger Square reader that takes EMV chip and EMV tap. (The small Square reader that swipes was included in the box.)
Machine, terminal… that’s what we call it. They are all over the place here. There are two versions… one that hangs off a local network in a store or restaurant, and another that hangs off the cellphone network, The cellphone version is used by people like delivery people and taxi drivers.
I’m pretty sure it’s a card reader. Might have heard it called a chip and pin device before, but that’s not always relevant, what with contactless payment. (ETA that this is in the UK)
Countries outside the US didn’t go straight to chip and pin. That wasn’t really in use until the 2000s and countries did have credit cards (and debit cards) before then.
It is weird that the US didn’t go to chip and pin, yeah. I wondered if it might be because you have so many different banks, but they managed to band together to produce the first credit cards so they clearly can cooperate if need be.
You can sign for it, just like with a credit card. That’s when it’s run as “credit.” It’s still debited as if you entered your pin, but it’s not a real-time transaction, so it may take a couple days to hit your account.
And, yes, we don’t really have a name for the machine you are talking about, as far as I know, as it’s still very rare to see them here. I’m not entirely sure I’ve ever seen one of them yet. I mean, I’ve seen Square very occasionally, but that is usually at the counter hooked up to an iPad, though I’m fairly sure I’ve seen it on a phone, too. But it’s not like elsewhere in the world where the situation the OP describes is common.
As for the PIN chip stuff, I still go to many places that don’t accept the chip card and require you to swipe. I thought by law they were supposed to all be set up to read the chip by now, but it doesn’t seem to be the case.
So, yes, we’re quite behind the rest of the world for stuff like this.
So happens, yesterday was the first time I ever used a debit card at point of sale. Supermarket checkout, about $60. Nobody asked for a Pin, just a scribbled zigzag mark on the register slip.
It didn’t help that many retailers bungled the changeover to chip machines. The machines often didn’t work, or there were features missing, or they were horrendously slow, or the cashiers got zero information on how they worked.
At the store where my mom works, debit cards couldn’t use the “credit” option for several weeks after the change, and some banks charge per PIN transaction, so some people were pretty pissed.
They are ubiquitous here in the UK, to the extent that I can’t remember the last time I heard anyone name the things - they’re just everywhere - you never need to ask for the machine - even when it’s not immediately available (such as in a restaurant where you pay at the table), I just get the card out and the machine appears.
I think some people might call it a ‘PIN pad’, but not sure.
I haven’t signed for a VISA charge in years. I just enter my PIN.
So imagine my surprise when, on a visit to the US last year, I was informed by the clerk at a store, that I’d have to sign for the purchase on my VISA card. Only, I didn’t. “Oh–you have a PIN.” That surprised her, especially when the transaction went through after I entered it.
Meh. As long as I can use my Canadian credit and debit cards the same way I use them at home, I’m fine. Having to sign for something is a quaint holdover from the old days, but I can deal. But I still have to smile at questions like, “Does your card have a chip?” “Do you have a PIN?” And so on.
Of course I have a PIN on my cards. I’ve had one or two PINs for 35 years now. The American retailers with whom I do business, tend to be amazed when I use my chipped-VISA, and bingo-bango-bongo–the purchase is approved, pretty much immediately
The only problem I had with the episode is that they seriously suggested that one reason Americans avoid it is because waiting for the connection takes too long. Great excuse, coming from the only country in the world where they allow people to pay for groceries by s-l-o-w-l-y writing a personal cheque.
Whatever they’re called, they all refer to the shop assistant or waiter or garage owner indiscriminately as the “merchant”. “Return Terminal To Merchant!”, they demand. It’s strangely mediaeval: merchants are for twelve-volume fantasy sagas, not suburban retailers.
If I have to think hard about it, I might call it a card reader or card machine.
I think with chip and pin having come in in the early 2000s, then card readers became the norm as a result - as the customer needs access to the ‘machine’.
That only works with credit cards, not debit cards since the funds instantly come out of my bank account. Well, at least that’s how it works here and has for eons.
Not the case for Canada or Britain. We had the same type of credit cards at least as early as the early 70s.
I remember when we went on a family trip to England in the early 70s, our bank gave Dad a pamphlet to take with him, to explain that the Canadian “Chargex” card was the same as the British “Barclaycard”. Both of them were the local variants of what became the Visa card; both Chargex and Barclaycard had the familiar tricolour logo (beige, white and blue) that is now the universal Visa logo.
Working in the family store in the mid-70s, I remember using the Chargex/Visa machine: the manual one. You put the card in it, you put a carbon Visa receipt over it, “chunk-chunk” and the pressure imprinted it on the Visa slips. Customer signed it, you gave customer the original and kept the carbon (yes, I remember carbon Visa slips, not just those pressure sensitive ones). For big purchases, you had to look up the card in the book Visa sent out every couple of weeks, to make sure it wasn’t a deadbeat card, or call it in for clearance.
We didn’t go Chip and PIN until about 2007. I remember being in Ireland in 2006 and I didn’t yet have a Chip and PIN card, which flummoxed some of the merchants.
So, no, it’s not that the US was the early adaptor. Canada and Britain used the same primitive card technology as the US in the early 70s. Why Canada and other countries have moved on, and the US hasn’t, is a bit of a mystery.
All the debit cards I’ve had here in the US have a Visa or MasterCard logo and can be run “as credit” as mentioned before in the thread. It’s not a problem here. There may be some debit cards that can only be run as debit, but I don’t think I’ve seen such a bank card since the 80s. I’m sure they exist, but the major banks seem to all issue cards that could work on the credit card networks. ETA: The only difference is, as I wrote before, that PIN transactions happen in real time, but “as credit” transactions on your debit card can take 2-3 days to clear, so your balance may not be accurately reflected right away.
That’s correct. I remember for the longest time having the primitive style of “dumb” credit cards with only a magnetic stripe. In fact I remember the days when credit card validation usually consisted only of looking to see if the card was blacklisted in a paper booklet that merchants got sent to them regularly. But if the purchase amount exceeded some threshold, the merchant had to call the credit card center for manual authorization. If the amount was unusually large, the CC authorizer might actually ask to verify the purchaser’s identity.
Then it all got automated in integrated international authorization networks, and soon after that all cards were chip and pin and then RFID was added for pinless tap-and-go transactions. Why the US didn’t do it at the same time is a mystery.
To my knowledge no credit or debit card in Canada is without both the smart chip and RFID chip and signatures have not been used in years. They do have the old magnetic stripes, too, but in most cases the transaction won’t be allowed with the stripe. Sometimes if there’s a problem reading the chip the terminal will say “use mag stripe”, but I have never seen that work, ever – the machine just rejects the transaction.
As for “the machine”, I just call it a credit card terminal, but I rarely have to refer to it by name. In a restaurant it appears if I ask for the bill.
Not by law but by merchant agreement. If you, the merchant, didn’t use a CHIP authorization after a certain date, & the transaction was found to be fraudulent, then you, the merchant, were on the hook for it where previously the issuing bank was on the hook for it because you were using outdated methods that were not current security standards. The merchant is responsible for buying/leasing the CHIP reading terminal; they cost hundreds of dollars. Some decided it wasn’t worth it, especially if they sell smaller transactions, like a pizza joint.
A little clarification; when the US went away from the “click-clack” imprinted on paper machines, we went to mag stripe. We had an early lead in technology, but then sat there & stagnated as the rest of the world went with the more secure Chip & PIN.
Within the past 2(?) years, we caught partway up by going to Chip & Sig. Why the eff the decision was to (collectively) spend billions to upgrade to NOT the latest is beyond me. (people remembering PIN issues, not using that card, blah, blah, blah.)
