# What is the reasoning behind the headscarves worn by Muslim women? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 5, 2009, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769 "2009-06-05T02:30:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Marienee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@Marienee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marienee)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/21 "2009-06-05T11:01:04Z")
It is interesting that your objection is to women who choose to wear headscarves. The fact is that the reasons people choose to wear headscarves varies quite widely from person to person. There is a strong movement here amoung young muslimas for example to wear the headscarf to signify their identity as well as to express their rejection of the notion that their identity is tied up in being a sexual object. So it has some feminist overtones as well as being a rejection of (or at least a statement of criticism for) the dominant culture. Rules of modest behavior for muslims, I am told, apply to both men and women and in some cases vary depending on who else is in the room. The men I know who are practicing muslims also follow rules of modesty regarding clothing but also regarding behavior. I have muslima friends who only cover their hair or wear tunics or jackets or even robes and so on in public but greet me at the door of their homes in jeans and a t shirt – but would cover themselves immediately if my husband were with me so it is not polite to bring him along without warning. Others remain covered in the presence of all non-muslims regardless of gender. None of this is by any means universal, but then neither was the covering of one’s head, arms, and legs (as has been mentioned) in a Catholic church when I was young. Heck, when I was a child putting a handkerchief on your head on your way into a church was by no means unheard of. Scripturally, in christianity head covering by women was a sign of submissiveness to men; in islam it was a sign of submissiveness to god. However, clothing is a sign of a person which takes place in a cultural context, and so what exactly it expresses (as well as what function it serves) depends very much on both the wearer, where they are, and where they come from. The abaya/chador/burka is a far more charged subject than the head scarf, since the images they invoke are inextricably bound up with the places where they are worn (Saudi Arabia/Iran/Afghanistan) which do have something more than an abysmal record on the treatment of women. So the likelihood that we are talking about a free choice of attire is considerably smaller. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/22 "2009-06-05T11:33:49Z")
> [@chique](#): > > Hm. Do bridal veils bother you as well? What about nun habits or the wigs Orthodox Jewish women wear? Or the headscarves worn in Russia and eastern Europe (and sometimes by [QEII](http://lisawallerrogers.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/queen-eliz-at-balmoral-with-bagpiper-inset-9_19_94-people.jpg))? > > Just trying to get a handle on which bits of cloth bother you… > > Ok, not really, but many Muslim women wear a hijab for the same reasons - because they want to. If they don’t want to they don’t. It’s not your head; what’s it to you? As chique implies - its actually a fairly common custom - and one Western society has only completely let go of in the past 50 years. Jackie Kennedy’s pillbox hat was a remnant of “a woman keeps her head covered.” ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/23 "2009-06-05T11:38:04Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Serious answer, human female breasts are larger than other primates and are considered sexual organs used to attract males. But human hair is also fundamentally different than other primates and is considered a sexual feature used to attract males (there’s even a pretty clear analogue in Western Culture: women used to keep their hair “up” once they were adults, and we certainly still associate the hair coming down with increased sexuality. And there are many, many cultures where the breast is not particularly sexual. I dunno. There’s no education or conscience-raising in the world that would make me comfortable going out in public with my nipples exposed, so I sympathize with the idea that you could be that way about your hair. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/24 "2009-06-05T12:58:24Z")
I certainly don’t criticize women wearing the headscarf, but I don’t particularly like it. It smacksway too much of a culture where Men Rule without question, and women are to be modest and demure. I know several women who have taken the headscarf by choice. Ok, that’s cool, I took up several aspects of my religion by choice (and gave them up again, some years later). It’s when they start criticizing other people for not wearing the headscarf that it bothers me. As to why they wear it? Especially when living in a Western culture? Why for the same reason I got my nose pierced, presumably. I didn’t get my nose pierced for a fad - I got my nose pierced because there was thousands of years of my culture behind it and I look and act more American every day and I wanted some sort of strong over connection to my culture, every day. Presumably these women feel similarly. ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/25 "2009-06-05T13:03:26Z")
> [@starryspice](#): > > The headscarf says that Muslim women must hide a part (or all, in some cases) of themselves while in public, and I find that idea abhorrent. Yet you - along with a very high percentage of all humans over the past 5000 years or so - routinely hide part of yourself while in public, and would almost certainly be shocked to encounter someone who didn’t. As others have noted, though the details vary dramatically, the idea that appearance should conform to specific societal norms is close to universal with humans. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/26 "2009-06-05T14:30:15Z")
There’s no _hatred_ of women in Islam. There is a view among some (most, really) sects that women have a particular defined role in society, and the headscarf is a symbol of that role. It doesn’t mean they hate women; it just means they haven’t yet cast off the idea that women stay at home and make babies and so on. We haven’t completely cast it off in the West, either. ---
**Author:** ![kelly5078](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/6f9a4e/32.png) [@kelly5078](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kelly5078)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/27 "2009-06-05T16:25:36Z")
Most orthodox Jewish men wear a kippah, and very orthodox men wear a tallit katan as well, and the women wear wigs. Absolutely nothing is going to happen to them if they don’t, either from other Jews or from God. They do it because of custom, respect for the religion, and because of a feeling of belonging. I think the same is true for most Muslim women wearing head scarves. But, of course, in some places there is coercion. In those cases, I would certainly have to consider misogyny to be a component of this. ---
**Author:** ![Amara\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7993a0/32.png) [@Amara\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amara_1)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/28 "2009-06-05T16:43:20Z")
My mother visited India many years ago (more than 20 years) and visited temples there. She was a little surprised that her calf length dress was viewed as slightly indecent in the temple while Indian women had most of their torso bared in saris which _she_ considered terribly indecent. So yes, cultural norms. ---
**Author:** ![Amara\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7993a0/32.png) [@Amara\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amara_1)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/29 "2009-06-05T16:50:03Z")
I missed the edit window but I wanted to clarify that my mother was visiting Hindu temples if that makes a difference. ---
**Author:** ![emmaliminal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@emmaliminal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emmaliminal)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/30 "2009-06-05T17:00:47Z")
I’m kind of surprised that no one has yet outlined the bits of the Koran that observant Muslims cite when asked this question. From [here](http://www.muhajabah.com/whyhijab.htm) from Surah an-Nur ayah 31: [QUOTE=a translation of the Koran] And say to the faithful women to lower their gazes, and to guard their private parts, and not to display their beauty except what is apparent of it\*, and to extend their headcoverings to cover their bosoms, and not to display their beauty except to their husbands… [/QUOTE] from Surah al-Ahzab ayah 59: [QUOTE=a translation of the Koran] …Say to your wives and your daughters and the women of the faithful to draw their outergarments close around themselves; that is better that they will be recognized and not annoyed. [/QUOTE] (i.e., “recognized” as Muslims so they will not be “annoyed” by unwanted male attention; the idea being that everyone should know that Muslim women don’t want to be ogled.) If you are devout, you accept what you believe God tells you to do, whether it necessarily makes sense to you or not, because God knows best. The essence of Islam is after all said to be submission to God’s will. If, on the other hand, your \*family \*is devout but you haven’t figured out yet (being a young woman) whether you are or not, you may test the local societal boundaries while wearing a very chic scarf and sprayed-on jeans. - This is a tricky bit and gets argued over a lot: what, exactly, can be displayed? The Koran doesn’t spell it out. [Here is a page](http://www.muhajabah.com/scholars.htm) listing scholars who say it means “face and hands”, which seems to be the majority view. However, the gamut has been argued, from saying only the hair on down to the bosom must be covered, to insisting on even eyes being veiled. A few say the quoted passages are really only meant to have applied to Muhammad’s wives anyway. In practice, community standards prevail. ---
**Author:** ![emmaliminal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@emmaliminal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emmaliminal)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/31 "2009-06-05T17:07:55Z")
It’s worth mentioning that strictly speaking, [Muslim men are supposed to be modest in dress](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hijab#Men.27s_dress) also, which is generally interpreted to mean wearing loose clothing and always covering navel to knee. The most devout men I met in Jordan did so, and also covered their heads with some variety of [cap](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taqiyah_(cap)). ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/32 "2009-06-05T18:16:58Z")
My wife is a Muslim, and Egyptian, a more liberal Muslim country, and grew up mostly in the States. In talking to her friends and family in my several trips to Egypt I have found that not all Muslims like the _hijab_. I have talked to mothers who get upset if their daughter starts wearing one. So we can’t paint all Muslims with the same brush. Also, as has been implied in other posts, this is not all about religion. The culture of covering a woman’s head goes back farther than Mohammed. As with many customs, the faithful find justification in their scriptures, or write them, to justify all manner of behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/33 "2009-06-05T18:56:42Z")
> [@emmaliminal](#): > > I’m kind of surprised that no one has yet outlined the bits of the Koran that observant Muslims cite when asked this question. The Christian parallel in the New Testament, would be [1 Corinthians 11](http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Corinthians%2011&version=9;). A discussion of the sources of [Jewish requirements](http://www.jofa.org/pdf/Batch%201/0101.pdf)( warning, pdf! ). ---
**Author:** ![starryspice](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9e8a1a/32.png) [@starryspice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/starryspice)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/34 "2009-06-05T21:29:24Z")
> [@sunacres](#): > > I suggest that you consider whether starryspice is correct for you or not. I’m sorry, I don’t understand what you mean. Starryspice is an inside joke from high school. ---
**Author:** ![starryspice](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9e8a1a/32.png) [@starryspice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/starryspice)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/35 "2009-06-05T22:09:51Z")
> [@Sunspace](#): > > [Little Mosque on the Prairie](http://www.cbc.ca/littlemosque/). I have to admit that, the first time I heard about it, I thought the news report was an Onion-style parody. It turned out to be real, and the show became something of a success. Thank you - I will definitely be watching that. > [@MandaJo](#): > > Serious question: is it oppressive that Western society demands women keep their nipples covered? Honestly? Yes, I do think it’s a little oppressive. When a woman wants to breastfeed her baby in Western society, she feels compelled to hide her breasts. I find that bothersome, as I think breastfeeding should be a normal, accepted action. In general, though, I’d say women in Western society keep their nipples covered for much the same reason that men do. It’s generally cold enough that clothes must be worn, and so clothing becomes the societally accepted norm. A man may take his shirt off occasionally when participating in sports, but that’s really the exception, not the rule. > [@even\_sven](#): > > The other is that it takes emphasis off of beauty, and some women find this liberating. They feel like they get taken more seriously. They feel like their words and actions get paid more attention to. And they like being exempt from “bad hair days” and the time-consuming expensive beauty rituals most women do just to get out of the door in the morning. They are saying that they are not there just for other people to look at. That they are about what they say and what they do, not about how sexy random guys think they are. A study (I think it was in Physics Today, but I can’t find it) found that Muslim women who chose to wear a headscarf or fuller covering tended to be less outspoken in their physics classes, which in turn hurt their eduction. So I’m not inclined to believe that women who wear the headscarf believe they’re taken more seriously, even if that’s how they justify wearing the headscarf to themselves. > [@emmaliminal](#): > > It’s worth mentioning that strictly speaking, [Muslim men are supposed to be modest in dress](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hijab#Men.27s_dress) also, which is generally interpreted to mean wearing loose clothing and always covering navel to knee. The most devout men I met in Jordan did so, and also covered their heads with some variety of [cap](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taqiyah_(cap)). Interestingly, I have much less of a problem with coverings if they are shared by both men and women. Then it is (imo) truly an expression of cultural (not gender) identity. All of the responses have been really helpful, thanks! ---
**Author:** ![starryspice](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9e8a1a/32.png) [@starryspice](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/starryspice)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/36 "2009-06-05T22:18:20Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > The Christian parallel in the New Testament, would be [1 Corinthians 11](http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1%20Corinthians%2011&version=9;). > > A discussion of the sources of [Jewish requirements](http://www.jofa.org/pdf/Batch%201/0101.pdf)( warning, pdf! ). Woops, forgot this one. Just to be clear, I’ve singled out the Muslim custom of wearing headscarves because it is symbolic of a great deal more that I have a problem with in that religion. Because I associate Islam with oppression of women, I was curious to know why a woman would take part in that oppression by choice. However, I know that wearing a headscarf is not by itself oppressive, so I wanted to clear myself of that kind of irrational thinking. That said, I find that passage from Corinthians to be equally mysoginistic. I’ve never understood why Paul’s letters are considered to be holy word and included in the Bible, but that’s a topic for another discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/37 "2009-06-05T22:58:39Z")
> [@starryspice](#): > > Because I associate Islam with oppression of women, I was curious to know why a woman would take part in that oppression by choice. Well the primary answer is probably that _they_ ( which is to say the vast majority of women, Muslim, Jewish and Christian, that follow such traditions ) **don’t** consider it oppressive ;). Simple as that, really. Just like a lot of FGM is actually performed by women on their own daughters in the cultures that practice it. One can call it “cultural conditioning”, but if you want the answer as to _why_, that’s why - to them it is normative. Also one shouldn’t toss out the identity explanation offered above. When the Shah of Iran declared veiling illegal, many young, college-educated, “liberal”, ostensibly modern women took to wearing coverings as a protest against royal tyranny and a gesture of solidarity with the pious, middle-aged bazaari women who found it humiliating to now be forced out into public without any. Now in that case it may have backfired on them a bit with the mullah’s victory after the revolution. Nonetheless, identity politics can be a powerful force. Also to reiterate the diversity in most modern Muslim countries, I must once again refer to my favorite cartoon on the subject 🙂 : [http://www.drawn-together-by-modesty.com/wp-content/cartoon-collage-of-hijab-styles.html](http://www.drawn-together-by-modesty.com/wp-content/cartoon-collage-of-hijab-styles.html) ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/38 "2009-06-05T22:59:43Z")
> [@starryspice](#): > > , I was curious to know why a woman would take part in that oppression by choice. Interesting question, indeed: if there is a tradition or custom that some people identify with oppression, or that is actually oppressively enforced elsewhere in the world, but I am in a free environment, \*\*\*am \*_I free to still observe it by my own choice out of tradition or cultural identity, without it being seen as an endorsement of the oppressive instances? As **Tamerlane** says, those who wear hijab by choice_ do not believe they are being oppressed. BTW, as mentioned elsewhere before, rules about women being covered _ **preceeded** _Islam and Christianity in many parts of the Middle East, by centuries. Annoying as it may be for some True Believers, most religious teachings and traditions reflect the environment they evolved in. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/39 "2009-06-05T23:08:39Z")
[missed edit window]make that _“…by my own choice OR out of tradition or cultural identity”_. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769/40 "2009-06-05T23:43:20Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > As **Tamerlane** says, those who wear hijab\* by choice\* do not believe they are being oppressed. And many who functionally don’t have a choice don’t recognize that there could be a choice. I suppose that technically I don’t have a choice about whether I wear shoes to work or not. There may be jobs or cultures where it isn’t necessary. But its never really occurred to me that having a choice in wearing shoes to work is worth questioning. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-reasoning-behind-the-headscarves-worn-by-muslim-women/498769.md?page=3)