# What is the Secret Service's duty/obligation towards Trump? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 4, 2021, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603 "2021-01-04T00:45:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2021, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/21 "2021-01-04T22:23:19Z")
> [@gdave](#): > > As bizarre as it may seem, and as unpleasant as the prospect may be, Donald Trump is free to tell the Russians or anyone else whatever he wants to about any “state secrets”. Short of giving aid and comfort to an enemy nation (and we’re not at war - Russia is not legally an enemy nation), as a legal matter, a President or former President pretty much _can’t_ “betray national security”, by definition. I disagree. As you say, Presidents don’t have clearances. But _information_ is classified. It is a Federal crime to disclose classified information. Whether you encountered it legitimately in the course of your properly-cleared work for the government or you were given it by a disgruntled government worker or you found it on a park bench. This week Trump could declassify anything he wanted then disclose it. And there’s not much that could be done to stop him. That is yet another of the many loopholes in our body of law that assumed the US President would never be an anti-American gangster / vandal. Oops on us. But if he forgot to declassify something first and disclosed it anyway that would still be a crime. And come Jan 21 he’s not able to declassify anything. So any disclosure he makes after that date of something that was classified on Jan 19th is also a Federal crime. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2021, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/22 "2021-01-04T22:43:06Z")
Is there some sort of established law that indicates this applies to ex-presidents, too? Can an ex-president reveal classified information against the will of the current president? I question the idea that the ex-president is allowed to divulge all the national security information he wants to anyone. I understand the rationale for the current president, but once he’s out of the role, he’s also out of the role of deciding what’s classified or not. ---
**Author:** ![gdave](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gdave/32/3683_2.png) [@gdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gdave)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2021, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/23 "2021-01-04T22:59:44Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > I disagree. As you say, Presidents don’t have clearances. > > But _information_ is classified. It is a Federal crime to disclose classified information. Whether you encountered it legitimately in the course of your properly-cleared work for the government or you were given it by a disgruntled government worker or you found it on a park bench. > > This week Trump could declassify anything he wanted then disclose it. And there’s not much that could be done to stop him. That is yet another of the many loopholes in our body of law that assumed the US President would never be an anti-American gangster / vandal. Oops on us. > > But if he forgot to declassify something first and disclosed it anyway that would still be a crime. And come Jan 21 he’s not able to declassify anything. So any disclosure he makes after that date of something that was classified on Jan 19th is also a Federal crime. > [@SenorBeef](#): > > Is there some sort of established law that indicates this applies to ex-presidents, too? Can an ex-president reveal classified information against the will of the current president? > > I question the idea that the ex-president is allowed to divulge all the national security information he wants to anyone. I understand the rationale for the current president, but once he’s out of the role, he’s also out of the role of deciding what’s classified or not. This is a murky area of the law. The United States doesn’t have an Official Secrets Act. The Espionage Act of 1917 is notoriously vague, and the courts have been inconsistent on how to apply it. It’s clear that if you have a clearance and have signed an NDA, you are subject to prosecution for mishandling classified information. It’s not at all clear that if I (as a civilian without a current clearance or NDA) find classified information on a park bench that I’m under any legal restrictions on what I can do with it. Julian Assange, a prominent current example, _isn’t_ being charged with revealing classified information. He’s being charged with soliciting former PFC Manning to unlawfully disclose classified information and aiding and abetting PFC Manning in that unlawful disclosure. That is _clearly_ illegal. It’s not at _all_ clear that in and of itself simply publishing the material would have violated any U.S. laws. There simply is no law which specifically binds or does not bind a _former_ President from disclosing classified information. It’s just not something that anyone even considered when the relevant legislation was being drafted. I personally just don’t see how you can make a practical legal case that Donald Trump could have lawfully told Vladimir Putin things at 11:59 AM on January 20, 2021 but which it becomes criminal to tell him at 12:01 PM on January 21, 2021. The information President Trump had access to was only classified because he said it was. The idea that he could accidentally legally bind his actions after leaving office by failing to formally declassify information which he wanted to disclose and which would have been perfectly legal for him to disclose while in office seems like a pretty convoluted legal argument. But, I Am Not A Lawyer, and I could be wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2021, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/24 "2021-01-04T23:56:01Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > If Trump suddenly leaves the country after Biden Is sworn in, the Secret Service wouldn’t be likely to have the right kind of passport and visa. I’d think they would decline to accompany. That can’t possibly be true … can it? It is the Secret Service job to protect the ex-President, wherever he goes. An ex-President might need to travel abroad on business. The Secret Service would have to be prepared to go with him. They would have their passports all sorted out, and ready to travel at short notice. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/25 "2021-01-05T00:13:20Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > (If he’s still there. I have heard about plans to fly overseas on the 19th). Where did you hear this? Do you have a factually reliable cite? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/26 "2021-01-05T00:18:25Z")
People are talking about it. That seems to be good enough these days right? ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/27 "2021-01-05T00:25:08Z")
Would those be “good people” who are talking about it? Perhaps on both sides? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/28 "2021-01-05T00:27:15Z")
“People are talking about it” in not a factual response, esp. in GQ. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/29 "2021-01-05T00:45:39Z")
I’m not going to advocate for the credibility of this, but I think he was referring to this: > **[Unusual aircraft activity fuels rumors Trump may flee to Scotland before...](https://www.rawstory.com/trump-turnberry-scotland/)** > > Unusual activity near President Donald Trump's golf resort in Scotland has set off rumors that he might be fleeing there before Joe Biden's inauguration.Prestwick airport, which is near Trump's Turnberry resort, was told to expect the arrival on Jan.... ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/30 "2021-01-05T00:58:54Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > “People are talking about it” in not a factual response, esp. in GQ. **Moderator Note** Let’s refrain from junior modding in GQ. I also have previously instructed you to limit yourself to substantive responses in this forum. You habitually direct inappropriate comments and questions to other posters without making any contribution of your own. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/31 "2021-01-05T01:36:17Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > It is the Secret Service job to protect the ex-President, wherever he goes. An ex-President might need to travel abroad on business. The Secret Service would have to be prepared to go with him. They would have their passports all sorted out, and ready to travel at short notice. It is reasonable to assume that they have passports. It is not reasonable to assume they have visas. They don’t need a visa for Scotland, but they do for Russia and Russian visas are not generally issued on short notice. Of course, Vladdie could waive the requirement if it pleased him to do so. But as commented upthread, if Agent Orange goes off somewhere the secret service can’t immediately follow he would be deemed to have given up the protection. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/32 "2021-01-05T02:20:48Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > That can’t possibly be true … can it? > It is the Secret Service job to protect the ex-President, wherever he goes. An ex-President might need to travel abroad on business. The Secret Service would have to be prepared to go with him. They would have their passports all sorted out, and ready to travel at short notice. IIRC former Presidents (& their spouses?) are entitled to a diplomatic passport for life as a courtesy; presumably their security details would also have diplomatic passports (or at least official passports). It’s completely up to the receiving country to issue or waive any visa requirements (or refuse to admit a traveler otherwise entitled, even a diplomat). It’s worth noting that Secret Services agents are civil servants, not military personnel. They can always request to be transferred off the protectee’s detail (and given how Presidential duty is usually considered the most prestigious I can’t see such a request being refused.) If an individual agent refuses a lawful order the worst that can happen is for them to be fired and lose their pension; they aren’t facing imprisonment or a death sentence. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/33 "2021-01-05T13:01:56Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > It is reasonable to assume that they have passports. It is not reasonable to assume they have visas. They don’t need a visa for Scotland, but they do for Russia and Russian visas are not generally issued on short notice. Of course, Vladdie could waive the requirement if it pleased him to do so. But as commented upthread, if Agent Orange goes off somewhere the secret service can’t immediately follow he would be deemed to have given up the protection. I mean the whole scenario is inane, an ex-President is basically treated as a diplomat by other countries, and the fact they travel with a heavily armed security detail means there is an established process for them traveling to various countries. Obviously this is the case, because other private citizens cannot travel across Europe and Asia, predominantly in countries with very restrictive gun laws, with an entire contingent of heavily armed men and women. Just like when they travel to a country as Head of State, an ex-President’s assistants will have worked out a formal agreement with a representative of the other country before they ever put the President on the plane. An ex-President would not just text Vlad Putin on his phone 20 minutes before his private plane entered Russian airspace asking “hey is it cool if me and my Secret Service detail decamp into your country for awhile?” Once the proper travel arrangements had been secured, the ex-President would basically be traveling with his entourage upon formal invitation of the functionaries of the government of the host country, so issues like “proper visa” and etc just wouldn’t be part of it. They wouldn’t be going through the customs line at the airport. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/34 "2021-01-05T13:06:46Z")
They need to do their job up until the time Biden is sworn in. Then, they need to arrest him as a trespasser if he hasn’t left the White House by then. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/35 "2021-01-05T13:34:30Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Then, they need to arrest him as a trespasser if he hasn’t left the White House by then. That’s not their job. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/36 "2021-01-05T14:20:36Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > That’s not their job. Yes, in this case it is because they are protecting Biden by removing Trump who, at that point, has become a White House intruder. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/37 "2021-01-05T14:37:50Z")
If Trump were to stick around Biden would most likely just start talking to him and tell him one of his whimsical long stories while surrounded by his much larger Secret Service detail. At some point Trump’s head would explode from the combination of forced logic and whimsey and start rambling even more inchorently than is normal for him, then be escorted to the helicopter back to Walter Reed. Only this time to the psych ward. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/38 "2021-01-05T15:36:37Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > But as commented upthread, if Agent Orange goes off somewhere the secret service can’t immediately follow he would be deemed to have given up the protection. Mod note to myself: Don’t make political jabs (“Agent Orange”) in GQ. I am sorry and apologize to all Dopers. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/39 "2021-01-05T15:36:48Z")
Donald Trump’s security team isn’t responsible for Biden’s protection. Biden has a team for that. Trump’s team would assist the United States Secret Service Uniformed Division in removing Trump from the White House if needed, but they’re not going to arrest him. ---
**Author:** ![jnglmassiv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f07891/32.png) [@jnglmassiv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jnglmassiv)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2021, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603/40 "2021-01-05T18:05:51Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > Obviously this is the case, because other private citizens cannot travel across Europe and Asia, predominantly in countries with very restrictive gun laws, with an entire contingent of heavily armed men and women. I’m curious what the team detailed to a former-President’s overseas trip looks like. My guess is that it’s more like a few discrete agents than the helicopters, snipers & black SUVs with ‘exotic capabilities’ of a sitting President’s security bubble. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-secret-services-duty-obligation-towards-trump/929603.md?page=3)