# What is the term for religion without a diety **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 9, 2013, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483 "2013-11-09T03:59:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/1 "2013-11-09T03:59:25Z")
Buddha once said something akin to ‘have the gods ever prevented you from getting a cold’ yet I believe he was still religious while pointing out that god has pretty much never done anything for anyone. I notice animism doesn’t seem to mention any kind of deity. The closest description I can find is pantheism because they believe in the concept of spirituality and reject the idea of a deity. So is there a term for a religious belief that believes in religious concepts (spirituality, afterlife, karma, reincarnation, heaven/hell, etc) but believes a deity either doesn’t exist or is an impotent non-creator (as opposed to deism which states a deity both exists and created the universe but chooses not to intervene)? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/2 "2013-11-09T04:59:16Z")
After some wandering through Wikipedia, I found the possibly relevant term “[Transtheism](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transtheism)”. > [@](#): > > Transtheistic is a term coined by philosopher Paul Tillich or Indologist Heinrich Zimmer, referring to a system of thought or religious philosophy which is neither theistic, nor atheistic, but is beyond them. > > Zimmer applies the term to the theological system of Jainism, which is theistic in the limited sense that the gods exist, but become immaterial as they are transcended by moksha (that is, a system which is not non-theistic, but in which the gods are not the highest spiritual instance). Zimmer (1953, p. 182) uses the term to describe the position of the Tirthankaras having passed “beyond the godly governors of the natural order”. > > The term has more recently also been applied to Buddhism, Advaita Vedanta and the Bhakti movement. ---
**Author:** ![Longshanks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Longshanks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Longshanks)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/3 "2013-11-09T11:22:02Z")
Wouldn’t it be just a philosophy of sorts? ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/4 "2013-11-09T13:12:15Z")
> [@Longshanks](#): > > Wouldn’t it be just a philosophy of sorts? What if a person believes in heaven and hell, or reincarnation but doesn’t think there is a creator god who has anything to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/5 "2013-11-09T15:28:24Z")
Azathothianism should fit the bill. What’s more impotent and unaccessible than a non-sentient deity? Of course, you’d have to get used to the shrill, wild piping… ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/6 "2013-11-09T15:41:51Z")
“Oh Azathoth The pipes, the pipes are calling. From swamp to mire Along the eldritch shore…” ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/7 "2013-11-09T15:43:06Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > “Oh Azathoth > The pipes, the pipes are calling. > From swamp to mire > Along the eldritch shore…” I wish we could “like” posts… ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/8 "2013-11-09T15:53:45Z")
Fast-free? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![CC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f1d935/32.png) [@CC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CC)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/9 "2013-11-09T18:25:36Z")
Depending on how you define religion, if you believe that Buddhism is a religion, then you’ve answered your own question. It is a religion, but it has no deity. I’m defining religion as a set of beliefs that relate to the larger issues of human origins, afterlife, morality, purpose of life, and so forth. And usually, I think that religions also entail some degree of ritualistic behaviors. In those ways, a “religion without a deity” is still a religion. ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/10 "2013-11-09T19:26:18Z")
My first response was Buddhism and after a little bit of thought, my second response is Buddhism, as well. In fact, it can be argued (as **CC** did so well) that Buddhism is the very definition of a religion without a deity. ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/11 "2013-11-09T19:37:33Z")
So, how do Buddhist theologians describe their form of religion? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/12 "2013-11-09T20:05:12Z")
I don’t see why it couldn’t be described as _atheist religion_. That’s not actually a contradiction. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/13 "2013-11-09T20:06:12Z")
When I google Azathothianism the only thing that comes up on google is this thread. Its like fox news, you guys are using your own opinions as cites. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/14 "2013-11-09T20:51:31Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > When I google Azathothianism the only thing that comes up on google is this thread. Its like fox news, you guys are using your own opinions as cites. No, I was using my own opinion (and not terribly esoteric literary knowledge) as a half-joke. Sorry. ETA: That is a sincere apology, btw. I never expected anyone to actually look up Azathothianism and forgot this was in GQ. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/15 "2013-11-09T21:13:55Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > When I google Azathothianism the only thing that comes up on google is this thread. Its like fox news, you guys are using your own opinions as cites. It was a joke…but Azathoth wasn’t invented by **jayjay**. If you Google “Azathoth” and not “Azathothianism” you will find – ah – far more information than you may wish. Basically, it’s a fictional “God” invented by H.P. Lovecraft. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/16 "2013-11-09T21:18:03Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > Fast-free? 😃 Yeah, I feel like I have been following a non-diety religion for most of my life. My faith has hardly wavered. ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2013, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/17 "2013-11-09T22:23:47Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I wish we could “like” posts… The way you just did so is good enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![janeslogin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@janeslogin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/janeslogin)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2013, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/18 "2013-11-10T22:40:34Z")
“Nontheistic” is the adjective for religion without a deity as defined in a few dictionaries including a couple of the better ones. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2013, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/19 "2013-11-11T18:54:31Z")
For fun, I went to BeliefNet’s [BeliefOMatic](http://www.beliefnet.com/Entertainment/Quizzes/BeliefOMatic.aspx). I answered the key questions about belief in a God/Gods in the negative, but generally upholding to a vague religious view with Secular Humanist-type answer on the hot button issues. They allow rating how important an issue is, so I rated the no-God one’s high, the secondary beliefs low. It came back Unitarian Universalism. Note that UU’s are a divergent group, to say the least, which includes nontheists. So if someone actually wanted to particjpate in a nontheistic church, wander over to your local UU chapter. But be prepared to meet, umm, non-nontheists (?). ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2013, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483/20 "2013-11-11T18:59:16Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > I don’t see why it couldn’t be described as _atheist religion_. That’s not actually a contradiction. Only semantically. I can’t think of any meaningful definition of atheist that doesn’t include disavowal of religious precepts along with a deity. But conceded that the term can be read that way. > [@ftg](#): > > But be prepared to meet, umm, non-nontheists (?). How many \*non-\*s before we get to non-sense? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-the-term-for-religion-without-a-diety/673483.md?page=2)