# What is this "agenda" scientists have against religion? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 1, 2013, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246 "2013-05-01T19:59:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/41 "2013-05-02T17:20:29Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No doubt. But, I recall a scene from Terry Pratchett’s [url=]_The Nation:_ Mau’s Polynesian island is inundated with a tsunami while he is on another island for his manhood ritual. He is the sole survivor, and has to bury-at-sea the drowned bodies of everyone he ever knew. How could the Gods have let this happen?! Mau decides to become what we would call an atheist. Later, survivors from nearby islands start gathering on Mau’s island, including a priest, who tells Mau, in effect, “You **want** the Gods to exist, just enough that you can be mad at them for not existing.” In-universe, we learn later, the Gods of Mau’s people apparently **do** exist. And in the real world, atheists do not hate God. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/42 "2013-05-02T17:20:20Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > [Some do.](http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Antitheism#In_a_theistic_context) Antitheists are clearly not atheists. Heck, lots of real theist hate other gods. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/43 "2013-05-02T17:21:48Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > The skeptical mindset that is an asset to a scientist is a hindrance to a theist. > [@Odesio](#): > > What about scientist who also happen to be theist? They, apparently, are good at compartmentalizing their faith from their skepticism. They have the properly skeptical, curious, scientific attitude – except where certain things are concerned. Either they ignore the dissonance, or perhaps they fallaciously rationalize it as a matter of [Non-Overlapping Magisteria.](http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Non-overlapping_magisteria) Doublethink and blackwhite are not nearly such difficult mental tricks as Orwell made them out to be in _Nineteen Eighty-Four._ ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/44 "2013-05-02T17:23:28Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > But if 50 scientists, 50 scientists a day walk into the church and recite a paragraph of Origin of the Species and walk out, they’ll think it’s a movement. You can evolve anything you want At Charley’s Restaurant ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/45 "2013-05-02T17:23:41Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > They tend to be inferior scientists - the higher up you go in terms of accomplishments, the more of them are atheists. This has not been my experience. Growing up in Los Alamos I was surrounded by scientists, and the majority of them went to one church or another, even the high level ones. Admittedly I doubt that many of them were fundamentalists, but they believed in the laws of physics and biology and also engaged in a god centered spirituality without the two aspects interfering with each other. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/46 "2013-05-02T17:26:14Z")
> [@MyFootsZZZ](#): > > Right… but WHAT IS the agenda, that’s what I’m asking. Why does Bill Nye care about what children think? What motive are they supposedly supposed to have? > [@Glazer](#): > > Their agenda is the same as this board’s. :mad: No, dammit! Absolute global domination is for Dopers, not scientists! Oh, wait . . . you meant this Board’s **other** agenda . . . :o ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/47 "2013-05-02T17:27:04Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > And in the real world, atheists do not hate God. Yeah, arguing from fictional worlds is not very convincing. God exists in Touched by an Angel and Dogma, but I hardly think that will make me start going to some church. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/48 "2013-05-02T21:50:47Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > And in the real world, atheists do not hate God. I know one who does! It’s fascinating. He’s a lapsed Catholic, who is furious at God…for not existing! ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/49 "2013-05-02T22:05:03Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > They tend to be inferior scientists - the higher up you go in terms of accomplishments, the more of them are atheists. I’m sure there must’ve been some polling done about this somewhere… What’s the latest numbers on this? If it includes some kind of rationale for who they polled (and for ranking them in terms of accomplishment), so much the better. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2013, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/50 "2013-05-02T22:05:31Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > I know one who does! It’s fascinating. He’s a lapsed Catholic, who is furious at God…for not existing! “He was an embittered atheist (the sort of atheist who does not so much disbelieve in God as personally dislike Him), and took a sort of pleasure in thinking that human affairs would never improve.” – _Down and Out in Paris and London,_ George Orwell ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2013, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/51 "2013-05-03T01:58:49Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > I’m sure there must’ve been some polling done about this somewhere… What’s the latest numbers on this? If it includes some kind of rationale for who they polled (and for ranking them in terms of accomplishment), so much the better. _meh_ His first clause is just rank prejudice that is not actually connected to the next clause. There probably are more atheists at the top of the scientific food chain. I think that has been demonstrated in several recent polls. Claiming that a religious belief makes one “inferior,” however, does not actually follow from that evidence. Logic and a fundie world view (religious or atheist) has been pretty well established to be poorly correlated. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2013, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/52 "2013-05-03T02:56:11Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > What about scientist who also happen to be theist? The list of Roman Catholic clergy scientist is pretty impressive after all. The father of modern genetics Gregor Mendel for example. You don’t have to be an atheist to be enthusiastic about science. Yes, some Christians are scientists. Some atheists aren’t. What’s your point? ---
**Author:** ![Renee\_RL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7c8e57/32.png) [@Renee\_RL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renee_RL)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/53 "2013-05-06T23:04:50Z")
> [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > Scientists have been tempted by Satan to disparage the revealed holy truth of God and replace it with their own puny reason. Satan uses their hubris to work against God and turn people towards darkness. Good Christians must resist these false teachings at every turn, not only for our own sake, but for our country’s sake. Next thing we will find out is that it was satan who replaced Santa. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/54 "2013-05-06T23:43:45Z")
> [@Prejteach2](#): > > Next thing we will find out is that it was satan who replaced Santa. Who do **you** think leaves toy guns under the tree? ---
**Author:** ![BlinkingDuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/eada6e/32.png) [@BlinkingDuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlinkingDuck)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2013, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/55 "2013-05-06T23:48:12Z")
> [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > Scientists have been tempted by Satan to disparage the revealed holy truth of God and replace it with their own puny reason. Satan uses their hubris to work against God and turn people towards darkness. Good Christians must resist these false teachings at every turn, not only for our own sake, but for our country’s sake. Preach it brother! ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/56 "2013-05-07T00:47:37Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Their “agenda” is to replace glorious belief in a wondrous and almighty God with a blind secular adherence to cold logic and reason. > > Well sir, I for one do NOT want my children growing up with a belief that THEY are responsible for their actions and choices instead of an arbitrarily benevolent all knowing, all seeing being guiding them through life! Sorry, I prefer to understand that I am responsible for my own actions and choices - and that whether the end results are good or bad, I made them myself based on my personal code of behavior. If I screw up, I need to apologize and do what is required to repair any damage, if someone does something negative to me, I need to be patient with them. If someone does me good, I need to respond to them positively to let them know I recognize what they did. Basically, the golden rule without some amorphous diety lurking in the wings with the threat of something that will happen to me after I am dead. ---
**Author:** ![rsat3acr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a3d4f5/32.png) [@rsat3acr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rsat3acr)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/57 "2013-05-07T02:47:30Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > I don’t get the argument-Jesus himself defined religion as “my kingdom is not of this world”. This means: > -there is no conflict with rationalism-Christianity is distinct and has no relevance to the physical world > -the Biblical accounts of creation are completely allegorical, and should not be taken as literal truth > So why get all worked up about this non-issue? I agree with you and it should be a non issue but way too many fundmentalist Christians get worked up about it. Plenty of them believe that Genesis is the literal truth and should be taught as a fact in biology class or at least “teach the controversy” because after all evolution is “just a theory”. Funny they have no problem with atomic theory or gravitational theory being “just a theory”. So as a scientist I do have an agenda, it is to keep creationism out of public schools. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/58 "2013-05-07T02:50:33Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Because they don’t want to admit that the reason that their baseless, illogical, physically impossible fantasy is being dismissed is because it’s baseless, illogical and physically impossible . I really hate agreeing with you, but we need a “LIKE” button on this message board. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/59 "2013-05-07T03:00:02Z")
> [@Capt\_Kirk](#): > > So, it works kinda like this. Scientists lie about evolution to get the kids away from God and soon they will be working in gay porn or something. Why do you hate America? Aside from _A Horse With No name._ ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2013, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246/60 "2013-05-07T05:37:52Z")
> [@Prejteach2](#): > > Next thing we will find out is that it was satan who replaced Santa. Of course. And the spelling proves that he’s dyslexic. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-agenda-scientists-have-against-religion/657246.md?page=4)