# What is this singing trick called and how do you do it? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 27, 2019, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457 "2019-12-27T15:49:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanub/32/132_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUB)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2019, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/1 "2019-12-27T15:49:09Z")
Since we seem to have a trend going about songs and and singers and whatnot, I’d like to throw one more into the mix with a question I’ve been wondering about since I was old enough to sing / appreciate singers. What do you call the specific technique singer use sometimes when they’re really belting out a word or phrase. It’s kind of like the “Cookie Monster” growl of hard metal but it only lasts for a few words. It seems especially used in show tunes and bluesy numbers. A pretty good example is at the 3:42 mark on [Everything About You](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byEGjLU2egA) by Ugly Kid joe (who is definitely not ugly. Wow, I was not expecting that)I’m talking about that deep throated rumbly thing he does that starts on the word “hate”. I have never been able to make that sound, though I’m pretty good with sounds in general. I’ve had friends that seemingly have been able to do it since birth and I want to know the secret! ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/2 "2019-12-28T05:58:13Z")
The aryepiglottal trill, which produces sound from vibrations of the aryepiglottal folds making a co-oscillation with the vocal folds, resulting in strident voice, when the larynx is raised and the pharynx constricted. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/3 "2019-12-28T06:01:14Z")
The aryepiglottal folds connect the epiglottis (the lid of the larynx) with the arytenoid cartilage (where the vocal folds attach to the inside of the larynx). Just get them vibrating along with (or even instead of) the vocal folds. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/4 "2019-12-28T19:20:59Z")
I’m a linguist, not a vocal coach, but the technique you want is to first raise the larynx. This, I think, brings the aryepiglottal folds up to where certain muscles that control the pharynx can get at them. By squeezing these muscles inward at the pharynx, you bring the aryepiglottal folds within range of each other to start vibrating in the airstream. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/5 "2019-12-28T19:37:37Z")
Or you can smoke cigarettes for 20 - 30 years. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/6 "2019-12-28T19:49:24Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Or you can smoke cigarettes for 20 - 30 years. Not the same. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2019, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/7 "2019-12-28T20:54:13Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > Not the same. But you look cooler, though. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2019, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/8 "2019-12-29T18:44:12Z")
Oh, so - [this annoying sorta stuff,](https://youtu.be/LSXKyHM133c?t=252) then. Also a go-to for all those bluesy hot lady torch singers. ---
**Author:** ![jerez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c68b51/32.png) [@jerez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jerez)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2019, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/9 "2019-12-29T19:45:01Z")
And Stevie Wonder in [Living for the City](https://youtu.be/rc0XEw4m-3w?t=317), after he “goes bad.” Isn’t that Tom Waits’ wheelhouse? And Louis Armstrong. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2019, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/10 "2019-12-29T23:59:05Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > I’m a linguist, not a vocal coach, but the technique you want is to first raise the larynx. This, I think, brings the aryepiglottal folds up to where certain muscles that control the pharynx can get at them. By squeezing these muscles inward at the pharynx, you bring the aryepiglottal folds within range of each other to start vibrating in the airstream. So it doesn’t have anything to do with the ventricular folds (“false vocal chords”) or vocal fry. No wonder my attempts have always failed. I’ve always tried to relate it to either of those, which I can use at will. Still, seems the closest I can do on purpose is doing a very open uvular trill ([ʀ]), which feels like I’m gargling with my own spit. (Unlike with the French back-trilled R, which I’ve always done with a more closed jaw and my tongue fronting the sound a bit). I’d think it was the correct articulation, but I notice my uvula is still vibrating and the feeling of constriction is higher than where the epiglottis is on any diagram. Still, I wonder if it’s close enough. I also wonder if being able to use the pharyngeal fricative/approximant ([ʕ]), a common sound in Arabic that English speakers often have trouble with and replace with a glottal stop, is helpful in being able to produce it. Apparently the [epiglottal trill is also called the pharyngeal trill](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voiced_epiglottal_trill), and the symbol is nearly the same. I suspect **Johanna** can do that sound quite well, based on other talk with her about Arabic. (I can’t remember–are you a native speaker of Arabic?) ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanub/32/132_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUB)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2019, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/11 "2019-12-30T13:13:57Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Or you can smoke cigarettes for 20 - 30 years. Done that; still can’t make the sound. Thanks, Johanna, for answering my question, which you did technically perfectly. Now if someone could translate it to simpleton’s English so the likes of me can understand it:o ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2019, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/12 "2019-12-30T13:36:49Z")
> [@WOOKINPANUB](#): > > Done that; still can’t make the sound. Shoulda tried Johanna’s method instead. Would have cost you a lot less. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2019, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/13 "2019-12-31T07:48:25Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > So it doesn’t have anything to do with the ventricular folds (“false vocal chords”) or vocal fry. No wonder my attempts have always failed. I’ve always tried to relate it to either of those, which I can use at will. > > Still, seems the closest I can do on purpose is doing a very open uvular trill ([ʀ]), which feels like I’m gargling with my own spit. (Unlike with the French back-trilled R, which I’ve always done with a more closed jaw and my tongue fronting the sound a bit). I’d think it was the correct articulation, but I notice my uvula is still vibrating and the feeling of constriction is higher than where the epiglottis is on any diagram. Still, I wonder if it’s close enough. > > I also wonder if being able to use the pharyngeal fricative/approximant ([ʕ]), a common sound in Arabic that English speakers often have trouble with and replace with a glottal stop, is helpful in being able to produce it. Apparently the [epiglottal trill is also called the pharyngeal trill](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voiced_epiglottal_trill), and the symbol is nearly the same. > > I suspect **Johanna** can do that sound quite well, based on other talk with her about Arabic. (I can’t remember–are you a native speaker of Arabic?) American English is my native language, but I’ve learned Arabic well enough to articulate ‘_ayn_ without sounding like I’m strangling. In actual Arabic speech it’s a fairly lightly pronounced sound, more an approximant than a fricative, definitely not a trill. The uvular and pharyngeal consonants you mention aren’t quite the thing. The aryepiglottal vibration co-oscillates with the vocal folds, so it sounds continuously with the voice, as in the OP example, rather than replacing consonant sounds. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2020, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/14 "2020-01-04T03:18:08Z")
> [@jerez](#): > > And Stevie Wonder in [Living for the City](https://youtu.be/rc0XEw4m-3w?t=317), after he “goes bad.” About one-tenth as bad - SW and [Sir Duke](https://youtu.be/6sIjSNTS7Fs?t=198). The Butthole Surfers - [Lady Sniff](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yq37ygSqFc) [Franklin](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-PkutG_Q2Q) ---
**Author:** ![jerez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c68b51/32.png) [@jerez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jerez)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2020, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-this-singing-trick-called-and-how-do-you-do-it/845457/15 "2020-01-04T15:28:47Z")
Yeah, in a number of tracks he adds little details with that technique. I was going to post “Boogie on Reggae Woman.”