Oh, my, children will be children.
Only if they do it with their mouth.
I know a number of people who claim both atheism and spirituality, so I don’t see why not. Further, some forms of Buddhism are both atheistic and matters of spiritual discipline.
Then again, I did note (was that in this thread or one of the other ones? memory like one of those things you drain rice in) that I think the whole gods-exist and supernatural-exists (which I see as notably distinct things) arguments are tangential to the question of spirituality.
I’m not sure people with no moral compass are going to give a dam about religion.
Fortunately nice people like yourself who don’t give a dam about religion do have a moral compass.
I’ve always had the feeling there was some kind of purpose or higher power. It intrigues me to find very honorable people who say. No thank you! Don’t need it.
I was raised very religious. I find talk of “spirituality,” whether from the conventionally religious or the not so much, a bit impenetrable:
“Oh, I’m not religious, but I’m spiritual.”
Are you going to explain what that means, do you expect me to know what you’re thinking, or is it just something private & undefined that you’re telling me about even though I have no idea what you’re talking about?
Personally, I think a lot of it is a substitute word for a sense of emotional connection to whatever–whether real or imaginary. Me, I think words like passion, belief, religion, & philosophy are appropriate, but I guess some people think “Religion” is a trademark of the Christian Church.
???
I disagree. Frightened people don’t value what they’re afraid of.
What about the sects that focus on the fear of God?
No. I think the difference is more organized religion rather than a person who believes in some sort of higher power but doesn’t buy into specific doctrine or structure. If you want more specifics you can probably just ask. The term christian doesn’t tell me much about a person either.
Religous could mean one of any number of structured and widely recognized religions , not only christian. If someone claims to be religious then I think that they take their religion seriously and actually try to observe it’s beliefs and traditions. You might be a Jew and care nothing about being kosher. If someone is Jewish and says they’re religious then I assume they do care. MAybe thats just me.
:rolleyes: you just had to go there didn’t you
The word spiritual means a lot of different things to different people. I think that everyone is primarily spirit and therefore spiritual in nature. That’s the part of each other we love most. And it’s the spirit of a person that shows up through our words at SDMB.
To me, one of the meanings of being spiritual is having an awareness of our inter-connectedness to all things. The person doesn’t have to acknowledge the existence of a Creator or a higher being. In fact, that person might not even describe herself of himself as spiritual.
And that’s just one kind of spirituality.
Are you saying you see no reason to care what happens to others around you in this life if this is all there is?
Liberal, this has been one of your most helpful threads. (Helpful and affirming to me, that is.)
So the only reason you’re a moral person is because God has bribed you with the promise of eternal life?
I think it is a legimate comment. You are allowed to disagree.
Being religious does not now prevent, and never has prevented, someone from having a bloated sense of their abilities and a desire to enforce their will on others just because they can.
The question for me is where does honor and morals come from for atheists? From purely a logical point of view, if this brief life is all there is and we have no spiritual connection to others, then yeah, I don’t see a reason to care about others if it doesn’t have some direct benifit to me and those in my immediate social circle. You can observe this type of attitude every day. I’m not saying I actually feel that way. I hope my other posts make it clear I don’t
I’m only suggesting that from a logical stand point it makes sense doesn’t it?
Scott made a similar statement and I already responded. God hasn’t bribed me with anything. For me it’s about discovering the truth of who we really are. Are we primarily these physical bodies or are we primarily spiritual beings who temporarily inhabit these bodies?
I’m asking what the purpose of morals are for those who really believe that we are not connected and this brief physical life is all there is? If we believe that to be true then what practical purpose do morals serve? Are they reasonable and logical?
Think about it. If this life is all there is then doesn’t it really make more sense to be as self serving as possible?
No arguement from me. I just wish we could have a thread without Bush being mentioned. There are other examples. Pick one of those.
How about empathy? The Golden Rule is still pretty worthwhile on its own merits.
Empathy exists, but that doesn’t make it logical or reasonable. Perhaps it is only getting in the way. The golden rule has a religious history so it must be a bunch of baloney anyway.
Why settle for second best? GW has the ability to affect the lives of more honest-to-God people than most and so immediately comes to mind. You pick whomever you want to illustrate your points and I’ll do the same.
And you seem to be saying that if you discovered that the “truth” were that these physical bodies are all we got, there’d be no reason not to go out and rape or steal or whatever. Am I missing something here?
Enlightened self-interest. If I go around fucking other people over, they’re going to try to fuck me over in response. I don’t want to be fucked over, so I act accordingly.
“Self interest” is also a subjective term. I’d rather people like me than I have a lot of money, because being liked makes me feel better than being rich. If someone prefers being rich to being liked, there’s no absolute authority I can point to that says he’s wrong, and so there’s no reason for him not to do whatever he can to get ahead, if the rest of us let him get away with it.
Absolutly. But do you want to think short term, or long term? In the long term, you’ll generally get farther if you learn to get along with the people around you.
That’s good to know. Thanks, Zoe.