# What is with all of the hate for Gray Davis? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 29, 2003, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150 "2003-05-29T01:05:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![SuaSponte](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/67e7ee/32.png) [@SuaSponte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuaSponte)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/41 "2003-07-03T01:38:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by rjung \* > \*\*Don’t expect any help from the Federal Government – or, as Dick Cheney liked to say, “You don’t have an energy crisis, you people just use too much.” > > Considering this was before the whole Enron fiasco/scam/rip-off came to light, it deserves the biggest :rolleyes: one can muster. \*\* Gaaah, shades of **AceOSpades** 1. The California energy crisis began in June **2000** - for those of you following at home, that was during the Clinton presidency. 2. The FERC under Clinton refused to impose energy price caps in November 2000. 3. FERC, under the Bushies, did the same thing, until (May or) June 2001, when it imposed caps. 4. So, the federal government, under **both** the Dems and the Pubbies, came to the same conclusion - “you morons out there caused the problem, you fix it.” 5. And California caused its own problem, in two ways. _First_ it deregulated wholesale energy prices while keeping caps on retail prices. A first grader can point out the problem with that. _Second,_ Californians, while continuing to increase electricity usage, consistently refused to allow the construction of new electricity-generating plants within their state, in a classic example of NIMBYism gone amok. 6. Enron and other energy companies (some illegally, some legally) took advantage of California’s distortion of the energy market to increase their profits. That always happens when governments clumsily interefere in the markets - _see_ Great Britain, the ERM, and Bloody Tuesday (was it Tuesday?) For an extensive history of the California energy crisis, as well as a truly bizarre episode of “ **Sua,** you didn’t write what you wrote, you wrote what I want to think you wrote – and you were dead wrong!!,” kindly read this [thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=115418&highlight=energy+crisis) Sua ---
**Author:** ![Aceospades](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/848f3c/32.png) [@Aceospades](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aceospades)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/42 "2003-07-03T14:26:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SuaSponte \* > \*\*Gaaah, shades of **AceOSpades** > > \*\* HAY, DON’T DRAG ME INTO THIS! I’m assuming that you were referring to \*\*[Ace of Swords](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/member.php?action=getinfo&userid=15377) \*\*and not me. Before he changed his name he used to be known as Ace0spades, that’s with the #0 not the letter O. I always hated him for that. If you are referring to me, you’re pulling it out of your ass because I agree with pretty much what you posted. Get to know me. I’ve been here for a while and I lurk quite a lot (although not so much in GD. That there where all dem smart people go). As for the discussion at hand. California is in a deep pile of poop. This administration (and our society in general) needs some one to blame. Though I’m sure Gray Davis deserves some of the blame, he probably doesn’t deserve all of it. Of course that’s not going to stop Washington. I’m not blaming the Republican or the Democrats; I’m blaming the system. Damn the system! ---
**Author:** ![SuaSponte](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/67e7ee/32.png) [@SuaSponte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuaSponte)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/43 "2003-07-03T18:36:25Z")
Aye matey, I mean the dude who was, er had, a zero, not you. Sua ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/44 "2003-07-03T20:03:50Z")
A new twist to the Grey Davis recall fiasco: [URL=http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/030703/31/4kmcz.html] **Local GOP faction launches anti-recall campaign** [/quote] ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/45 "2003-07-03T21:33:58Z")
Fixed it: [Local GOP faction launches anti-recall campaign](http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/030703/31/4kmcz.html) – **viva** ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/46 "2003-07-03T21:55:28Z")
**Sua** I suggest you go [here](http://www3.ferc.fed.us/) to see how much market manipulation the FERC discovered and how the investigations are still ongoing. Yes, the FERC originally said, “no problem”, but they only really did the most cursory investigations. After Enron imploded the FERC basically re-opened all of it’s investigations and have since found hundreds of violations. What Davis could have done early in the crisis is kept the state out of the power buying business if it had been better managed. Technically the California Public Utilites Commision was in charge and they really dropped the ball, not allowing long-term contracting by the utilities and not raising rates. But the CPUC was definitely taking it’s lead from Davis. The utilites became so fiscally unstable they could not transact in the enrgy market and the state took over, which has been an extrmemly expensive and regulatory messy situation. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2003, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/47 "2003-07-04T03:19:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Gangster Octopus \* > \*\*[ Yes, the FERC originally said, “no problem”, but they only really did the most cursory investigations. After Enron imploded the FERC basically re-opened all of it’s investigations and have since found hundreds of violations. > > \*\* And also, they re-opened their investigations after control of the Senate changed to Democrat hands, as did the chairmanship of the relevant oversight committees. A coincidence, I’m sure. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2003, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/48 "2003-07-04T05:34:32Z")
\*\* jsc1953\*\*, are you saying that the decision to pressure FERC was politically motivated, or the decision to **not** pressire them was politically motivated? ---
**Author:** ![Monster104](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Monster104](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monster104)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2003, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/49 "2003-07-04T06:21:51Z")
The reason I dislike Gray Davis? Well, among other things (like his tax policies), he brought California from a $12 Billion surplus at the start of his first term to a current $38.2 Billion deficit. California has rotted and deteriorated under his governorship. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2003, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150/50 "2003-07-04T17:01:13Z")
One thing people here in California don’t realise, or refuse to realise: Their energy prices are still realtively low. I moved from PA to CA (PA being the state where deregulation ‘worked’ meaning it didn’t do a damn thing for prices.) and found my bill was shockingly low despite all the horror stories I’d ben told about “my bill increaed 100%!! from last year!!!”. The East coast has been paying way above CA rates for decades. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-with-all-of-the-hate-for-gray-davis/178150.md?page=2)