# What is your ongoing opinion of the Affordable Care Act? (Title Edited) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 17, 2013, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561 "2013-01-17T23:21:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 189
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3762 "2016-01-09T04:51:49Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > He thinks that being okay with a political promise being almost completely delivered, is the same thing as being okay with making laws to denigrate Muslims. What? No, I don’t. Why would you say that? I’ve repeatedly noted that, no matter how you _first_ phrased your small-subset rule, you’ve _since_ spelled out that you’re okay with one but not the other; thus, being okay with one doesn’t mean you’re okay with the other. That you claim I think otherwise shows a lack of understanding. > [@](#): > > I’d say that something that falls short for some small number of people and hits those people at random, isn’t the same thing as something that hits a specific group on purpose. Er, yes; I know; that’s why I’ve repeatedly noted that you say you’re okay with one but not the other. Your position is both understandable and understood. > [@](#): > > He’s certainly gonna declare victory since I’m not going to engage him any further, but hopefully most of you will see how little merit such a declaration has. Uh – what? Obama lied; I don’t give him a pass on that; you do, and you add that you’d give a pass to other liars; and, when pressed for details, you add that there are _some_ lie-about-a-small-subset types you wouldn’t give a pass to. I’m not sure how that entitles me to declare victory; as far as I can tell, you and I blandly _agree_ that Obama lied, and that I don’t give him a pass on it, and that you do, and that you’d give a pass to yet other liars – and, naturally, that there are various lie-about-a-small-subset types that even you wouldn’t give a pass to. What’s the dispute? ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3763 "2016-01-09T06:05:12Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > The statement, which is true in the vast majority of the cases, had nothing to do with passing the bill or “founding” it. Was your old plan compliant? If not, you couldn’t keep it. Was your old insurer going out of business? If so, you could hardly keep it, could you? Almost everybody kept their old plans. For a very limited number, they could not keep their plan. Since the statement is true for many more people than it was not, it cannot be said with a straight face to be a lie. That’s not what he said though. He said (over and over again) that you could keep your plan, not that you could keep your plan if it were “compliant” with the ACA. Even _Clarence Page_ acknowledges that Obama was fibbing. Why can’t you? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3764 "2016-01-09T06:15:05Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > That’s not what he said though. He said (over and over again) that you could keep your plan, not that you could keep your plan if it were “compliant” with the ACA. > > Even _Clarence Page_ acknowledges that Obama was fibbing. Why can’t you? Clarence Page is a liar! Kidding. Kidding. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3765 "2016-01-09T12:44:46Z")
Even Clarence Page! Gasp! Even him? I’ll most likely be mighty damned impressed. soon as I look up who Clarence Page is! Oh. Him. Well, OK. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3766 "2016-01-09T13:29:20Z")
THe President won Lie of the Year. Of course he was fibbing. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3767 "2016-01-09T13:47:55Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > THe President won Lie of the Year. Of course he was fibbing. But I liked my plan and I could keep it! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3768 "2016-01-09T14:09:13Z")
I liked mine and it went up $150/month in price. Had to pay for all the “free” preventive care that used to have co-pays. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3769 "2016-01-09T14:24:34Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I liked mine and it went up $150/month in price. Had to pay for all the “free” preventive care that used to have co-pays. And how much did your premium go up the previous year, before Obamacare? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3770 "2016-01-09T14:44:06Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I liked mine and it went up $150/month in price. Had to pay for all the “free” preventive care that used to have co-pays. But you could keep it, so he wasn’t lying to you either! ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3771 "2016-01-09T15:02:11Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > That’s not what he said though. He said (over and over again) that you could keep your plan, not that you could keep your plan if it were “compliant” with the ACA. > > Even _Clarence Page_ acknowledges that Obama was fibbing. Why can’t you? Didn’t he also say you could keep your doctor? Suppose your doctor died- does that make Obama a liar? You guys are really grasping at straws. Obama’s statement did nothing to get the bill passed, it did nothing in terms of how the bill read, it did nothing in how the law functioned, it did nothing in terms of premium increases. All it did was give you something to whine about if you look at his statement through enough prisms and call it a lie. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3772 "2016-01-09T15:28:56Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Didn’t he also say you could keep your doctor? Suppose your doctor died- does that make Obama a liar? > > You guys are really grasping at straws. Obama’s statement did nothing to get the bill passed, it did nothing in terms of how the bill read, it did nothing in how the law functioned, it did nothing in terms of premium increases. All it did was give you something to whine about if you look at his statement through enough prisms and call it a lie. The ‘grasping at straws’, to me, is the belief that many of the posters seem to have is that Democrats believe that Obama is a perfect infallible Christ and any possibility that he ever may have told something untrue would shatter our world view, or something. Most of us recognize that Obama is a politician who says things that might be less than fully truthful for political reasons, just as many other politicians do (though according to Politifact he’s more accurate and truthful than most politicians) – we just agree with him more than his opponents. Obama isn’t the best human ever – he’s just a lot better than the alternatives, as are most Democratic candidates and office holders. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3773 "2016-01-09T15:32:38Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > THe President won Lie of the Year. Of course he was fibbing. Is that alone grounds to repeal Obamacare and throw millions of people off of their health insurance? ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2016, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3774 "2016-01-09T19:33:15Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Is that alone grounds to repeal Obamacare and throw millions of people off of their health insurance? Apparently. Still, I’d prefer not to be thrown out of my ACA plan unless someone has another plan, a decent one, that I could snap up immediately. But I’m not supposed to say that the ACA plan I have has been working well for me. I’m not supposed to say that I’m glad I’ve been on it since I’ve had a shit-slew of medical issues and surgeries over the past few years. And I shouldn’t say that my premiums for my PPO plan have just gone down. Why? Because it was all founded on a lie. ---
**Author:** ![Cabbage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@Cabbage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cabbage)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3775 "2016-01-10T14:30:26Z")
I’ve asked this question of Obamacare opponents several times and have not received a satisfactory response (actually, I don’t think I’ve had a response, period); can any opponent here do any better? The president just vetoed a bill to repeal Obamacare without having a ready replacement. Some of you are currently complaining about the fact that some lost their insurance cue to Obamacare; in fact, that’s been one the major complaints against Obamacare (maybe even THE most often complaint referenced). However, these people are allowed to replace their insurance. Please justify to me your position to repeal, considering that millions of people will again lose their insurance, only this time these people will be WITHOUT opportunity of replacement. Please tell me why you are OUTRAGED over the former while at the same time support a position that has the latter as a consequence? Is it simple hypocrisy? Thanks in advance. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3776 "2016-01-10T15:00:21Z")
> [@Cabbage](#): > > I’ve asked this question of Obamacare opponents several times and have not received a satisfactory response (actually, I don’t think I’ve had a response, period); can any opponent here do any better? > > The president just vetoed a bill to repeal Obamacare without having a ready replacement. Some of you are currently complaining about the fact that some lost their insurance cue to Obamacare; in fact, that’s been one the major complaints against Obamacare (maybe even THE most often complaint referenced). However, these people are allowed to replace their insurance. Please justify to me your position to repeal, considering that millions of people will again lose their insurance, only this time these people will be WITHOUT opportunity of replacement. Please tell me why you are OUTRAGED over the former while at the same time support a position that has the latter as a consequence? Is it simple hypocrisy? Thanks in advance. I’ll give you an answer. The people who lost insurance coverage from before obamacare can go back to the shitty policies they used to have. The people who didn’t have any insurance coverage before obamacare won’t be any worse off than they were anyway – i.e., who cares? They will be FREE! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3777 "2016-01-10T15:29:42Z")
> [@Cabbage](#): > > The president just vetoed a bill to repeal Obamacare without having a ready replacement. Some of you are currently complaining about the fact that some lost their insurance cue to Obamacare; in fact, that’s been one the major complaints against Obamacare (maybe even THE most often complaint referenced). If they lost their insurance due to Obamacare, but hadn’t been promised otherwise, then I doubt I’d be objecting at all. If someone tells me he committed perjury to make sure a criminal got convicted, I wouldn’t object to the fact that a criminal got convicted; I’d object to the fact that a criminal got convicted _due to perjury_. I wouldn’t object to him selling a product; I’d object to him selling a product _with false advertising_. I wouldn’t object to him bedding someone, but to him bedding someone _without their consent_. Strictly speaking, yes, I guess the shorthand gets used as “THE most often complaint referenced.” But speaking for _myself,_ the same reason I support fining people who engage in false advertising – and jailing crooks who commit perjury, and disbarring layers who commit fraud, and so on – is what motivates me here. ---
**Author:** ![Cabbage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@Cabbage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cabbage)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3778 "2016-01-10T16:06:29Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > If they lost their insurance due to Obamacare, but hadn’t been promised otherwise, then I doubt I’d be objecting at all. > > If someone tells me he committed perjury to make sure a criminal got convicted, I wouldn’t object to the fact that a criminal got convicted; I’d object to the fact that a criminal got convicted _due to perjury_. I wouldn’t object to him selling a product; I’d object to him selling a product _with false advertising_. I wouldn’t object to him bedding someone, but to him bedding someone _without their consent_. > > Strictly speaking, yes, I guess the shorthand gets used as “THE most often complaint referenced.” But speaking for _myself,_ the same reason I support fining people who engage in false advertising – and jailing crooks who commit perjury, and disbarring layers who commit fraud, and so on – is what motivates me here. It sounds to me like you’re saying what was SAID takes precedence over the outcome. Is this true in every case? Random made up example: Suppose you have two nuclear power plants. Manager of Plant A says his plant is 100% safe; manager of B says there are issues that make his plant at potential liability. Plant A has an accident causing 15 casualties, while plant B’s accident kills 10,000 and leaves the region uninhabitable for 1,000 years… Does manager B get brownie points for being more accurate/honest. Is manager A more reprehensible because he wrong/dishonest? If not, where do you draw the line between what’s said versus outcome? If so, I don’t know what to say other than “ridiculous”. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3779 "2016-01-10T16:33:12Z")
> [@Cabbage](#): > > It sounds to me like you’re saying what was SAID takes precedence over the outcome. Is this true in every case? No, but it’s true in this one. I could think of examples where it’s not… > [@](#): > > Random made up example: Suppose you have two nuclear power plants. Manager of Plant A says his plant is 100% safe; manager of B says there are issues that make his plant at potential liability. Plant A has an accident causing 15 casualties, while plant B’s accident kills 10,000 and leaves the region uninhabitable for 1,000 years… Does manager B get brownie points for being more accurate/honest. Is manager A more reprehensible because he wrong/dishonest? …but I’m not sure _that’s_ a great example. Eh, then again, maybe it is, because it can highlight a whole bunch of points. I’d say, in that case, that Manager A needs to be called to account for his falsehood; we’d presumably do a whole what-did-he-know-and-when-did-he-know-it thing, and we’d presumably make sure he faced legal ramifications for a lie, and so on. If there’s a case to be made that those 15 casualties wouldn’t have occurred because folks would’ve reacted upon hearing the truth from him, I’d like to hear it. But what fascinates me about Manager B is, what, he announced that, and everybody just said they were _cool_ with it? Was his plant operating within the law? I’m not trying to fight the hypothetical, here; I’m trying to _understand_ it: he was honest about what was going on, and nobody said _thanks for bringing that to our attention, how soon can you stop?_ I’m not, uh, 100% sure I follow you. Because, see, that’s what I dislike about what Obama said: he didn’t give people the chance to say they were cool with it, or to say _no, that’s not what we want_; he made a reassuring pitch, and folks nodded when they heard they could keep their plan if they liked it, and they didn’t get to weigh in on the actual policy. If you’re telling me folks heard what Manager B said and okayed it _anyway_ – well, (a) that’s _weird_; but what’s more, (b) it’s _different_, in a strangely relevant way. ---
**Author:** ![Cabbage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@Cabbage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cabbage)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3780 "2016-01-10T17:15:28Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > I’m not trying to fight the hypothetical, here; I’m trying to _understand_ it: he was honest about what was going on, and nobody said _thanks for bringing that to our attention, how soon can you stop?_ I’m not, uh, 100% sure I follow you. Actually, I think you are trying to fight the hypothetical. Just ignore the legality about whether the plant should stay open, the issue is simply what was said versus what happened, period. It is a gedankenexperiment. But there’s another reason I claim you’re fighting the hypothetical. _You never answered the question._ Namely, by what criteria do you judge the outcome trumps what was said versus vice versa. Use your own example if you wish (though I reserve the right to disagree (with stated reasons) that it is a relevant example, of course). One more side issue–The passage of the bill PRECEDED the promise. To me that means you can’t claim it’s passage was supported by that promise, in that sense it wasn’t advertised falsely. The advertising period was over. I’m not saying you don’t have a point there, I just don’t think it’s properly labeled as “false advertising”. More like (false) encouragement during implementation (which had already been settled on). One more final thing (and I honestly don’t know all the details here; if anything I say here is wrong, it’s simply ignorance on my part, not intent to mislead). At the time I was under the impression that the bill did have a clause that all pre-existing plans were to be grandfathered in, even if they didn’t meat ACA standards–PROVIDED the plan was not altered in any way. Ultimately, some plans WERE changed, and these were the plans that were dropped. (I believe I heard Obama knew of this issue when making the original claim, but as I believe that was from Fox News, I’m skeptical). At the last moment Obama made a last minute amendment that those plans could be restored (by that time it was too late/difficult for the companies to resume those plans. Anyway, to me, that does ameliorate Obama somewhat–The intent was there, but third party factors did not allow it. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2016, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/3781 "2016-01-10T17:39:26Z")
> [@Cabbage](#): > > Actually, I think you are trying to fight the hypothetical. Just ignore the legality about whether the plant should stay open, the issue is simply what was said versus what happened, period. Ignore the legality of – ? If he told everyone what he was doing, and it was entirely legal, then in your rather bizarre hypothetical I have a hard time imagining what crime we’d charge the honest man with. I also have a hard time imagining what kind of society he’d be living in; if the whole thing was brought to our attention ahead of time, and we said “meh” then, I’m not sure we can do anything but say “meh” when it then happens. > [@](#): > > I claim you’re fighting the hypothetical. _You never answered the question._ Namely, by what criteria do you judge the outcome trumps what was said versus vice versa. Use your own example if you wish (though I reserve the right to disagree (with stated reasons) that it is a relevant example, of course). How about the classic Murderer At The Door hypothetical that makes Kant look silly? Imagine a would-be murderer comes to my door, and asks whether his intended victim is in my house. Do I lie to him? Of course. I’m not lying to him because I want a better outcome for _him_; he can face a firing squad for all I care. In this scenario, I’m lying to him because the person I’m sheltering would, if asked, lie to save herself. That’s assuming, of course, that she’s sensible. And I’ll stand up, afterward – again, assuming we’re in a society of reasonable people, and not the ones from your bizarre hypothetical – and proudly tell them what I’ve done, right down to explaining that I lied to the the guy because he deserves to face a firing squad; _you can put me on that firing squad if you like,_ I’d add, figuring they’d mull it while giving me a medal. Now, if Obama would like to stand up and proudly say it was an honor to lie to those people because they’re the kind of people who deserved to be shot instead of reasoned with – well, then we’d be having a different conversation. But that ain’t the case in this case. > [@](#): > > One more side issue–The passage of the bill PRECEDED the promise. To me that means you can’t claim it’s passage was supported by that promise, in that sense it wasn’t advertised falsely. The advertising period was over. I’m not saying you don’t have a point there, I just don’t think it’s properly labeled as “false advertising”. More like (false) encouragement during implementation (which had already been settled on). No, he also made the promise before passage of the bill. > [@](#): > > One more final thing (and I honestly don’t know all the details here; if anything I say here is wrong, it’s simply ignorance on my part, not intent to mislead). At the time I was under the impression that the bill did have a clause that all pre-existing plans were to be grandfathered in, even if they didn’t meat ACA standards–PROVIDED the plan was not altered in any way. I’m under the impression that, no, that’s not true. If that’s the key for you, I guess we could both post cites and see who happens to be right? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561.md?page=188) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561.md?page=190)