# What is your ongoing opinion of the Affordable Care Act? (Title Edited) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 17, 2013, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561 "2013-01-17T23:21:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/101 "2013-05-11T18:17:39Z")
> [@Kevbo](#): > > This is wrong. Unlike car insurance, 20 somethings are low risk, low cost health insurance customers. This law increases the number of young healthy people paying premiums (or having parents do so) that subsidize the old sickies. The new law facilitates social responsibility, rather than encouraging freeloading. In the case of car insurance, I think we could say that 20 somethings get cheaper insurance because of older drivers who end up subsidizing younger, riskier drivers. > [@adaher](#): > > It wouldn’t be. But a lot of young people don’t know that. Be interesting to see how sticker shock affects their voting behavior in 2014 and beyond. You might be selling the young short on this issue. ---
**Author:** ![2ManyTacos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/3da27b/32.png) [@2ManyTacos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2ManyTacos)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/102 "2013-05-11T18:29:40Z")
You have to realize that the vast, _vast_ majority of young people who head into the exchanges are going to qualify for financial assistance - assuming they don’t qualify for Medicaid in which case they’d pay virtually nothing anyway - so any increased costs that they’d otherwise have to shoulder are going to be hugely mitigated by federal subsidies. Of course, that won’t stop the media or GOP from seizing upon the one or two people (out of the newly insured millions) who struggle because of the law and turning that into a huge overblown mess. And seriously, this idea of sticker shock in itself might be oversold. [The law might actually decrease premiums in New York.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/05/06/obamacare-could-lower-premiums-in-new-york-new-study-finds/) And in Oregon, [insurers are already having to reduce their rates because of the law’s emphasis on competition.](http://thinkprogress.org/health/2013/05/10/1994331/obamacare-forcing-insurers-lower-premiums/) One other thing that I want to point out: The 2014 midterms will be held at the end of that year, by which point we will have all been living with the enacted ACA for nearly twelve months. Any outrage, hatred, or similar quirks with the law will have been largely identified by then, and public discontent will have basically simmered down as HHS and the administration work to finish ironing everything out. I just cannot foresee this sustained hatred of the ACA carrying over into next year. For the past three years, the GOP has been working tirelessly to mischaracterize the law, and one of the reasons that they’ve been so successful at that is because Dems and the O administration haven’t struck back with ACA endorsements _because the law has always been several years out from being fully implemented._ All of that - again, ALL of that - is going to change over this summer as the massive public outreach campaign begins and individuals finally start signing up for coverage, at which point the GOP will no longer be the singular lying cynical hateful voice in the room. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/103 "2013-05-11T21:49:34Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It wouldn’t be. But a lot of young people don’t know that. And somehow, Obamacare proponents were remiss in not informing them? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Docta\_G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/2bfe46/32.png) [@Docta\_G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Docta_G)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2013, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/104 "2013-05-11T21:52:39Z")
Can’t wait; hope it’s expanded into a real health care system. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/105 "2013-05-12T02:20:27Z")
> [@Docta\_G](#): > > Can’t wait; hope it’s expanded into a real health care system. Like the rest of the advanced world? Nah, never gonna happen - we are exceptional :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/106 "2013-05-12T03:11:56Z")
Oh yeah, it’s going to be a train wreck: > **[Grace-Marie Turner: Applying for ObamaCare: Still Not Simple](https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424127887323744604578471270125429296)** > > In The Wall Street Journal, Grace-Marie Turner says that despite the president's boast, it has not become easier to get government assistance to pay a health-insurance premium Given that it’s about as complex as doing taxes, most Americans might have to get professionals to fill out the applications for them. That’s going to make some people rich pretty quickly. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/107 "2013-05-12T06:58:40Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Oh yeah, it’s going to be a train wreck: > > [http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323744604578471270125429296.html](http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323744604578471270125429296.html) > > Given that it’s about as complex as doing taxes, most Americans might have to get professionals to fill out the applications for them. That’s going to make some people rich pretty quickly. Wow, a WSJ opinion page. Those guys have never been wrong. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/108 "2013-05-12T07:30:51Z")
The form is more complex than a 1040. You really think most people are going to be able to do this right? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/109 "2013-05-12T07:31:45Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The form is more complex than a 1040. You really think most people are going to be able to do this right? I think when it’s finished it will work well enough. Especially the intarweb version. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/110 "2013-05-12T07:48:11Z")
It was “finished” when it was 21 pages, and the uproar(by the WSJ, BTW) caused them to go back to the drawing board. The President seems to think the 3-page version is “finished”, but I guess that’s out the window now. Perhaps he should try filling one out himself before declaring it simplified enough. More importantly, he needs to whip his bureaucracy into shape. They don’t do simple unless forced to by Presidential leadership. If he doesn’t focus on implementation, it is going to be his Katrina in terms of how badly it exposes his shortcomings as a manager of his administration. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 7:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/111 "2013-05-12T07:53:12Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It was “finished” when it was 21 pages, and the uproar(by the WSJ, BTW) caused them to go back to the drawing board. The President seems to think the 3-page version is “finished”, but I guess that’s out the window now. Perhaps he should try filling one out himself before declaring it simplified enough. > > More importantly, he needs to whip his bureaucracy into shape. They don’t do simple unless forced to by Presidential leadership. If he doesn’t focus on implementation, it is going to be his Katrina in terms of how badly it exposes his shortcomings as a manager of his administration. The one that ships when the exchanges are open is the finished version. You seem to have a partisan need for Obama to be wrong and are twisting whatever information you have to further that need. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/112 "2013-05-12T08:06:45Z")
When will the exchanges open? Think that will happen on time? I don’t need Obama to be wrong, I need him to not screw up our health care system because his baby isn’t ready for prime time. I need him to do his damn job. He should be spending nearly all his time on ACA implementation between now and the end of the year. But I guess the concerns of Democratic Congressmen merit the same dismissals as Graham and McCain’s on Benghazi. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/113 "2013-05-12T08:23:02Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > When will the exchanges open? Think that will happen on time? I hope so. The GOP is fighting hard to screw it up for partisan gain. > [@](#): > > I don’t need Obama to be wrong, I need him to not screw up our health care system because his baby isn’t ready for prime time. I need him to do his damn job. He should be spending nearly all his time on ACA implementation between now and the end of the year. The president doesn’t need to write rules. They have people for that. Do you think Jack actually makes the burgers? > [@](#): > > But I guess the concerns of Democratic Congressmen merit the same dismissals as Graham and McCain’s on Benghazi. Graham and McCain are partisan children who threw a months long tantrum about nothing at all. I think the congresspersons who are worried about the roll out of the ACA actually have a real concern. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/114 "2013-05-12T08:35:01Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > I hope so. The GOP is fighting hard to screw it up for partisan gain. The GOP can’t stop the exchanges from opening. Only bureaucratic incompetence can do that. > [@](#): > > The president doesn’t need to write rules. They have people for that. Do you think Jack actually makes the burgers? Of course he doesn’t. What he does need to do is reign in his bureaucracy, whose natural tendency is to make simple things complicated. They do work for him, after all. While he delegates actual rule writing to them, he does set expectations. If this whole thing goes tits up he can’t just blame his underlings. Or Republicans. The law has been passed already. Republicans can’t do anything about that short of repeal. Anything screwed up is screwed up because Democrats and the President screwed up. To the extent the GOP is responsible, they are only responsible for not bailing the Democrats out whenever problems come up. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/115 "2013-05-12T10:53:27Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > The GOP can’t stop the exchanges from opening. Only bureaucratic incompetence can do that. > > Of course he doesn’t. What he does need to do is reign in his bureaucracy, whose natural tendency is to make simple things complicated. They do work for him, after all. While he delegates actual rule writing to them, he does set expectations. > > If this whole thing goes tits up he can’t just blame his underlings. Or Republicans. The law has been passed already. Republicans can’t do anything about that short of repeal. Anything screwed up is screwed up because Democrats and the President screwed up. To the extent the GOP is responsible, they are only responsible for not bailing the Democrats out whenever problems come up. Republicans are certainly trying. They’re attempting to cut funding and any number of other things. If it takes destroying the economy, I’m sure they’d do that if they thought they could get away with it. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/116 "2013-05-12T11:05:42Z")
Republicans have tried to do various things, but without the President’s signature they can’t actually do anything in regards to the health care law. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/117 "2013-05-12T11:06:46Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Republicans have tried to do various things, but without the President’s signature they can’t actually do anything in regards to the health care law. Other than say, refuse to raise the debt ceiling unless some restriction is placed on the ACA. ---
**Author:** ![2ManyTacos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/3da27b/32.png) [@2ManyTacos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2ManyTacos)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/118 "2013-05-12T17:45:42Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Oh yeah, it’s going to be a train wreck: > > [http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323744604578471270125429296.html](http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323744604578471270125429296.html) > > Given that it’s about as complex as doing taxes, most Americans might have to get professionals to fill out the applications for them. That’s going to make some people rich pretty quickly. Dude, it says at the bottom of the page that the writer of the article also wrote _Why ObamaCare is Bad for America._ Do you think she has a fucking bone to pick with the law? :dubious: And seriously, this constant GOP obstruction of the law is beyond unjustifiable. Remember when one of the centerpiece components of last year’s election was supposed to be “let the American people decide if they want the ACA?” Every fucking thing about the law was debated ad nauseum throughout the campaign, and even still Obama won by a landslide over Mr. Romney. By that logic, doesn’t Obama have the mandate to see to it that the ACA is effectively implemented? Shouldn’t the GOP lay off and stop trying to stymie the ACA at every turn? You know DAMN well that the entire GOP establishment would have talked repeatedly about a “mandate” to take down the ACA if Mittens had become POTUS. Instead, he lost overwhelmingly, so the opposite should (ostensibly) be true. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/119 "2013-05-12T17:54:02Z")
Not necessarily. The health care law was not a big part of the campaign. But that’s not really relevant anyway. What is, is that the Republicans have no power to obstruct the health care law. Any shortcomings of the implementation are 100% Democrats’ fault. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2013, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561/120 "2013-05-12T18:02:29Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Not necessarily. The health care law was not a big part of the campaign. But that’s not really relevant anyway. What is, is that the Republicans have no power to obstruct the health care law. Any shortcomings of the implementation are 100% Democrats’ fault. That’s just nonsense. The sequester is certainly mostly the Republican’s fault, since they were the ones unwilling to compromise. If the sequester causes an implementation delay, that’s 100% the Dem’s fault? Or if the GOP decides to not increase the debt ceiling and shatters the economy, that would be the Dem’s fault? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-is-your-ongoing-opinion-of-the-affordable-care-act-title-edited/647561.md?page=7)