# What kinda gear did Dinosaurs have? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 31, 2005, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695 "2005-10-31T09:42:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/1 "2005-10-31T09:42:25Z")
A friend was musing about dinosaur penises the other day. I stated with confident authority that dinosaurs had cloacae, rather than penises and vaginas. He was very impressed that I would know so much about dinosaurs, the holes they passed stuff through, and the plural of the word cloaca. Of course I had not researched this topic at all. I had pretty much just pulled this idea out of one of the holes that I pass stuff through, but I was happy to accept the reverence that my higher “knowledge” had won me. So what’s the Straight Dope on dinosaurs and their gear??? ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/2 "2005-10-31T13:06:57Z")
Even if the female has a cloaca, the male still has a penis. I was under the impression that they thought dinosaurs, despite controversies about endothermy vs. exothermy, were still very lizard-like in most ways, and had the cloaca and penis system. I might be completely wrong. Despite being a big dinosaur fan, I don’t recall this coming up in my reading. For what it’s worth, there’s a picture of dinosaurs having sex in William Stout’s book **Dinosaurs** (There’s also one of a dinosaur pooping, for you completists). He tried to keep up with the latest research, so I assume his pioctuere shows what current thought was on the topic. The movie **Caveman** shows Jack Gilford as a caveman unintentionally stroking a T. Rex’s penis – the only time a dinosaur sex organ has appeared in a movie, as far as I know. I wouldn’t take its appearance as canonical, though. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/3 "2005-10-31T14:51:10Z")
All male reptiles (that is, non-avian ones), except the Tuatara, have penises. This includes crocodilians, which are the most closely related non-avian reptiles to dinosaurs. And a number of birds, which are descended from dinosaurs, including more primitive groups such as ostriches and other ratites and ducks, have penises. Other birds most likely secondarily lost their penises evolutionarily because of the need to reduce weight for flight. I see no reason to think that dinosaurs would not have had penises. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/4 "2005-10-31T15:26:59Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > The movie **Caveman** shows Jack Gilford as a caveman unintentionally stroking a T. Rex’s penis – the only time a dinosaur sex organ has appeared in a movie, as far as I know. I wouldn’t take its appearance as canonical, though. Certainly wouldn’t given the basic error of placing the caveman and the Dino in the same place at the same time… ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/5 "2005-10-31T15:41:51Z")
Depending on their evolutionary affinity with lizards and snakes, dinosaurs may have even been equipped with two. Snakes and lizards have a pair called hemipenes. They only use one at a time. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/6 "2005-10-31T15:48:40Z")
> [@Crotalus](#): > > Depending on their evolutionary affinity with lizards and snakes, dinosaurs may have even been equipped with two. Snakes and lizards have a pair called hemipenes. They only use one at a time. Dinosaurs are much closer evolutionarily to crocodilians and birds, which have a single penis. ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/7 "2005-10-31T16:02:51Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Dinosaurs are much closer evolutionarily to crocodilians and birds, which have a single penis. I figured you might add to my knowledge on this, I thought about asking you to chime in. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/8 "2005-10-31T16:12:39Z")
> [@Crotalus](#): > > I figured you might add to my knowledge on this, I thought about asking you to chime in. Thanks. Incidentally, crocodilian and bird penises are quite different from mammalian ones, and are not homologous. They are usually kept inside the body, and only everted through the cloacal opening when in use. Semen does not pass through a urethra (which they of course lack) but instead along a groove on the penis. [More on crocodilian penises](http://www.crocodilian.com/crocfaq/faq-8.html) (Possibly not safe-for-work unless you work for a veterinarian.) ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/9 "2005-10-31T16:18:47Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Incidentally, crocodilian and bird penises are quite different from mammalian ones, and are not homologous. They are usually kept inside the body, and only everted through the cloacal opening when in use. Semen does not pass through a urethra (which they of course lack) but instead along a groove on the penis. > > [More on crocodilian penises](http://www.crocodilian.com/crocfaq/faq-8.html) (Possibly not safe-for-work unless you work for a veterinarian.) Thanks for the link. I manually everted many snakes in my days as a colubrid breeder. I’ve never tried that on a croc! ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/10 "2005-10-31T16:54:31Z")
It might be worth noting that what we have for dinosaur fossils are almost exclusively “hard parts” – bones and teeth, and no jokes about hard-ons, please! There are only a few fossils where any part of the soft tissue (skin, internal organs, and so on) have been preserved at all, and none of them, AFAIK, happen to have preserved the sex organs. For the record, in terms of cladistics, the Amniotes (everything which has embryos supported in an amnion, the “bag of waters,” whether egg-laying or live-bearing, and equivalent to the old groups of reptiles, birds, and mammals) are broken down into: **Anapsids** : a few primitive reptiles and the turtles **Synapsids** : sailbacks and their allies, mammal-like reptiles, and mammals **Lepidosaurs** : snakes, lizards, the tuatara and its extinct relatives, ichthyosaurs, plesiosaurs, and all their kin **Archosaurs** : dinosaurs, flying reptiles, crocodilians, and birds, along with a few other minor extinct groups While a thoroughgoing cladist would insist on redefining things to distinguish a few genera or families as “outgroups” to the above, it’s a pretty clear four-part distinction going back to the earliest amniote forms, which allows for differentiating all the major living and extinct amniote forms that anyone not a specialist has ever heard of. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/11 "2005-10-31T18:21:37Z")
So a crocodile is more closely related to a parrot than it is to a Komodo dragon? Interesting. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/12 "2005-10-31T18:24:15Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > So a crocodile is more closely related to a parrot than it is to a Komodo dragon? Interesting. This is correct. For this reason cladists no longer consider “reptiles” a valid taxonomic category, or if they do they include birds within it. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/13 "2005-10-31T18:39:48Z")
So…the plural of penis. Is it still penes? Or are we allowed to say penises? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/14 "2005-10-31T18:56:59Z")
> [@Inigo Montoya](#): > > So…the plural of penis. Is it still penes? Or are we allowed to say penises? The English plural of penis is penises. The Latin plural of penis is penes. Take your pick. I usually prefer to use an English plural if one is available. You, however, are not allowed to say either. _You_ must refer to them as “dinosaur dinguses”. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![alterego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6bbea6/32.png) [@alterego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alterego)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/15 "2005-10-31T19:07:17Z")
This all begs the question - how big? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/16 "2005-10-31T19:10:50Z")
There is a bone called a chevron at the base of crocodiles’ tail that the penis is anchored to; some dinosaurs have the same bone. Therefore, there’s a good chance dinos did have penises. Google is clogged with penis stuff, so this is the best cite I can find : [Link](http://members.tripod.com/~megalania/recap.html) > [@](#): > > Female tyrannosaurs were larger than males. That’s the conclusion of Peter Larson from the Black Hills Institute of Geological Research in South Dakota, following his discovery of two distinct body types in “T. rex”. “The pelvis in the robust form is wider inside, which might be an indication that this form is female,” says Larson. Further evidence comes from a living descendent of dinosaurs. Male crocodiles have an extra bone known as a chevron at the base of their tail where the muscle that retracts the penis is attached. \*\*The same is true of saurornithoides, a group of dinosaurs from China that are closely related to tyrannosaurs. \*\*Larson is looking for a similar pattern. “I haven’t got absolute proof on “T. rex” yet,” he admits. The clincher will come later this year when the robust skeleton of Sue, the most complete “T. rex” ever found, goes on display at Denver Museum of Natural History. “I believe we’re going to find that Sue has one less chevron than the males,” says Larson. ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/17 "2005-10-31T19:15:54Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > The English plural of penis is penises. The Latin plural of penis is penes. Take your pick. I usually prefer to use an English plural if one is available. > > You, however, are not allowed to say either. _You_ must refer to them as “dinosaur dinguses”. 😉 But…wouldn’t that be dinosaur dinges? and are they still called dinosaurs? I thought the term had become outdated? Science is so confusing! ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/18 "2005-10-31T21:18:58Z")
> [@](#): > > But…wouldn’t that be dinosaur dinges? No, dingi. Words ending in -us are generally second declension, and have a plural ending in -i. Words ending in -is, despite sounding very similar in English pronounciation, are generally third declension, and have a plural ending in -es (there are many other possible singular endings in the third declension, as well). ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/19 "2005-10-31T21:26:30Z")
“Dingus” being a pseudo-Latinate English word, there is no Latin plural, and the English plural is a regular “dinguses.” And while “penises” is equally correct with “penes” (and substantially clearer in speech that you’re talking about more than one male organ), the proper plural when you’re making reference to the bifurcated male genitalia of snakes and lizards is “hemipenes” – being a technical term, it appears to require the Latin plural in English. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695/20 "2005-10-31T21:33:54Z")
> [@](#): > > “Dingus” being a pseudo-Latinate English word, there is no Latin plural, and the English plural is a regular “dinguses.” Since it’s pseudo-Latin to begin with, couldn’t we amuse ourselves in coming u with whatever plural we want? Mayber it’s third declenasion irregular, like the infamous “octopus/octopodes” I kinda like the idea of “dingopodes” Or you ca go all-out Ned Flanders-like “dingo-diddly-des” [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-kinda-gear-did-dinosaurs-have/328695.md?page=2)