# What made/makes the Germans so good at what they do? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 29, 2021, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560 "2021-09-29T01:43:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2021, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/41 "2021-09-30T22:28:43Z")
> [@Pardel-Lux](#): > > No it did not. The label was [imposed](https://history.stackexchange.com/questions/17724/when-were-country-of-origin-labels-e-g-made-in-france-introduced) on German products by the British, who wanted the people of Britain (and the USA!) to know they were buying an inferior product. That was back in the 1880’s. Yep, in the 1880s, Germany’s industry to Great Britain’s was what is now China’s to the rest of the world. After the unification of Germany in 1871, it was on a steady industrial rise, with a lot of help from industrial espionage as well. The label “Made In Germany” should repel British people from buying German products, but it soon turned out to be a label for great quality at a lesser price and backfired. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2021, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/42 "2021-10-01T15:51:27Z")
I’m about to pick up from the library John Kampfner’s [Why the Germans do it better : notes from a grown-up country](https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/54443313-why-the-germans-do-it-better) Of course, it may turn out to be more about why we do things worse, like a fair number of predecessors, but it may be of relevance to this discussion. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2021, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/43 "2021-10-01T16:34:33Z")
> [@PatrickLondon](#): > > I’m about to pick up from the library John Kampfner’s [Why the Germans do it better : notes from a grown-up country](https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/54443313-why-the-germans-do-it-better) Thanks for the tip! I’m always interested in outside perspectives of how the world sees our country and our politics. I’ll put this book on my wish list. What has always befuddled me is the discrepancy between the general positive picture of German politics and society by the outside world and our self-reflection, which tends to be doubting and fearful (German angst). As long as I’ve been politically aware (since the mid-70s, which was the time of RAF terror), Germany has been in permanent crisis-mode, one crisis chasing the other, at least according to our own assessment. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2021, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/44 "2021-10-01T21:06:10Z")
> [@PozhanPop](#): > > Greatest Music ever written Ha ha ha. No. Not _even_ Einsturzende Neubauten. ---
**Author:** ![PozhanPop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pozhanpop/32/8022_2.png) [@PozhanPop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PozhanPop)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/45 "2021-10-02T04:52:05Z")
I changed greatest to great. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/46 "2021-10-02T07:48:58Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > German angst Is there any other kind of _angst_? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 8:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/47 "2021-10-02T08:28:03Z")
Austrian and Swiss? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/48 "2021-10-02T08:50:56Z")
Technically both German (as would be Lichtensteiner and South Tyrolean _angst_) Maybe Yiddish _angst_? Or does that even exist, or would that only be _tsuris_? ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/49 "2021-10-02T08:52:59Z")
There I am _überfragt_, sorry. Which is a roundabout way to say: good question. 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![Tatterdemalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/43a26b/32.png) [@Tatterdemalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tatterdemalion)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 9:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/50 "2021-10-02T09:38:35Z")
And, as is traditional, it is asked on a Friday evening. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/51 "2021-10-02T11:18:11Z")
Not here, it’s not. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/52 "2021-10-02T12:51:05Z")
We Jews tend to externalize our angst in the form of _kvetching_ and self-depricating humor. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/53 "2021-10-02T22:07:10Z")
In a video chat from the Tank Museum (UK), the director discusses engineering philosophy, with particular relation to WWII tanks. He describes the British engineering philosophy as “the appearance of effortless brilliance”, the German as “big, complicated, beautiful and expensive”, and the Russian as “brutal straightforwardness”. He discusses the Tiger I and also uses the example of fake tank vision slits - while the British painted them on, the Germans manufactured them. [Director at Home | What's the best Tank? | The Tank Museum - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFYHhTc0E2g&ab_channel=TheTankMuseum) (German discussion at 9:23) In another video I watched, someone was discussing Russian engineering and told a story to serve as a metaphor for WWII Russian tank design. If I recall correctly, he said he was living in Russia and asked a Russian friend which would be a good washing machine to buy. He was recommended one and bought it. It soon broke down, so he went to his friend who replied: “ah, but it’s very easy to fix”. The simpler Russian tanks in WWII could be easily repaired or refitted in the field, while the complicated German ones often had to return to the factory to do so. The interleaved and overlapping road wheels used on many German tanks would be an example of this: [https://blog.tiger-tank.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Tiger\_Wash-Down-Cleaning\_091.jpg](https://blog.tiger-tank.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Tiger_Wash-Down-Cleaning_091.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Icantdance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ce73a5/32.png) [@Icantdance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icantdance)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/54 "2021-10-02T23:03:50Z")
Mercedes seem to be well made cars. But other than that, I am not particularly impressed with Germans. Is Germany some sort of Utopia? ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2021, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/55 "2021-10-02T23:27:07Z")
> [@Icantdance](#): > > Is Germany some sort of Utopia? Certainly not! 😂 (sorry, this really made me laugh out) ---
**Author:** ![K364](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k364/32/5_2.png) [@K364](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/K364)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2021, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/56 "2021-10-03T02:24:03Z")
Would the Dutch and Flemish be similar to Germans? They drove us nuts with a software upgrade project. They were business/technical staff in charge and the excruciating attention to detail ground the project to a halt. They had the IT staff and the Site staff jumping through pre-upgrade hoops for months. Everything was delayed by a factor of two. Five years later, the Brazilians were in charge. They sent out two emails: “Your site will be upgraded on the following date” “Your site has been upgraded” ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2021, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/57 "2021-10-03T03:56:09Z")
> [@PatrickLondon](#): > > SMEs What is that? ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2021, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/58 "2021-10-03T04:31:56Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > > [@Velocity](#): > > > > My father likes to tell the story of how he had a German professor back in the day, and the professor would stalk and pace back and forth while he and the other students were taking exams, and gaze at what students were writing, and sigh and shake his head, “Stupid, stupid, stupid…” > > That’s a bonafide jerk there. I don’t know about that… If I was a student taking an exam and my professor stood behind me reading what I wrote and criticizing it I would be very thankful for the kibitzing as it would offer me a chance to change my response for the better. To simplify it: imagine you are taking a True/False quiz. The prof walks by looking at your paper just as you write down “False”. She says: “Stupid, stupid, stupid.” So you change the answer to “True”. She helped you. She is an un-jerk. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2021, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/59 "2021-10-03T05:21:15Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > To simplify it: imagine you are taking a True/False quiz. The prof walks by looking at your paper just as you write down “False”. She says: “Stupid, stupid, stupid.” So you change the answer to “True”. > > She helped you. She is an un-jerk. The question is, does “stupid” refer to the answer, or to the student? Because if it’s the latter I can see why they didn’t like it. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2021, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560/60 "2021-10-03T06:03:22Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > > [@PatrickLondon](#): > > > > SMEs > > What is that SMEs= small and medium enterprises [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-made-makes-the-germans-so-good-at-what-they-do/951560.md?page=4)