# What makes a condition a disability vs just a characteristic? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 16, 2018, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463 "2018-09-16T23:36:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/41 "2018-09-18T22:17:19Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > However, in re the patient/person being the best judge of their potential disability, while I think that is true for the majority of cases, do you think it is always so? Does not desiring the aspects of life that are used to construct the criterion through which disability is understood and defined negate the disability? Or does it suggest a disability in it’s own right? I’m by no means asserting this, just posing the question. Your post was very thought-provoking. (FWIW, I think it’s not indictaive of a disability but it is an interesting question, at least imho). Good question. No, I don’t think the individual is the best judge. Mentally ill people are often robbed of insight, so I would not necessarily trust a severely mentally ill person’s judgment about how un-debilitated they are. There are also people who think they are disabled just because they have limited ability in a very narrow area. I think individual’s judgment should be considered, but I don’t think they should have the final say. I guess what I wanted to get at it in my earlier post is that what can be “neutral” for one person can actually be emotionally burdensome for someone else. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/42 "2018-09-18T22:20:28Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > […] I’m not sure how far society can go to accommodate every person’s difference. At what point do you just say someone has to suck it up and figure out how to deal in a society that serves the vast majority of people? This is valid. For one thing, I don’t think my disability could be fully accommodated. If society were to try and make me comfortable, the entire world would have to re-arrange itself to suit me, which is nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/43 "2018-09-18T22:41:31Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > A couple points I wanted to respond to: unfortunately I don’t think it makes most people comfortable with spinal cord injury at all. People are still twitchy and avoidant with the severely disabled in general, I think. > > I also think that this idea that willpower can be applied to other forms of disease/impairment is definitely out there. The brave soul who “fights” against cancer and conquers it with willpower. There was that movie about the mathematician who controlled his schizophrenia without medication. It’s pervasive in some areas more than others, but we (society) definitely have this idea that willpower will somehow conquer the failings of the body and mind. > > It’s insidious too. I have banged myself against it a time or two. Why can’t I just get better? Why doesn’t my brain and body work the way it used to? Relatively few times in 6 years, but it has happened. People expect it of me as well, particularly as my disability is invisible. “You’re not feeling well. Can’t you just suck it up and do this” is not an uncommon reaction among people who don’t have all the information. Ok, I can acknowledge overstating the exclusive nature of this unfortunate social phenomenon to SCI. However, with the groundwork that I laid out for it’s genesis, would you disagree that it is more ubiquitous with SCI that with other dibilitating conditions? I can quickly find numerous examples to share that show exactly what I am talking about, both on an individual level and on a society-wide level. Now it maybe be a case of cognitive bias, but I don’t recall seeing television or movies that hailed the inspirational triumph of cancer patients who single-handedly beat their cancers into final remission thru force of will, in stark contrast to the prognosis of all the experts. Also, since many SCIs involve younger people sustaining their injuries engaging in reckless, dangerous, irresponsible or even criminal behaviors, there tends to be a Puritanical streak among elements of our society (even here on this board) who, to varying degrees, believe the person deserves their injury due to the immoral/unethical behavior that caused the injury in the first place. Its more prominent with certain conservative religious types but it exists in pockets in all areas. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/44 "2018-09-18T22:50:19Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > A couple points I wanted to respond to: unfortunately I don’t think it makes most people comfortable with spinal cord injury at all. People are still twitchy and avoidant with the severely disabled in general, I think. > > I also think that this idea that willpower can be applied to other forms of disease/impairment is definitely out there. The brave soul who “fights” against cancer and conquers it with willpower. There was that movie about the mathematician who controlled his schizophrenia without medication. It’s pervasive in some areas more than others, but we (society) definitely have this idea that willpower will somehow conquer the failings of the body and mind. > > It’s insidious too. I have banged myself against it a time or two. Why can’t I just get better? Why doesn’t my brain and body work the way it used to? Relatively few times in 6 years, but it has happened. People expect it of me as well, particularly as my disability is invisible. “You’re not feeling well. Can’t you just suck it up and do this” is not an uncommon reaction among people who don’t have all the information. People also think that if there’s a medical treatment for a condition, that means the condition isn’t all that bad and thus the sufferer lose the right to ever claim it as a disability. For this assumption to be valid, the following must be always true. - The side effects from the medical treatment aren’t more debilitating than the condition - The sufferer can afford the medical treatment and can easily access it - The medical treatment is effective enough for the sufferer for it to be worth the costs of acquiring it - The medical treatment is effective enough for the sufferer to no longer be disabled ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/45 "2018-09-18T22:52:28Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Ok, I can acknowledge overstating the exclusive nature of this unfortunate social phenomenon to SCI. However, with the groundwork that I laid out for it’s genesis, would you disagree that it is more ubiquitous with SCI that with other dibilitating conditions? I can quickly find numerous examples to share that show exactly what I am talking about, both on an individual level and on a society-wide level. Now it maybe be a case of cognitive bias, but I don’t recall seeing television or movies that hailed the inspirational triumph of cancer patients who single-handedly beat their cancers into final remission thru force of will, in stark contrast to the prognosis of all the experts. > > Also, since many SCIs involve younger people sustaining their injuries engaging in reckless, dangerous, irresponsible or even criminal behaviors, there tends to be a Puritanical streak among elements of our society (even here on this board) who, to varying degrees, believe the person deserves their injury due to the immoral/unethical behavior that caused the injury in the first place. Its more prominent with certain conservative religious types but it exists in pockets in all areas. I think I remember some cancer ones, but like you say it may be because those are the ones that stick in my mind. It’s not worth quibbling about. The bias is definitely there. Through willpower, fighting spirit, and the almighty (praise be!), you shall walk! (Walking yet?) ---
**Author:** ![DavidwithanR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@DavidwithanR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidwithanR)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/46 "2018-09-18T22:58:25Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > It has been my experience that people who talk about the “blessings” of their spectrum disorder (usually autism) are people privileged enough to have a good support network and a good environment. They’ve got parents who are kind and compassionate enough to tolerate their quirks, with incomes that enable innovative therapies, talent-development, passion-pursuit, and employment-through-connections. Like, I know a woman who has a son with high-functioning autism. She was able to get him a job at a camera shop through social connections. When he was eventually let go, no biggie. She was eventually able to find him a job doing something else. Through it all, his comfortable middle-class existence was maintained since he lived with her. Could be he’s one of these chaps you sometimes see online who play up the gifts of autism, since he lives in a context where those gifts are appreciated rather than stigmatized. But if he was forced to live on his own or if he had a family who was less enlightened and less socially connected, it is likely he would be more cognizant of his disabilities. > > I have no doubt that autism can confer some gifts. But the value of those gifts must be compared with any associated disadvantages. If the latter outweigh the former, then yeah, we’re talking about someone with a disability. > > I also think the desires of the individual need to be considered in the disability equation. I have Tourette’s disorder, and I don’t believe it has impaired or impeded me in any way. But I think this is due to the low priority I place on socializing. If I wanted to acquire a significant other, I probably would consider myself “challenged”, since weird tics and twitches are unattractive to most people. If I did have this desire, I would be pissed off if someone told me that my tic disorder is “neutral” since Tourette’s is a cosmetic issue. We live in a world where you can be discriminated against based on “cosmetics” , though. So of course it ain’t “neutral”. I’m not interested in the people who dishonestly try to “spin” problems to sound like “blessings”. They’re trying to console themselves by playing pretend. If my needs inconvenience others, but when my needs are met I’m perfectly fine, am I disabled? I recognize that personally I AM disabled, though exactly to what degree is a confusing analysis. But I don’t believe that having inconvenient needs qualifies in any form as a disability. ---
**Author:** ![DavidwithanR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@DavidwithanR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidwithanR)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/47 "2018-09-18T23:13:20Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Yeah - or it could be what organization made the determination. > > Another factor would whether the diagnosing doctor is a specialist as opposed to a GP? A treater? > > I see a lot of vets who are irate that their VA rating does not entitle them to an additional Soc Sec payment (no set off between the 2 programs. In fact, 100% disabled vets are able to work.) > > And so many doctors seem to think their opinion that, “Mr X is disabled.” means ANYTHING. No mention of any symptoms or functional limitations? No discussion of how those affect one within the workplace? > > I think it ridiculous that a deaf person would bridle at the word “disabled” - especially if they wish any portion of society to make them any accommodation. But a real poser is trying to define what is “able.” How broad will we draw that before someone is “disabled”? Some people are athletic/others are klutzes. Some folk are nearsighted. Some are not too bright. And others are lazy assholes. And what makes a particular accommodation “reasonable.” From whose viewpoint. > > It does not surprise me that people have different opinions. I’m not sure how far society can go to accommodate every person’s difference. At what point do you just say someone has to suck it up and figure out how to deal in a society that serves the vast majority of people? “Able” is not a difficult question at all, just a silly one. “Able to do WHAT” is the problem. Very much like the idea of “physical fitness”, which is nonsense until you explain physically fit for exactly what. Being able and being fit are meaningless until the specific capabilities or tasks are identified. If I ask “Are you reasonably fit?” and you say “Yes”, and I ask you well then how many times in a row can you lift 200 pounds over your head, you’ll likely say that’s not what you meant. In that example, the answer was foolishly given; the question was nonsense, and the only sensible way to answer is to request clarification. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/48 "2018-09-18T23:16:42Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > I think I remember some cancer ones, but like you say it may be because those are the ones that stick in my mind. It’s not worth quibbling about. The bias is definitely there. Through willpower, fighting spirit, and the almighty (praise be!), you shall walk! (Walking yet?) Nah. Im one of the undeserving ones. Ya know, my paucity of character and all. ☹ Plus it turns out I’ve been praying to the wrong God all this time. Santa don’t doesnt leave those kinds of presents under the tree. No matter how many fucking Entemanns you leave. And fuck that other God too. You chose to allow me to become injured? And then decided I didn’t “qualify for salvation”? Or you were punishing me for my errant ways? Well fuck, where’s that Lucifer fellow at? I think ill start praying to the roaring lion. Cant be any more of a dick than that “God full of compassion” Ha! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/49 "2018-09-18T23:31:05Z")
> [@DavidwithanR](#): > > “Able” is not a difficult question at all, just a silly one. “Able to do WHAT” is the problem. … > > If I ask “Are you reasonably fit?” and you say “Yes”, and I ask you well then how many times in a row can you lift 200 pounds over your head, you’ll likely say that’s not what you meant. … I disagree. I doubt many folk would equate “reasonable fitness” w/ pressing 200# overhead. You can make assumptions based on the human physique. There is a reason stair risers and treads have standard dimensions. Able to do what? function in society w/o requiring special accommodations. And since I brought up vets, I ought to mention my favorite abused malady - PTSD! ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/50 "2018-09-18T23:34:30Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > This is a staggeringly uninformed statement. Not only do individuals hold this belief, the notion is propagated by the popular media and movies _all the damn time_. Haven’t you ever heard the “inspirational stories” of those amazingly strong people who didnt listen when their doctors told them they would never walk again? And through a combination of superhuman willpower, a undying positive attitude and a belief in _something_, they were able to overcome their spinal cord injuries and WALK AGAIN! HALLELUJAH!! > . Interesting. I wonder if people who are (fully) blind are told that if they just have enough willpower, they will be able to see again. I find it hard to imagine that happening, but then, I clearly vastly underestimated the number of people who would react similarly to someone in a wheelchair. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/51 "2018-09-18T23:43:40Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > What other irreversible physical condition do large swaths of the population believe can be cured woth willpower? Cancer? Type 1 diabetes? Scizophrenia? Amputation?? It is a remarkable feature of the human mind, in my opi ion. Cancer (which after so many people have battled with it you’d think it’s some sort of dragon rather than a crab) and depression are two pretty big ones. When she was born, the parents of one of my SiLs were told she might never walk (at the very least I know she’s got scoliosis of doom); the father went further into the depression he already had, the mother rolled up her sleeves and carried the whole family. Talking to SiL about the power of prayer or about alternative medicine will probably only get you an extremely cold shoulder; her mother is old enough to have ditched unnecessary politeness long ago and turns from a nice little grandma into someone who’d scare a Brothers Grimm witch out of her underclothes. ---
**Author:** ![DavidwithanR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@DavidwithanR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidwithanR)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/52 "2018-09-18T23:44:01Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > I disagree. I doubt many folk would equate “reasonable fitness” w/ pressing 200# overhead. You can make assumptions based on the human physique. There is a reason stair risers and treads have standard dimensions. > > Able to do what? function in society w/o requiring special accommodations. > > And since I brought up vets, I ought to mention my favorite abused malady - PTSD! “Function in society” doesn’t mean even close to the same thing for every person. Your function and my function might be just fine for each of us but not very similar. Every person functioning exactly the same as the next person has never been a requirement or even a reasonable expectation. Clearly, FDR was disabled. Do we say that he wasn’t functioning? And clearly, Charles Manson was physically NOT disabled. Do we say that he WAS functioning? ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/53 "2018-09-18T23:49:03Z")
> [@DavidwithanR](#): > > I’m not interested in the people who dishonestly try to “spin” problems to sound like “blessings”. They’re trying to console themselves by playing pretend. I’m not interested in these people either, which is why I didn’t mention them. There are some people who honestly and sincerely believe their conditions confer “blessings”, but they are honestly and sincerely oblivious to the problems caused by their conditions because they are sheltered from them. > [@](#): > > If my needs inconvenience others, but when my needs are met I’m perfectly fine, am I disabled? Depends on how much inconvenience your needs are causing. Like, if you’re so allergic to peanuts that a couple of aerosol particles can kill you, then you’re disabled because you require a huge accommodation to live a “typical” life. But if you just break out into hives when you eat something with a lot of peanuts, then no. Your condition doesn’t require the people around you to have an extra amount of compassion and understanding and it doesn’t require any special accommodation. > [@](#): > > I recognize that personally I AM disabled, though exactly to what degree is a confusing analysis. But I don’t believe that having inconvenient needs qualifies in any form as a disability. To me, if someone who I interact with on a regular basis tells me they’ve got a condition, I will assume the person wants me to accommodate them somehow. Maybe they want me to be ready to step in for them or provide assistance if their condition temporarily impairs them. Or maybe they simply want me to not judge them harshly when their condition manifests itself unexpectedly and makes things awkward. So if someone can’t function well for long stretches without cluing anyone in on what they’re dealing with, then I think it makes sense to call them disabled. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/54 "2018-09-18T23:50:54Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Yeah - or it could be what organization made the determination. > > Another factor would whether the diagnosing doctor is a specialist as opposed to a GP? A treater? > > I see a lot of vets who are irate that their VA rating does not entitle them to an additional Soc Sec payment (no set off between the 2 programs. In fact, 100% disabled vets are able to work.) > > And so many doctors seem to think their opinion that, “Mr X is disabled.” means ANYTHING. No mention of any symptoms or functional limitations? No discussion of how those affect one within the workplace? > > I think it ridiculous that a deaf person would bridle at the word “disabled” - especially if they wish any portion of society to make them any accommodation. But a real poser is trying to define what is “able.” How broad will we draw that before someone is “disabled”? Some people are athletic/others are klutzes. Some folk are nearsighted. Some are not too bright. And others are lazy assholes. And what makes a particular accommodation “reasonable.” From whose viewpoint. > > It does not surprise me that people have different opinions. I’m not sure how far society can go to accommodate every person’s difference. At what point do you just say someone has to suck it up and figure out how to deal in a society that serves the vast majority of people? That is the crux of the issue and the still-unresolved question of my OP. It’s a surprisingly difficult question to answer, even knowing it would be a challenging task at the outset. Oh, and I remembered something a bit clarifying about the diagnosis of my disability. It was a two-stage event. First was the tentative diagnosis in the hospital where my emergency aortic surgery was performed. This was rather inconclusive, as the ischemic nature of my injury left open a wide array of ultimate possible outcomes. The second, and more definitive diagnosis came from the spinal cord injury rehabilitation medical team that I was under the care of after I was transported from ICU in the first hospital to rehab in the second. It was a solid, credible diagnosis made by experts in the field of spinal cord injury as well as the peripheral nervous system and brain function as well as traumatic brain injury. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2018, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/55 "2018-09-19T00:03:49Z")
> [@DavidwithanR](#): > > “Function in society” doesn’t mean even close to the same thing for every person. Your function and my function might be just fine for each of us but not very similar. Every person functioning exactly the same as the next person has never been a requirement or even a reasonable expectation. Clearly, FDR was disabled. Do we say that he wasn’t functioning? And clearly, Charles Manson was physically NOT disabled. Do we say that he WAS functioning? Yes, FDR was disabled. Thats why he required accomodations such as a wheelchair and untold other unseen assistive elements to facilitate his ability to function in an _reasonabe_ manner. And just because Charles Manson was not _physically_ disabled, does that somehow erase the **almost certainty** that he was a psychopath? Or to use proper termininology, afflicted with Antisocial Personality Disorder, of the psychopathic subset? Both men were clearly disabled. One man found accomodations which allowed him reasonable ability to function and one man did not. The difference was in outcome, not in outset. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2018, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/56 "2018-09-19T01:12:17Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Yes, FDR was disabled. Thats why he required accomodations such as a wheelchair and untold other unseen assistive elements to facilitate his ability to function in an _reasonabe_ manner. And just because Charles Manson was not _physically_ disabled, does that somehow erase the **almost certainty** that he was a psychopath? Or to use proper termininology, afflicted with Antisocial Personality Disorder, of the psychopathic subset? Both men were clearly disabled. One man found accomodations which allowed him reasonable ability to function and one man did not. The difference was in outcome, not in outset. I think **DavidwithanR** has a point though with wondering what “function in society” means. Someone with relatively low intelligence can get a job assembling hamburgers at McDonalds and function pretty well in that job, with little accommodation. And maybe they can scratch out a comfortable existence on minimum wage if they are fortunate enough to live somewhere with ample affordable housing and a low cost of living. But what if a person doesn’t have this? If you can’t find a place to live that you can afford in your society and you can’t afford to move to another society, then how can it be said that you are “functioning in society”? Functioning on the job \<\> functioning at life. And the old stand-by advice to “go back to school and get better skills” isn’t such great advice for someone who doesn’t learn easily. So that’s why I think the degree to which someone is impaired depends on the obstacles that are found in the society someone finds themselves in. Not to be all leftwing radical, but if all Americans were guaranteed food, housing and health care, then it would be relatively easy to “function in society” because the basics would be covered. But when even fully able-bodied/minded people are struggling with the basics, it makes perfect sense for someone who feels disadvantaged to seek special protection and accommodation. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2018, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/57 "2018-09-19T02:02:04Z")
At some point, there needs to some _some_ level of educated but essentially arbitrary cut-off separating disability from low ability. Otherwise what sort of ineffective and potentially ruinous quagmire would society be in? Life isn’t fair. Disabilities have to have, to some extent medically arbitrary points of cut-off, like why should those with a functional IQ of 75 be charged with violent crimes but those with scores of just five points lower not be held criminally liable for their actions (this was most recently in court in 2002 in [Atkins v. Virginia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atkins_v._Virginia)). Does this make logical sense or seem fair or take all potentially relevant factors into consideration? It sure doesnt appear to, at least to my layman’s eye. It seemed to rest on a somewhat outdated, and fiercely debated, dividing line that separated “mental retardation” from regular old low intelligence. ---
**Author:** ![DavidwithanR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@DavidwithanR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidwithanR)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2018, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/58 "2018-09-19T02:39:34Z")
No, life isn’t fair. But with some level of effort, life can be made a hell of a lot closer to fair. In the bad old days, a person who needed a wheelchair to get around, got basically nothing from society. Stairs everywhere, can’t climb the stairs it’s your problem. It was “just not practical” to accommodate wheelchairs AT ALL, EVER. We got smarter. A ramp is not that hard to add. A door that can be opened in a better way is not that hard to design. And so on. Life will never be perfectly fair, but IMO it’s foolish to be against trying to improve the situation for as many people as possible. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2018, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/59 "2018-09-19T02:43:27Z")
> [@DavidwithanR](#): > > No, life isn’t fair. But with some level of effort, life can be made a hell of a lot closer to fair. > > In the bad old days, a person who needed a wheelchair to get around, got basically nothing from society. Stairs everywhere, can’t climb the stairs it’s your problem. It was “just not practical” to accommodate wheelchairs AT ALL, EVER. > > We got smarter. A ramp is not that hard to add. A door that can be opened in a better way is not that hard to design. And so on. > > Life will never be perfectly fair, but IMO it’s foolish to be against trying to improve the situation for as many people as possible. I’m sorry but who has suggesting anything of that sort? 😕 ETA: certainly “improving the lives of everyone” or as many as possible does not mean conferring medical/legal statuses of disability and government protections/accomodations to as many people as possible, does it? Would that really be of a net benefit to society? Would it even be feasible? ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2018, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463/60 "2018-09-19T02:55:54Z")
I think **DavidwithanR** is trying to find the line that was raised earlier about who we accommodate and who we don’t. Your post mentions that in many ways now the line is very arbitrary (70 is retarded, 75 isn’t, for example). I think it’s a balancing act for society. Ideally, we do the most good for the most people. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-a-condition-a-disability-vs-just-a-characteristic/821463.md?page=4)