# What makes "Chinaman" an insulting term? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 12, 2009, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145 "2009-05-12T07:20:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/1 "2009-05-12T07:20:15Z")
I’m fully aware that the term Chinaman is considered an offensive word, but I’m not exactly sure _why_ this is. What is it about that word that gives it unpleasant connotations? It’s not considered offensive to say Dutchman, Irishman, Scotsman, Englishman or Frenchman, so I’m at a loss as to why Chinaman is offensive while those other terms aren’t. Is it simply because the word is an old-fashioned usage? Or was it actually used derisively during the time when it was common (which I take it was at least up until the first half of the 20th century)? ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/2 "2009-05-12T07:33:28Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > I’m fully aware that the term Chinaman is considered an offensive word It is? ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/3 "2009-05-12T07:38:00Z")
It definitely is in the U.S. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 7:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/4 "2009-05-12T07:43:40Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > It definitely is in the U.S. I was always under the impression that it was merely old-fashioned. It certainly doesn’t rise to the level of calling someone a chink or gook. Of course, it would be quite inaccurate to call an American of Chinese descent a Chinaman, and people could certainly justifiably take offense to that. ---
**Author:** ![nivlac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/3bc359/32.png) [@nivlac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nivlac)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/5 "2009-05-12T07:45:38Z")
An excerpt from the Chinese History Forum: \*The California Gold Rush, ~ the 1850s, had given rise the the first wave of Chinese migration to the Golden Mountains. Many of of these Chinese took menial jobs with Railways in California and western states. They faced much hostility / hatred from the Irish American workers who were wary of the influx of Chinese competing for their jobs. The Irish hurled many insults at the Chinese. One such insulting terms was “Chinaman” used to demean them as being dishonest (look and dress differently) and stupid (can’t speak English). The hatred / distrust of the Chinese led to the eventual passage of the Chinese Exclusion Act in America, which was not repealed until ~ 1950s.\* Today, “Chinaman” conjures up those terrible times of discrimination against Chinese in America (discrimination that was even legalized!). Yes, it is not PC to use _Chinaman_ today, although you still hear it used in general talk more than the dreaded word _nigger_. ---
**Author:** ![Jormungandr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@Jormungandr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jormungandr)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/6 "2009-05-12T08:20:16Z")
I’ve never heard the term outside of the tv show “Kung Fu.” I’ll admit I’m confused a bit as well. If the Irish used it to insult them, how is it different if someone called them “Irelandman” or others, “Englandman,” etc. I guess we’re missing the connotation of using the name of the person’s country of origin instead of the adjective form ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/7 "2009-05-12T08:26:18Z")
“Chineseman” just doesn’t have the same ring to it. I would assume that if the people of China were “ish” and not “ese” they would have called them “Chinishmen.” Oddly enough, while Englishman and Irishmen are accepted uses, nobody ever says Polishmen or Danishmen. ---
**Author:** ![Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/73ab20/32.png) [@Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alive_At_Both_Ends)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/8 "2009-05-12T10:46:22Z")
It’s a direct rendering into English of 中国人, which is what the Chinese call themselves, so why it should be offensive is a mystery. I suspect it’s just that someone (probably not even Chinese) has decided that it’s offensive and nobody’s dared to call bullshit on them. ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/9 "2009-05-12T11:04:44Z")
Any term can be made an offensive one by mere usage as a term of abuse. If enough people, in a sufficient number of instances, used the terms ‘humanitarian’ and ‘mechanical engineer’ in a context that made clear that insult was intended, ‘humanitarian’ and ‘mechanical engineer’ would _become_ insulting terms, and people would be justified in taking offense at being called humanitarian mechanical engineers. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/10 "2009-05-12T11:07:56Z")
Dude, the Chinaman is not the issue here. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/11 "2009-05-12T11:09:22Z")
> [@Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](#): > > It’s a direct rendering into English of 中国人, which is what the Chinese call themselves Well, by that logic you should be able to grin at your Chinese friend and say “no tickee no washee!” next time you’re doing the laundry. Hey, it’s a direct rendering in English of what the Chinese themselves say. ---
**Author:** ![BellRungBookShut-CandleSnuffed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@BellRungBookShut-CandleSnuffed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BellRungBookShut-CandleSnuffed)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/12 "2009-05-12T11:09:57Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > Dude, the Chinaman is not the issue here. This guy didn’t build the railroads, Walter! ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/13 "2009-05-12T11:20:06Z")
Walter?! Everyone knows the ethnic types working on the railroads are called George. ---
**Author:** ![Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/73ab20/32.png) [@Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alive_At_Both_Ends)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/14 "2009-05-12T11:24:52Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > Well, by that logic you should be able to grin at your Chinese friend and say “no tickee no washee!” next time you’re doing the laundry. Hey, it’s a direct rendering in English of what the Chinese themselves say. Er, no. “Tickee” and “washee” aren’t standard English, now, are they? ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/15 "2009-05-12T11:29:06Z")
It’s probably because Chinaman historically has almost always had a negative connotation. watch the movie Chinatown for an example (…you fuck like a Chinama). Kipling has plenty of examples such as go see the Chinaman for opium. my wag is the term was first popularized around the 1800’s, when china was acorupt poor place full of opium addicts, cheap shoddy labor and at the mercy of western armies. Chinaman was also used as a generic depersonalizing term. Sure, it’s not chink or gook? but it’s not nice term even if it’s a direct translation of a Chinese term (which is akin to ‘american’ if you translate the spirit of the term. ---
**Author:** ![Wallenstein](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b5a626/32.png) [@Wallenstein](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wallenstein)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/16 "2009-05-12T11:33:38Z")
In the UK a “[chinaman](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-arm_unorthodox_spin)” also refers to a type of bowling delivery in cricket. (Used by left-arm wrist spinners to make the ball break from off to leg against right-handed batsmen… it’s less likely to take an edge, but it does allow lbw as the ball pitches outside off.) This dates back to c1930. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/17 "2009-05-12T11:36:51Z")
‘chinese’ is perfectly acceptable, whereas ‘chinaman’ has negative connotations (at least in the US and what was formerly British HK). Using ‘chinaman’ says volumes about the speaker. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Buttons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@Mr\_Buttons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Buttons)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/18 "2009-05-12T11:50:10Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > I was always under the impression that it was merely old-fashioned. It certainly doesn’t rise to the level of calling someone a chink or gook. I’m gonna agree with this one. It’s kinda like the word Negro, Japs, Krauts, etc… Sounds ok if you hear them in historical context, but if you hear someone using chinaman or Negro in present tense, it makes you cringe a little. Before my grandfather passed last year, he was a fan of all the above slurs and more ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 11:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/19 "2009-05-12T11:50:52Z")
Chinaman is a type of ship. It is not an ethnic description. (It’s also a type of bowling style, as Wallenstein points out, but that usage came a lot later) Calling a man from China a Chinaman is insulting for the same reason as the same as calling the people from Scotland “Scotch” ---
**Author:** ![Lunar\_Saltlick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/977dab/32.png) [@Lunar\_Saltlick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lunar_Saltlick)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2009, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145/20 "2009-05-12T12:01:47Z")
> [@tschild](#): > > Any term can be made an offensive one by mere usage as a term of abuse. If enough people, in a sufficient number of instances, used the terms ‘humanitarian’ and ‘mechanical engineer’ in a context that made clear that insult was intended, ‘humanitarian’ and ‘mechanical engineer’ would _become_ insulting terms, and people would be justified in taking offense at being called humanitarian mechanical engineers. I’d go with this interpretation. Context and usage are everything. Even some of the other terms mentioned by the OP are iffy. Frenchman, for example, is often used in an insulting manner by anglophones. In fact, when -man is appended to the name of any ethnic group, you pretty much know there’s a hint of generalization coming, at the very least, if not outright insult: You take your average Irishman, right? He’s a big drinker – it’s natural for them. It’s not a hard and fast rule, but I’ve never heard anybody use the term Chinaman when they’re about to wax poetic about the Chinese culture. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-makes-chinaman-an-insulting-term/496145.md?page=2)