# What message would it take to make obesity rates plummet dramatically? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 2, 2019, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154 "2019-10-02T15:28:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/64 "2020-02-14T06:50:15Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Good points, but- > Breakfast ‘cereals’- some are pretty much just grain. > > chocolate- cocoa & sugar. Obviously, if a breakfast cereal is just home-cooked oat porridge or something like that, then it’s group 1 - unprocessed or minimally processed. Froot-loops are group 4. It’s easy to see the difference. Just chocolate and sugar wouldn’t be too bad. But if you find can a commercial chocolate bar that’s just chocolate and sugar, I’d be very surprised. Usually they have a list of ingredients as long as your arm. ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/65 "2020-02-14T07:59:26Z")
There’s a method to obtain obstacle-jumping horses. Shoot every horse that fails the obstacle. Eventually, only agile jumpers are left. A message can reduce obesity. Shoot everyone whose BMI exceeds 35 or whatever. Eventually only slimmer folks are left. Yes, I know BMI is meant to compare populations, not individuals. That makes the message more potent. Drop weight or die, citizen. But we’re too humane for that. Thus the population of WalMart shoppers will continue growing. And growing. ---
**Author:** ![Hermitian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hermitian/32/470_2.png) [@Hermitian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hermitian)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/66 "2020-02-14T14:14:51Z")
> [@RioRico](#): > > There’s a method to obtain obstacle-jumping horses. Shoot every horse that fails the obstacle. Eventually, only agile jumpers are left. > > A message can reduce obesity. Shoot everyone whose BMI exceeds 35 or whatever. Eventually only slimmer folks are left. > > Yes, I know BMI is meant to compare populations, not individuals. That makes the message more potent. Drop weight or die, citizen. > > But we’re too humane for that. Thus the population of WalMart shoppers will continue growing. And growing. Ya know, they say, “For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and [del]wrong[/del] morally questionable.” ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/67 "2020-02-14T15:06:13Z")
Bullets cost too much money (Godwinning here, but this was the crux of the Third Reich’s Final Solution - a cheaper solution to kill lots of people than shooting them). Instead, get rid of the minimum wage. Once the poor no longer have enough money to afford even cheap, processed foods, they’ll begin to starve, leading to a massive drop in BMI. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/68 "2020-02-14T15:41:41Z")
The problem of obesity is easily solved by mandating Physical Jerks and having egregious cases body-shamed over everyone’s telescreens. ---
**Author:** ![Kovitlac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/2bfe46/32.png) [@Kovitlac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kovitlac)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/69 "2020-02-14T16:07:27Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > First of all, ditch the outdated and useless BMI. > BMI was a idea by Adolphe Quetelet, a Belgian astronomer, mathematician, statistician, and sociologist, in like **1850.** Based upon a few hundred peasants, none of whom were over 6 feet tall, and were likely not all that well nourished. It was never meant to to used as a tool to get people to lose weight. It also doesnt differ between someone fat and someone who is into body building. BMI is useless and outdated. > > In addition, not too long ago, due to pressure from the diet industry :eek::rolleyes: the WHO and USA changed the definitions to make more people scale in at fat and obese. So, not only useless but full of crap and commercialized. They changed the scales just to get you to buy more diet worthless crap. > > For example -Lasha Talakhadze, weighing in at 372 lb won the Gold Medal in weightlifting. He’s be considered obese, but he’s a freaking Olympic Gold medalist. World record setter. > > So yeah, you can be a athlete at 372 pounds but be fat and out of shape at 160. > > 600 is right out, yes. 😛 > > The only way to tell if your weight is effecting your health is to get a physical. I am technically (under the new system) obese, but my doctor sez I am in great health, no blood pressure issues, etc. He sez if i lost a few pounds it’d be easier on my knees, and he’s right. That is incredibly backwards. I’m pretty sure it doesn’t matter how old an idea is, so long as it’s still correct. And BMI allows for a pretty large range, letting it account for things like water weight, bone density, etc. And it’s not an indicator of too much fat - it’s saying there’s too much WEIGHT on your frame, enough so to be potentially dangerous. Doesn’t matter if that weight is bone, muscle, fat or an over-abundance of brain matter. And dude, weightlifters are \*infamous \*for not actually being healthy. There’s a reason why they go through seasons, and aren’t incredibly lean from year to year. Because it’s not _healthy_, even though the common misconception is that it is. Olympic gold winners can absolutely be unhealthy. Ever hear of gymnasts losing their periods because they’re underweight or too lean? Same idea. Athlete =/= healthy. Even The Rock is only sliiiightly in the ‘overweight’ territory. Being heavy enough to qualify as obese through muscle only is nigh impossible. And again, if you were, that’d still be pretty unhealthy. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/70 "2020-02-14T16:14:28Z")
In the 1950s, food was a third of the average household budget. People spent a large proportion of their income on groceries. In the 2010s, food is a third of the average household budget. Since the price of food has plummeted since the 1950s, we spend a small portion of that third of our income on groceries, and a large portion of it on prepared food at restaurants. We also spend a much larger percent of our food budget on highly processed foods. But the key, in my mind, is that we _just eat more_. Why do we eat more? Because the price of food has plummeted. I mean, it’s Econ 101. When price goes down, quantity demanded goes up. People demand more food because it’s cheaper, and they get it, and they mostly consume it. Want people to weigh as little as they did in the 1950s? Raise the price of food by a lot, so that in real terms it is as expensive as it was then. Now, I’m no fan of price controls, but I suspect there are other ways of raising the price of food. Eliminating farm subsidies, for one. The government buying large quantities of nonperishable food to store in case of war or famine would also raise the price of the remaining food. There’s also straight up taxation, I guess, but that’s basically price control by another name. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/71 "2020-02-14T16:17:22Z")
An athlete who is overweight is gaining many health benefits from the exercise itself that can balance out the negative effects of the extra weight. The metabolic and cardiovascular improvements may mean that an overweight athlete is healthier than a skinny sedentary person. But regardless, the athlete angle for BMI being worthless is really a distraction. Many people who are overweight are also sedentary, so they get the double-wammy of health risks together. Addressing either or both issues will make a person healthier. And I agree that even muscular athletes will typically not be obese on the BMI scale because of extra muscles. Those super-muscular athletes are in very specialized activities. Most normal people will not be packing on enough muscle through their weekly exercise to pack on enough muscles for that to make them obese on the BMI scale. If someone had reason to believe their BMI ranking was incorrect, they should get a body fat test. That would be a better indicator for what might be considered extra weight they are carrying around. But for most typical people, if they are high on the BMI scale, they are going to be high on the body fat scale as well. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/72 "2020-02-14T17:45:00Z")
I am told over and over, “Your lifespan will increase by an average of five years if you change your lifestyle completely by cooking only the healthiest food (and cleaning up after that as well), and including lots of daily exercise. Think of it, five extra years!” It’s worth noting that my response is usually, “Well gee, those five years will probably be in the shittiest phase of my life as I will be presumably quite elderly. Both of my parents were incapable of living unassisted in the last five years of their lives. Why go through all that unwanted rigamarole of healthy food and exercise just to get to a situation I probably wouldn’t like anyway?” ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/73 "2020-02-14T17:48:42Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#): > > Obviously, if a breakfast cereal is just home-cooked oat porridge or something like that, then it’s group 1 - unprocessed or minimally processed. Froot-loops are group 4. It’s easy to see the difference. > > Just chocolate and sugar wouldn’t be too bad. But if you find can a commercial chocolate bar that’s just chocolate and sugar, I’d be very surprised. Usually they have a list of ingredients as long as your arm. [https://www.valrhona-chocolate.com/valrhona-dark-guanaja-70-stick.html](https://www.valrhona-chocolate.com/valrhona-dark-guanaja-70-stick.html) \*Valrhona Dark GUANAJA 70% Stick Ingredients: Cocoa Beans Sugar Cocoa Butter Emulsifier (Soy Lecithin) Natural Vanilla Extract\* Many gourmet chocolates are like that. Kashi Nugget: INGREDIENTS: Whole Wheat Flour, Kashi Seven Grain and Sesame, Flour (Stone Ground Whole: Oats, Hard Red Winter Wheat, Rye, Long Grain Brown Rice, Triticale, Buckwheat, Barley, Sesame Seeds), Malted Barley, Sesame Seeds), Malted Barley, Salt, Yeast, Mixed Tocopherols (Natural Vitamin E) for Freshness. ---
**Author:** ![Kovitlac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/2bfe46/32.png) [@Kovitlac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kovitlac)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/74 "2020-02-14T17:49:52Z")
I don’t really understand the references some people will make to bodybuilders like The Rock when they try to argue how fit obese people can be (yes, I know I’m the one who brought up The Rock here, but I do hear him brought up a LOT in the body-positive community, which is why I used him as an example above). Them: “But _The Rock_ is technically overweight by BMI standards, which means BMI is sexist and outdated and you can’t tell someone’s health just by looking at them, yadda yadda…” Me: “Okay, so are you The Rock? No? Shut up and sit down.” Sorry, I just absolutely lose my patience with anyone preaching that obesity causes no harm, doctors are evil and hate fat people, anyone trying to lose weight is “fatphobic” and starving themselves, etc etc. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/75 "2020-02-14T17:55:36Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > In the 1950s, food was a third of the average household budget. People spent a large proportion of their income on groceries. In the 2010s, food is a third of the average household budget. Since the price of food has plummeted since the 1950s, we spend a small portion of that third of our income on groceries, and a large portion of it on prepared food at restaurants. We also spend a much larger percent of our food budget on highly processed foods. > > But the key, in my mind, is that we _just eat more_. Why do we eat more? Because the price of food has plummeted. I mean, it’s Econ 101. When price goes down, quantity demanded goes up. People demand more food because it’s cheaper, and they get it, and they mostly consume it. > > Want people to weigh as little as they did in the 1950s? Raise the price of food by a lot, so that in real terms it is as expensive as it was then. Now, I’m no fan of price controls, but I suspect there are other ways of raising the price of food. Eliminating farm subsidies, for one. The government buying large quantities of nonperishable food to store in case of war or famine would also raise the price of the remaining food. There’s also straight up taxation, I guess, but that’s basically price control by another name. There’s this subtle thing you may have heard of, called “hunger”. It’s when the tummy goes rumbly. It has a flipside called “satiety”, when the tummy no go rumbly. It doesn’t matter how cheap food is, satiety will stop you from eating more. Have somebody give you fifty free loaves of wheat bread and try to eat them all in a sitting, you’ll see what I mean. So before we can be convinced to spend our life savings on cheap food something else has to happen first: foods that don’t trigger satiety. Which was _deliberately designed_. It’s not a bug, it’s a feature, and it’s an aspect of most or all “ultra-processed” foods. If you want to get food that will actually fill you up, you have to pay more. So the food industry gets your money either way, and if you aren’t rich then your food is very literally trying to get you to overeat and get fat. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/76 "2020-02-14T18:00:21Z")
> [@Kovitlac](#): > > That is incredibly backwards. I’m pretty sure it doesn’t matter how old an idea is, so long as it’s still correct. … > > Even The Rock is only sliiiightly in the ‘overweight’ territory. Being heavy enough to qualify as obese through muscle only is nigh impossible. And again, if you were, that’d still be pretty unhealthy. BMI was never, ever a "good idea’ for healthy weight. It wasnt designed for ti, and today it’s even worse, having been changed by the diet industry so they can make more $$. > **[Europe PMC](https://europepmc.org/article/med/15615272)** > > Europe PMC is an archive of life sciences journal literature. _Abstract –The Body Mass Index (BMI) is used as a measure of overweight and obesity. In epidemiological studies age, sex and ethnic background all have to be taken into consideration, particularly when determining the health risk caused by the amount of body fat. --Caution should be observed when using the BMI as a measure for interpreting overweight and obesity as body composition can be highly variable yet have the same BMI. Therefore, BMI is not a reliable measurement of body composition in individuals particularly in older and younger people. --Excess body fat in the visceral depot poses a separate health risk. The BMI does not give any insight into regional body fat distribution. Waist circumference is a valid index of visceral fat accumulation and can therefore be used as an indicator of health risks associated with visceral obesity._ [https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/79/3/379/4690122](https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/79/3/379/4690122) _Waist circumference and not body mass index explains obesity-related health risk_ [https://www.nature.com/articles/ijo201617](https://www.nature.com/articles/ijo201617) Misclassification of cardiometabolic health when using body mass index categories in NHANES 2005–2012 > **[How useful is the body mass index (BMI)? - Harvard Health](https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/how-useful-is-the-body-mass-index-bmi-201603309339)** > > Body mass index (BMI) is a calculation of your size that expresses the relationship between your height and weight as a single number. It's useful for a person to know, but research show... \*Should we stop giving so much “weight” to BMI? That’s exactly what’s being asked in the discussion generated by a new study. For this study, researchers looked at how good the BMI was as a single measure of cardiovascular health and found that it wasn’t very good at all: Nearly half of those considered overweight by BMI had a healthy “cardiometabolic profile,” including a normal blood pressure, cholesterol, and blood sugar. About a third of people with normal BMI measures had an unhealthy cardiometabolic profile. The authors bemoaned the “inaccuracy” of the BMI. They claim it translates into mislabeling millions of people as unhealthy and also overlooking millions of others who are actually unhealthy, but are considered “healthy” by BMI alone.\* > **[BMI Is A Terrible Measure Of Health](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bmi-is-a-terrible-measure-of-health/)** > > If you want to know whether you may be overweight, you’ve likely confronted your BMI, or body mass index, to see where you fall on the spectrum of “underweight”… _BMI Is A Terrible Measure Of Health But we keep using it anyway…Taken alone as an indicator of health, the BMI is misleading. A study by researchers at UCLA published this month in the International Journal of Obesity looked at 40,420 adults in the most recent U.S. National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey and assessed their health as measured by six accepted metrics, including blood pressure, cholesterol and C-reactive protein (a gauge of inflammation). It found that 47 percent of people classified as overweight by BMI and 29 percent of those who qualified as obese were healthy as measured by at least five of those other metrics. Meanwhile, 31 percent of normal-weight people were unhealthy by two or more of the same measures.2 Using BMI alone as a measure of health would misclassify almost 75 million adults in the U.S., the authors concluded._ > **[Why BMI is inaccurate and misleading](https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/265215)** > > Body Mass Index (BMI) is not a very accurate measurement for determining whether somebody is of normal weight, overweight or obese, researchers say. \*Why BMI is inaccurate and misleading BMI (body mass index), which is based on the height and weight of a person, is an inaccurate measure of body fat content and does not take into account muscle mass, bone density, overall body composition, and racial and sex differences, say researchers from the Perelman School of Medicine, University of Pennsylvania. Every few months the same comment is made by experts “BMI is flawed”. The news hits the headlines, everybody agrees, and then all goes quiet for a while.\* ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/77 "2020-02-14T18:04:17Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > I am told over and over, “Your lifespan will increase by an average of five years if you change your lifestyle completely by cooking only the healthiest food (and cleaning up after that as well), and including lots of daily exercise. Think of it, five extra years!” > It’s worth noting that my response is usually, “Well gee, those five years will probably be in the shittiest phase of my life as I will be presumably quite elderly. Both of my parents were incapable of living unassisted in the last five years of their lives. Why go through all that unwanted rigamarole of healthy food and exercise just to get to a situation I probably wouldn’t like anyway?” AIUI, it’s not just a matter of lengthened lifespan, but quality of life. Suppose you’re 40 now. If you live a sedentary unhealthy lifestyle, you may live just 30 more years, of low-quality, joint-aching, slow-moving, sciaticatic, pricking-fingers-every-day-because-of-diabetes, eyesight-blurry life. But if you exercise and eat and live well, you get 35 more years of _high-quality, invigorating, feel-good life._ So the difference is immense. (I don’t mean “you” as in you **Two Many Cats** personally, but as in people in general) ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/78 "2020-02-14T18:16:35Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > AIUI, it’s not just a matter of lengthened lifespan, but quality of life. > > Suppose you’re 40 now. If you live a sedentary unhealthy lifestyle, you may live just 30 more years, of low-quality, joint-aching, slow-moving, sciaticatic, pricking-fingers-every-day-because-of-diabetes, eyesight-blurry life. > > But if you exercise and eat and live well, you get 35 more years of _high-quality, invigorating, feel-good life._ So the difference is immense. > > (I don’t mean “you” as in you **Two Many Cats** personally, but as in people in general) Yes, but I have never had a high-quality, invigorating, feel-good life, and I sincerely doubt eating healthy and exercising would supply one, based on my own experience. I think a great deal of obese people would agree with me based on theirs. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/79 "2020-02-14T18:33:57Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > AIUI, it’s not just a matter of lengthened lifespan, but quality of life. > > Suppose you’re 40 now. If you live a sedentary unhealthy lifestyle, you may live just 30 more years, of low-quality, joint-aching, slow-moving, sciaticatic, pricking-fingers-every-day-because-of-diabetes, eyesight-blurry life. > > But if you exercise and eat and live well, you get 35 more years of _high-quality, invigorating, feel-good life._ So the difference is immense. > > (I don’t mean “you” as in you **Two Many Cats** personally, but as in people in general) Yeah, see, I went through a period of over a year where I was seriously constraining my diet and using the exercise bike for an hour and a half a night, every night. Lost a hundred pounds. At no point during that did I _ever_ feel more invigorated or energetic or any of that stuff. I am not kidding here - I lost a hundred pounds and felt exactly the same before and after. That “healthy living makes you feel great!” stuff might work for some people, but for me it’s a load of crap. Yeah it makes my _numbers_ better, and my doctor happier, but as far as my life experience goes it’s a complete and massive waste of time. ---
**Author:** ![Kovitlac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/2bfe46/32.png) [@Kovitlac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kovitlac)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/80 "2020-02-14T18:48:24Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > BMI was never, ever a "good idea’ for healthy weight. It wasnt designed for ti, and today it’s even worse, having been changed by the diet industry so they can make more $$. > [Europe PMC](https://europepmc.org/article/med/15615272) > _Abstract > –The Body Mass Index (BMI) is used as a measure of overweight and obesity. In epidemiological studies age, sex and ethnic background all have to be taken into consideration, particularly when determining the health risk caused by the amount of body fat. --Caution should be observed when using the BMI as a measure for interpreting overweight and obesity as body composition can be highly variable yet have the same BMI. Therefore, BMI is not a reliable measurement of body composition in individuals particularly in older and younger people. --Excess body fat in the visceral depot poses a separate health risk. The BMI does not give any insight into regional body fat distribution. Waist circumference is a valid index of visceral fat accumulation and can therefore be used as an indicator of health risks associated with visceral obesity._ > > [https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/79/3/379/4690122](https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/79/3/379/4690122) > _Waist circumference and not body mass index explains obesity-related health risk_ > > [Misclassification of cardiometabolic health when using body mass index categories in NHANES 2005–2012 | International Journal of Obesity](https://www.nature.com/articles/ijo201617) > Misclassification of cardiometabolic health when using body mass index categories in NHANES 2005–2012 > > [How useful is the body mass index (BMI)? - Harvard Health](https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/how-useful-is-the-body-mass-index-bmi-201603309339) > \*Should we stop giving so much “weight” to BMI? > That’s exactly what’s being asked in the discussion generated by a new study. For this study, researchers looked at how good the BMI was as a single measure of cardiovascular health and found that it wasn’t very good at all: > > Nearly half of those considered overweight by BMI had a healthy “cardiometabolic profile,” including a normal blood pressure, cholesterol, and blood sugar. > About a third of people with normal BMI measures had an unhealthy cardiometabolic profile. > The authors bemoaned the “inaccuracy” of the BMI. They claim it translates into mislabeling millions of people as unhealthy and also overlooking millions of others who are actually unhealthy, but are considered “healthy” by BMI alone.\* > > [BMI Is A Terrible Measure Of Health | FiveThirtyEight](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/bmi-is-a-terrible-measure-of-health/) > _BMI Is A Terrible Measure Of Health > But we keep using it anyway…Taken alone as an indicator of health, the BMI is misleading. A study by researchers at UCLA published this month in the International Journal of Obesity looked at 40,420 adults in the most recent U.S. National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey and assessed their health as measured by six accepted metrics, including blood pressure, cholesterol and C-reactive protein (a gauge of inflammation). It found that 47 percent of people classified as overweight by BMI and 29 percent of those who qualified as obese were healthy as measured by at least five of those other metrics. Meanwhile, 31 percent of normal-weight people were unhealthy by two or more of the same measures.2 Using BMI alone as a measure of health would misclassify almost 75 million adults in the U.S., the authors concluded._ > > [Why BMI is inaccurate and misleading](https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/265215) > \*Why BMI is inaccurate and misleading > BMI (body mass index), which is based on the height and weight of a person, is an inaccurate measure of body fat content and does not take into account muscle mass, bone density, overall body composition, and racial and sex differences, say researchers from the Perelman School of Medicine, University of Pennsylvania. > > Every few months the same comment is made by experts “BMI is flawed”. The news hits the headlines, everybody agrees, and then all goes quiet for a while.\* I’m seeing an awful lot of those studies saying things like, “Turns out BMI isn’t a good measure of cardiovascular/fat/etc health!” That’s probably because BMI was \*never \*a means to measure cardiovascular health, body fat, or health in general. It’s a simple ratio between your height and your weight, and gives you a reasonable idea of what sort of increased (or decreased) risks you \*might \*be exposing yourself to. That’s it. I agree that it’s not the end-all, be-all _on it’s own._ You should also look at things like your fat ratio. But BMI is something that anyone can easily check at home, where as any home methods of measuring body fat percentage are pretty useless (personally, I’d LOVE to get a DEXA scan, just to get a totally accurate look at what my own body fat percentage is. Unfortunately, my insurance would never cover it). Calipers are probably the most accurate at-home option, but not everyone has those. If your BMI is high, your first thought shouldn’t be, “Well, BMI is stupid and wrong, anyway!” It should be, “My BMI matches The Rock. Do I look like The Rock? No? Maybe I should lose a little weight.” TBH, I would have called myself healthy when I was obese. My blood pressure wasn’t high, my heart was great, I could walk for miles, etc. I was also in my 20’s. Youth is a HUGE benefit, but it doesn’t last forever. The longer you’re obese, the more you risk developing obesity-related affects. I’m so, SO happy I lost the weight when I did, and am going into my 20’s with a body that has the best chance of living longer and staying healthier. Also, please tell me what you mean by the ‘diet industry’. Yeah, fad diets are bullshit and not sustainable. Anyone looking to sell you on a guarantee to lose weight is trying to get paid and nothing else. A real, sustainable diet (or lifestyle change) doesn’t cost you anything extra - I actually saved a ton of money when I lost most of my weight. Because, shocker, I wasn’t eating so much junk. ---
**Author:** ![rsat3acr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a3d4f5/32.png) [@rsat3acr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rsat3acr)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/81 "2020-02-14T18:54:40Z")
Jim Fixx couldn’t outrun his genes. ---
**Author:** ![Kovitlac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/2bfe46/32.png) [@Kovitlac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kovitlac)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/82 "2020-02-14T18:59:44Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > AIUI, it’s not just a matter of lengthened lifespan, but quality of life. > > Suppose you’re 40 now. If you live a sedentary unhealthy lifestyle, you may live just 30 more years, of low-quality, joint-aching, slow-moving, sciaticatic, pricking-fingers-every-day-because-of-diabetes, eyesight-blurry life. > > But if you exercise and eat and live well, you get 35 more years of _high-quality, invigorating, feel-good life._ So the difference is immense. > > (I don’t mean “you” as in you **Two Many Cats** personally, but as in people in general) Exactly. Look at the people on My 600 lb Life. I feel so, so much for them. Often completely bed-bound, suffering from breathing problems, diabetes, a failing heart, skin rashes, wounds that will not heal, the list goes on. And you do NOT have to be 600 lbs to face less-extreme versions of these problems, either. They can sneak up on you, leading you to think you always felt this way. I ‘only’ hit 200 lbs (as a 5’4 female). Obese, but not vastly so. Not anywhere near morbidly obese. But I had a rash on my ankle that had lasted so long it discolored my skin. My doctor said it wasn’t harming me, but there’s a good chance my skin would always be discolored. I also had the WORST fry, scaly elbows. It actually hurt to brush them. I figured that was just the way I was, seeing as I had them as long as I really remembered. After losing 80 lbs, the rash is entire gone, as are my scaly elbows. In general my skin is much healthier. My periods are also a LOT lighter (which I’m only realizing now, having gone off BC in the last couple months). I won’t say you go through extreme weight loss without any issues at all (my hormone are still kind of fluctuating). Weight loss can have some odd, unexpected effects, and I certainly won’t deny that. It’s more like adjusting to a difference that doesn’t really matter that much, when I also have a stronger, healthier and, IMO, much better-looking body (and I don’t feel that wanting to look better is anything to apologize for). ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2020, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154/83 "2020-02-14T19:19:24Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > Yeah, see, I went through a period of over a year where I was seriously constraining my diet and using the exercise bike for an hour and a half a night, every night. Lost a hundred pounds. > > At no point during that did I _ever_ feel more invigorated or energetic or any of that stuff. I am not kidding here - I lost a hundred pounds and felt exactly the same before and after. > > That “healthy living makes you feel great!” stuff might work for some people, but for me it’s a load of crap. Yeah it makes my _numbers_ better, and my doctor happier, but as far as my life experience goes it’s a complete and massive waste of time. I am with you all the way. There was a time where I exercised regularly three times a week for two years. I managed to lose over twenty pounds. The gym owner oohh’ed and aahh’d. But did I feel better? I did not. In fact, I resented every minute the gym took away from me being able to get home and do the frickin’ chores that were still there waiting for me. Did the exercise do me good? I must admit, I had more stamina to do the workouts compared from when I began to when I quit the gym. But stamina for what? To do all the frickin’ work I had to do otherwise? I didn’t feel great. I just felt pissed off that the workouts were another frickin’ chore on my list. I understand that exercise is good for your health. I understand that it is a necessary thing. But please, quit lying about how great you will feel about it once it’s a part of your life. Please stop saying that it will cure your depression. It probably won’t. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-message-would-it-take-to-make-obesity-rates-plummet-dramatically/841154.md?page=5)