# What now? Re: London attacks. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 7, 2005, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-now-re-london-attacks/311467 "2005-07-07T16:15:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2005, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-now-re-london-attacks/311467/101 "2005-07-13T01:50:49Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > And in Nov. 19, 1999, Muslim clerics issued a fatwa against Osama. > > [http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/revents/02/19990211.htm](http://www.hindu.com/thehindu/revents/02/19990211.htm) > > Before 9/11 BTW. > [@Frankenstein Monster](#): > > Bah. Friedman is wrong. this was moderately big news recently. Just look at the number of Google results for “Fatwa against Bin Laden”. Well, that’s somewhat reassuring. I’m surprised Friedman appears to have gotten this wrong - he’s usually pretty careful with his facts. But there are other disturbing signs that al-Qaida has significant support in the ME. For example: [Osama Baby Craze Hits Nigeria](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/1741171.stm) > [@](#): > > This comes as reports from mainly Muslim northern Nigeria say that there has been a massive increase in the number of baby boys called Osama - after Bin Laden. > > In one hospital in Kano, **where there were celebrations after the 11 September attacks** , seven out of 10 babies are said to be being given the name Osama. This was before the Iraq invasion, btw. And the name “Osama” rose in popularity throughout the ME after 9/11, as I recall. In addition, there were celebrations and cheers all over the middle east on 9/11. To this day, there are muslim organizations that ‘celebrate’ the anniversary of 9/11, including an extremist muslim organization in London of all places. And the Palestinian suicide bombers had plenty of support throughout the ME, as have other terrorist groups. Ask yourself this: If a sect of Christianity suddenly began murdering people and blowing up things in the name of Christ, how fast do you think other Christian leaders would run out to denounce them and point out that they do not represent all Christians and are perverting the gospels? It would be mighty fast. And the rank and file of Christianity would be doing the same at every opportunity. We should expect no less from Muslim leaders when it comes to al-Qaida, but they’ve fallen far short of that. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2005, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-now-re-london-attacks/311467/102 "2005-07-13T05:05:15Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Well, that’s somewhat reassuring. I’m surprised Friedman appears to have gotten this wrong - he’s usually pretty careful with his facts. > > But there are other disturbing signs that al-Qaida has significant support in the ME. For example: > > [Osama Baby Craze Hits Nigeria](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/1741171.stm) > > This was before the Iraq invasion, btw. And the name “Osama” rose in popularity throughout the ME after 9/11, as I recall. In addition, there were celebrations and cheers all over the middle east on 9/11. To this day, there are muslim organizations that ‘celebrate’ the anniversary of 9/11, including an extremist muslim organization in London of all places. And the Palestinian suicide bombers had plenty of support throughout the ME, as have other terrorist groups. There is a reason why they are called extremist. > [@](#): > > Ask yourself this: If a sect of Christianity suddenly began murdering people and blowing up things in the name of Christ, how fast do you think other Christian leaders would run out to denounce them and point out that they do not represent all Christians and are perverting the gospels? Well, depends of the times, from the time of the crusades to colonial rule, muslims had to wait hundreds of years for denounciations to come. Of course many Christian churches of today denounced the Iraq war… mmm… you do like the progress of many Christian churches regarding Iraq right? > [@](#): > > It would be mighty fast. And the rank and file of Christianity would be doing the same at every opportunity. You know, I was going to say that I agree, but I remembered the nastiness the right wing elements of the Catholic and Protestant churches showed when supporting the repression in Central America, and the rank and file even said that it was ok to kill a commie for Christ. It was nasty in El Salvador since a good number of the dead were not even communists. While religious leaders did complain, excomunication for dictators was not considered, and public condemnation for the repression was weak. Or when it happened, the preachers died. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2005, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-now-re-london-attacks/311467/103 "2005-07-13T05:16:01Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > I’m surprised Friedman appears to have gotten this wrong - he’s usually pretty careful with his facts. He’s created himself a good niche. There’s lots of money to be made in selling outrage. Besides there are not nearly enough semi-repentant war shills trying to feign balance. ---
**Author:** ![Frankenstein\_Monster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ccd318/32.png) [@Frankenstein\_Monster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frankenstein_Monster)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2005, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-now-re-london-attacks/311467/104 "2005-07-13T12:02:27Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > …how fast do you think other Christian leaders would run out to denounce them and point out that they do not represent all Christians and are perverting the gospels? It would be mighty fast. I disagree. I tried googling for news of church leaders denouncing Fred Phelps. I found no mention of any major, minor or magic church leader doing so, although I don’t doubt that many do. Also, zero hits on “Fred Phelps” on the WSJ and two on [Foxnews.com](http://Foxnews.com), neither of which was about church leaders denouncing him. Not that I would blame them entirely. The guy is a crackpot and I imagine he simply wouldn’t be on most normal people’s minds. > [@Sam Stone](#): > > We should expect no less from Muslim leaders when it comes to al-Qaida, but they’ve fallen far short of that. I disagree. They haven’t fallen short. I think Muslim leaders are doing an excellent job of widely and forcefully denouncing terrorism and even, as has been shown, of denouncing OBL. Most certainly they’re doing a much better job than Christian church leaders in analogous cases! Just google or read [Islamonline.com](http://Islamonline.com). The only problem I see is that somehow (right-wing) commentators can’t be bothered to notice this fact. ---
**Author:** ![Frankenstein\_Monster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ccd318/32.png) [@Frankenstein\_Monster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frankenstein_Monster)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2005, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-now-re-london-attacks/311467/105 "2005-07-13T12:11:03Z")
> **[Islam](https://www.learnreligions.com/islam-4684871)** > > Discover the history, beliefs, customs, and practices of Islam, a monotheistic faith practiced by 1.5 billion people around the globe. > [@](#): > > In the aftermath of the violence and horror of 9/11, criticisms were made that Muslim leaders and organizations were not outspoken enough in denouncing acts of terrorism. Muslims are constantly perplexed by this accusation, as we heard (and continue to hear) nothing but unequivocal and unified condemnations by the leaders of our community, both in the United States and worldwide. But for some reason, people are not listening. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2005, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-now-re-london-attacks/311467/106 "2005-07-13T12:31:04Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > In addition, there were celebrations and cheers all over the middle east on 9/11. Evidence, please? There were isolated incidents in Palestine, yes. Anywhere else? ---
**Author:** ![rayh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@rayh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rayh)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2005, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-now-re-london-attacks/311467/107 "2005-07-13T12:47:05Z")
[Muslim leaders condemn attacks](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4677633.stm) > [@](#): > > Nothing in Islam can ever justify the evil actions of the bombers [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-now-re-london-attacks/311467.md?page=5)