# What percentage of Americans don't have passports? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 10, 2003, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402 "2003-11-10T15:03:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/101 "2003-11-13T14:25:50Z")
> [@](#): > > I think the answers given here are wide ranging and absolutely valid. If Europe was one country I think the percentage of people with passports here would be alot lower. Plus we do get a lot more holiday. In fact this point about holiday prompted me to start another thread about whether Americans protest. You should really get more holidays, you need an entire population strike to get this sorted, really. Different values. And of course, we do get a very large compensation for that time, in the form of higher pay, higher living standards, and so forth. Our economy has been doing much better than any in Europe even in the slump, for instance. I’d rather have a job than have no job, even if that hypothetical one involves 6 weeks of vacation. Even middle-class people often end up traveling abroad a great deal once they retire, because they have a lot of money. And jobs with more time off do exist; teachers, for instance, essentially have a large chunk of time every summer. And there are other such jobs. ---
**Author:** ![micco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f8ce5/32.png) [@micco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/micco)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/102 "2003-11-13T14:46:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by naomi2003 \* > **I think what people are confusing is their frustration at an American infiltration of their culture** This is completely irrelevant to the OP, but I just wanted to point out that there are plenty of Americans who are frustrated with this infiltration of our culture as well. Lots of people, especially in smaller towns and rural areas, regard McDonalds, Wal-Mart, and all those other icons of American business as interlopers. They don’t want them on Main Street, USA any more than you want them in Europe. Many towns now have zoning laws that ban the signs and appearances of these stores, so even if there is a McD’s, it doesn’t look like a McD. There are even some towns who have outright banned chains and franchises (often through unwritten rules or other zoning measures which make them unattractive franchise locations rather than a actual regulation against the chains). I bring this up only to make two points: the “average” American might not be what you think it is, and, once again, we’re more alike than we are different. You may hate what you refer to as our “culture”, but we hate a lot of it too. ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/103 "2003-11-13T15:28:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ruadh \* > \*\*But as stated earlier, this doesn’t tell you that 49% of Aussies have passports. \*\* As far as I can tell, your earlier objection was that: > [@](#): > > **I don’t really think you can make a judgement based on those numbers - there’s no way to tell how many of them were renewals, how many of the people they were issued to have since died or let them lapse, etc.** Basic fact here is that passports last for 10 years. So the total number of active passports is the number issued in the last 10 years. You just have to make sure the stats include renewals. There are no lapsed passports counted, since all the ones included haven’t expired yet. You are overcounting dead people, but that’s an acceptable error in my mind. ---
**Author:** ![ruadh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d2c977/32.png) [@ruadh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ruadh)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/104 "2003-11-13T16:28:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SmackFu \* > **There are no lapsed passports counted, since all the ones included haven’t expired yet.** What if they had to be replaced after being lost/stolen/destroyed? (I know too many people, myself included, who have been in this situation to discount it as a factor.) Plus, now that Australia permits dual citizenship, there may also be naturalised citizens who hold active passports of their native country but not of Oz. Combine those factors with the dead people, and I still think it’s just not possible to get an accurate measure simply from the number of passports issued in the previous ten years. Not saying it mightn’t be reasonably close, but there’s just no way to know. ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/105 "2003-11-13T17:03:28Z")
This has been an interesting discussion, but I’m surprised that apparently I’m the first to enter “Percentage,Americans,Passport” into a search engine, which yielded the following links: [Phil Gyford](http://www.gyford.com/phil/writing/2003/01/31/how_many_america.php) tries to calculate the number of current passport holders using official sources. Conclusion: about 22% [Jeffrey Allen Miller](http://www.thinkandask.com/news/theclown.html): a rant on American arrogance (he’s against it) that claims that “The number of passport holders in The United States has increased since 1980. In New York City, 38 percent of citizens have passports, the highest rate of any U.S. city. Overall in The United States 18 percent hold passports says the U.S. Office of Central Statistics.” However, a quick search doesn’t find any evidence for the existence of such an office, except as cites in articles such as this one. [This page](http://edss.wrdsb.edu.on.ca/courses/hsb4mi/Insularity%20Index.htm) says that the _Toronto Star_ library staff determined the number to be 20%. Not unimpeachable sources (I only spent about ten minutes looking), but 20% would seem to be the right ballpark. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/106 "2003-11-13T17:14:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by commasense \* > \*\*Not unimpeachable sources (I only spent about ten minutes looking), but 20% would seem to be the right ballpark. \*\* Given the circumstances hashed out in this thread, that figure is acceptable for the United States. I would have guessed more like 5-10%. Even if 20% is lower than other nations, comparing the American travel habits to those of other nations is really an apples-and-oranges comparison anyway. ---
**Author:** ![ruadh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d2c977/32.png) [@ruadh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ruadh)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/107 "2003-11-13T17:20:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by commasense \* > \*\*I’m surprised that apparently I’m the first to enter “Percentage,Americans,Passport” \*\* You’re not. I just didn’t find anything that appeared to be _official_ statistics, or statistics obtained through any kind of rigorous investigation - only the various unsupported figures I referred to early on. ---
**Author:** ![commasense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/commasense/32/3017_2.png) [@commasense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/commasense)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/108 "2003-11-13T18:00:41Z")
C’mon **ruadh**. You’re going to have to lower your standards a bit! Unsupported? It’s on the Internet! It has to be true! ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/109 "2003-11-13T18:39:02Z")
> [@](#): > > I’d rather have a job than have no job, even if that hypothetical one involves 6 weeks of vacation. Are we sure that this is the trade-off? I’m sure that’s what our corporate masters want us to think. ---
**Author:** ![ruadh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d2c977/32.png) [@ruadh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ruadh)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/110 "2003-11-13T19:45:41Z")
Never mind that, I’d like a cite for the claim that the US economy has been doing better than _any_ European economy. I have a number of unemployed friends in America who might disagree. ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/111 "2003-11-13T20:01:42Z")
[Here are the standardized numbers for unemployment](http://www.financialstandard.com.au/index.php?id=2681): > [@](#): > > In the Euro area, the standardised unemployment rate remained at 8.8% in September 2003, which is 0.3% higher than a year earlier. For the US, the standardised unemployment rate remained at 6.1% in September. ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/112 "2003-11-13T20:03:40Z")
Oh, the original poster meant better than every country in Europe. That was not a smart claim. Never mind my cite. ---
**Author:** ![OpalCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8edcca/32.png) [@OpalCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OpalCat)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/113 "2003-11-13T20:14:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by naomi2003 \* > \*\* In fact this point about holiday prompted me to start another thread about whether Americans protest. You should really get more holidays, you need an entire population strike to get this sorted, really. \*\* Small hijack… I know this was pointed out in the other thread, but I did want to just make the tiny mention here as well… there is no law making vacation time mandatory at all. It’s purely at the whim of the employerr. Thus, only small per-employer strikes would ever do any good… and they probably still wouldn’t help anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/114 "2003-11-13T20:21:37Z")
Well, **Opalcat** , just because there is currently no federal law mandating vacation time doesn’t mean an “entire population strike” (assuming it could ever happen) wouldn’t be effective either to persuade all (or many) employers to grant it or to persuade Congress to mandate it. (Congress probably does have the power to do so, although it hasn’t.) I think it would be far more effective than “small per-employer strikes.” ---
**Author:** ![Rayne\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df705f/32.png) [@Rayne\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rayne_Man)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/115 "2003-11-13T20:35:52Z")
What you need in the US is something akin to the EU Working Time Directive which says that all working people are entitled to a minimum of 20 paid vacation days plus public holidays per year. This same directive also says that , if you elect to , you cannot be forced to work more than 48 hours in a week . ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/116 "2003-11-13T20:45:54Z")
There are some federal laws related to working hours, but they are not extensive as the European laws. For example, in the U.S., if you work more than 40 hours in one week you are entitled to time-and-a-half pay. ---
**Author:** ![cher3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/da6949/32.png) [@cher3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cher3)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/117 "2003-11-13T21:46:26Z")
I think that in America travel has also been seen as one of those things you’ll get around to after you retire. (Or, for people my age **if** you retire.) My parents get a lot of publications geared toward the 60+ crowd and they are full of ads and articles about travel, domestic and foreign. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/118 "2003-11-13T22:26:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by even sven \* > \*\* > > First comes the American obsession with privacy. American guidebooks do not list hotels with shared bathrooms- which is pretty common in Europe. \*\* You do find shared bedrooms in bed-and-breakfast type places, in America. Speaking for myself, I have no problem with that. But I doubt I could stand for the rigidity and spartan nature of hosteling (compulsory lights-out and wake-up times, mid-day lockouts, multibed “dormitories” etc.) ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2003, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/119 "2003-11-13T23:54:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ruadh \* > \*\*Naomi, I admit I was a bit suspicious of your motives at first too but that’s an entirely reasonable post. > > I do find it funny that here in Ireland you get people accusing Americans of not travelling abroad … and then you also get people complaining about the number of American tourists everywhere! \*\* How’s that qoute g? “Overpaid, Oversexed and Over here”? ---
**Author:** ![gcarroll](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/65b543/32.png) [@gcarroll](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gcarroll)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2003, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402/120 "2003-11-14T00:58:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by AndrewT \* > \*\*The Americans here seem to believe that the reasons Americans don’t travel much outside the USA are: > > 1/ the USA is so geographically big and diverse there is no need to > > 2/ the USA is so culturally big and diverse there is no need to > If these were the case they would apply to other large and “diverse” countries. For instance Canada, Australia, China, or India. Also the EU, which is essentially a nation state now. But this is not so; apart from China where there are political restrictions, those countries’ middle and upper classes travel internationally far more than Americans do. They all have pretty much as diverse a geography as the US. > > … > But I love yez all 🙂 \*\* From most places in the US you can drive for 8000 km without needing a passport. Travel within that huge area is very easy and fairly diverse (Mexico, Canada, New Orleans, Atlanta, and Boston are actually very different). Travel overseas requires flying over the Atlantic or Pacific oceans, so it’s not like travelling just a bit more it’s a huge additional effort to get the passport you otherwise don’t need, plan the greater travel time, etc. I agree international travel for pleasure is worth it, but I can understand disagreement. Also, while travel abroad is common enough that there is no “status” increase from doing it, there is no stigma from not having traveled either. I suspect that in many other cultures this is not so. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-percentage-of-americans-dont-have-passports/212402.md?page=7)