# What’s the worst thing about being an atheist? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 25, 2023, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166 "2023-04-25T13:18:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2023, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/381 "2023-05-11T15:24:21Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > WTF is “The Circle?” People you with whom are close. (Add “inner”.) ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2023, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/382 "2023-05-11T15:26:10Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > everything is allowed to pass by with the loosest and laxest standard of evidence. No standard at all, as far as I can see, except that it’s printed in a book or someone (or some voice in someone’s head) said so. > [@Velocity](#): > > I’m not saying **everything** about Christianity is false, but a lot of false stuff is swallowed without question. Pretty much every religion has the odd bit of good advice here and there amid the crazy nonsense. Little enough of it to be statistical noise. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2023, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/383 "2023-05-11T15:34:00Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > “_I’m kind of under the weather_” is all anyone outside _the Circle_ needs to know. And your basis for making this the universal standard of conduct? ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2023, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/384 "2023-05-11T18:09:05Z")
Jesus, the man’s dying. He can cope with that however he wants. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2023, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/385 "2023-05-11T20:52:59Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > > [@eschereal](#): > > > > “_I’m kind of under the weather_” is all anyone outside _the Circle_ needs to know. > > And your basis for making this the universal standard of conduct? Man, talk about straw-manning. If you are famous and you would rather not have people praying for you or having religousy discussions about your “immortal soul”, not announcing your imminent demise to the world seems like the best course. Everybody does not need to know, just the people who matter to you. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2023, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/386 "2023-05-11T20:59:22Z")
So, its just atheists who should shut up in public about their health problems? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2023, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/387 "2023-05-11T22:58:08Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Everybody does not need to know, just the people who matter to you. as a physician i have noted that many people who have grim prognoses feel better making this information known in general. in fact i tend to do this myself. it knocks down barriers, makes things less awkward in general, and gives a sense of relief, release, and opens up more healthy discussions for many folks. i don’t want folks praying for me or having religious discussions at me about my own cancer diagnosis, but i am **not** going to avoid being open about what’s important and helpful to me or let others tell me how i should communicate with the world about it. if that style doesn’t work for you, it doesn’t bother me a bit if you choose not to do it yourself. but i won’t sit around and listen to someone say my way is wrong without speaking up. whether i’m a famous atheist or not (and i know i’m not famous). ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2023, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/388 "2023-05-11T23:14:03Z")
If you don’t say anything before you die, religionists can claim that you were ashamed of being an atheist and/or you made a deathbed conversion. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2023, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/389 "2023-05-12T03:02:05Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Man, talk about straw-manning. If you are famous and you would rather not have people praying for you or having religousy discussions about your “immortal soul”, not announcing your imminent demise to the world seems like the best course. Everybody does not need to know, just the people who matter to you. Perhaps he wanted to be a counterexample to the spurious theist claim that atheists facing death will immediately find Jebus. ---
**Author:** ![slicedalone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slicedalone/32/12515_2.png) [@slicedalone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slicedalone)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2023, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/390 "2023-05-19T16:32:25Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > I would go with something along the lines of “_I’m here for you_.” Why not go with a rendition of the entire “Friends” theme song? ---
**Author:** ![Zaxxon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3be4f8/32.png) [@Zaxxon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zaxxon)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/391 "2024-02-20T01:28:16Z")
Actually, since I don’t believe there are any supernatural agents, humanity is completely to blame for everything that’s disturbing in life. However, the reality is that by almost any measure of social ill, the world is doing better today than ever. Atheists have all of their lives to enjoy, and create meaning with, rather than just waiting for some unseen “reward” of praising god 24 x 7 for all of eternity. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/392 "2024-02-20T01:58:06Z")
The best thing about being an atheist is knowing that you have agency, that you alone are responsible for your moral choices. The worst thing about being an atheist is knowing that you have agency, that you alone are responsible for your moral choices. The difference arises if you think you are in need of absolution. Atheists know there is no such thing, so they have to internalize their own failings and accept who they are. Determining to be better is the only way out, but it’s a lot harder than confession. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/393 "2024-02-20T09:17:15Z")
Being widely hated, generally not daring to so much as _mention_ being an atheist for fear of reprisal, and having the theists all try to turn society into a horrific theocracy. I don’t consider the lack of a god a downside, since it means the universe and our own fates aren’t under the control of an invincible, all-powerful megalomaniac. And I find the great majority of supposed afterlives to be repulsive at best; I’d _rather_ just cease to exist. As an atheist I realize I’ll neither be tortured forever in Hell, nor be reduced to a mindless praise-bot in Heaven. ---
**Author:** ![scudsucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scudsucker/32/14101_2.png) [@scudsucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scudsucker)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/394 "2024-02-20T09:47:56Z")
Holding hands while someone says grace before a meal. God, I hate it. I don’t want to participate in your magical spell. I do it, reluctantly, so as to avoid offence. And I am a fairly militant atheist. On the other hand, I love classical church music, loved the sound of the two muezzin at the two local mosques I used to live near, and like the church bells where I live now. ---
**Author:** ![themapleleaf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/themapleleaf/32/14349_2.png) [@themapleleaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/themapleleaf)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/395 "2024-02-20T10:23:34Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > I don’t consider the lack of a god a downside, since it means the universe and our own fates aren’t under the control of an invincible, all-powerful megalomaniac. And I find the great majority of supposed afterlives to be repulsive at best; I’d _rather_ just cease to exist. As an atheist I realize I’ll neither be tortured forever in Hell, nor be reduced to a mindless praise-bot in Heaven. This pretty much sums it up for me. I cannot put in words how hateful and repulsive a concept the Abrahamic god is for me, and no theological spin that anyone of any persuasion has given him has managed to convince me otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/396 "2024-02-20T11:16:04Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > The best thing about being an atheist is knowing that you have agency, that you alone are responsible for your moral choices. > > The worst thing about being an atheist is knowing that you have agency, that you alone are responsible for your moral choices. I think I know what you mean, but a big part of Christianity at least is the concept of free will, and that your moral agency will allow you to condemn yourself to hell if you so choose. What religions tend to give you is not freedom from the burden of agency, but a more or less prescriptive guide about what the right moral choices are that you then get to choose to follow or not. This can be in the form of general principles (“love thy neighbour”) or highly specific rules (“no pork”). Atheism gives a person considerably more freedom in what moral code to follow including the options of a) no moral code whatsoever (“say what you like about National Socialism, at least its an ethos”) and b) switching moral codes when you realise there’s a better way. But more importantly, it doesn’t offer _consequences_. If an atheist believes murder is morally wrong, and yet commits murder, they might of course face secular punishment, and they might be tortured by their conscience but they won’t expect any kind of divine or karmic punishment. Nor would the threat of such punishment stay their hand. There are of course upsides and downsides to this, as you say. And of course, Nietzche’s point that, having ostensibly freed themselves from the shackles of religion, an astonishing number of European atheists independently formulated a moral code that was in many ways similar to then-current Christian _mores_ remains a good one and does indicate the psycho-social limits of this freedom. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/397 "2024-02-20T11:28:20Z")
As is often pointed out in such discussions, as a direct consequence of the claim that God is omniscient, omnipotent and creator of the universe _no one and nothing_ has any agency save God himself. Ever action, every thought, every emotion anyone has ever had or done was decided on by God before the universe existed, and people go to heaven or hell because he decided they would. And for no other reason. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/398 "2024-02-20T11:48:55Z")
The doctrine of predestination is indeed a time-honoured one. So is the doctrine of free will. It is absolutely part of Christian theology. Whether pre-destination is a direct and inevitable consequence of an omniscient creator God is not a settled question. In any case, this is a very Christian kind of atheism! The atheist rejects the God of predestination, but also the God of free will, and also the gods that administer karma. Of the many religions that proclaim divine or spiritual punishment for people who choose wrong actions, the atheist rejects them all. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/399 "2024-02-20T11:56:55Z")
Free will is a part of (some) Christian theology; it also makes no sense, either by itself or in the context of an omnipotent and omniscient creator God. The latter absolutely requires complete and total predestination. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2024, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166/400 "2024-02-20T12:17:32Z")
> [@scudsucker](#): > > Holding hands while someone says grace before a meal. To each their own, but for me (an atheist) this is actually one of the few (quasi-)religious rituals I don’t mind. It depends on what you mean by “grace.” Taking a moment to collectively acknowledge gratitude – to be together for a moment, not staring at our damned phones – that, I treasure. But if the speaker invokes God or Jesus, yeah, I feel you. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-s-the-worst-thing-about-being-an-atheist/983166.md?page=21)