# What should be done in the Medford School District/Teacher's Union Dispute? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 18, 2014, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640 "2014-02-18T18:29:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/41 "2014-02-19T16:48:38Z")
Six year degree in Oregon … ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/42 "2014-02-19T16:53:43Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > This is part of why a free-market model works so poorly for schools. > > With a product like, say, chocolate chip cookies, it’s awesome for folks to choose. If the consumer (and here I specifically mean the person who selects and purchases the goods, not necessarily the person who uses them–that’ll be important soon) decides not to get cookies, that’s cool. If they decide to buy cheap cookies, that’s cool too, and if they decide to buy the world’s awesomest cookies, bully for them. Wanna make their own? Groovy. The market can decide the fate of both cookie and eater (with of course sensible health regulations to prevent rat poison being sold as cookies). > > That doesn’t work with education, for several reasons: > > 1. In a private market, the consumer isn’t necessarily the product’s user. Generally a parent would make a choice, the child would consume. > 2. The consequences for a poor choice on the part of the consumer falls on the product’s user in an extremely powerful fashion. > 3. The quality of a child’s education has a far greater impact on society at large than does the quality of a chocolate chip cookie. > 4. If someone doesn’t choose to eat cookies (or to feed them to their kids), that’s, you’ll recall, cool. If someone doesn’t choose to educate their child, that’s not okay. > > So we can’t have a private market for education and expect good results. Society as a whole makes decisions about education (hopefully with a great deal of deference to what the professionals in the field advise). This works best via a monopoly on education: we’re all in this together. > > Since we generally operate education according to a democratically-controlled monopoly (which isn’t so weird–it’s also how we operate the military, law enforcement, and sanitation, for example), teachers can’t really say, “I don’t like my employer, I’m gonna go find another one.” There are a lot of sunken costs in becoming a teacher, and the skillset isn’t super-transferable to other fields; there aren’t really other employers. > > I mean, sure, you can switch districts, and plenty of teachers do: I realized last night that all three of the former mentors I had in my first few years of teaching no longer teach in my state (one having become a full-time mom who’s fighting for the rights of same-sex couples in my state, the other two having accepted teaching jobs in Asia, where they’ll be respected and paid better). But moving is not a realistic option for plenty of folks–my family, for example, is tied here by familial obligations not subject to free market forces. > > I’m not completely convinced that union actions are the best way of resolving these disputes. But I do know that free market solutions when applied to public education don’t lead to good results. Your solution does not follow from your problems. The problem is that the interests of the child are not always perfectly aligned with the interests of the parents. There are parents who would keep their kids at home or at a job instead of at school. If there are enough of these parents then there would be eventually a shortage of educated people to work and the country as a whole would suffer. However this problem is entirely hypothetical, before most states had compulsory education 76% of children in 1890 went to grammar school. That is before cars were available, and the majority of people lived and worked on farms away from cities and with relatively little need for education. Today in Japan high school is not mandatory yet 96% of children attend high school. Aside from a few subcultures such as the Gypsies there is no evidence that parents would keep children from an education if it were not mandatory. As for quality of schooling the idea that a monopoly provides the best version of an education is hard to argue for theoretically or practically. Think evolutionarily, if you have two systems, one where organizations can not be disbanded no matter how poorly they do and they can not expand no matter how well they do, and another system where organizations that do poorly fail and organizations that do well expand. We would expect the first system to change slowly and stagnate and the second system to start slowly and gradually get better and better. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/43 "2014-02-19T17:04:01Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > That median household income figure is from _1999_ - and the _mean_ teacher salary is [$46k](http://www.teachersalaryinfo.com/oregon/teacher-salary-in-medford-school-district-549c/). Nice cherry-picking. Current median income from the last census is $42,244 which is still 20% less than the median salary for an elementary school teacher. The average salary of $46k seems to include pre-school teachers and not just public school teachers. Median income for a teacher gives a much better idea of what the teachers who are striking actually make. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/44 "2014-02-19T17:15:16Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > Your solution does not follow from your problems. I agree, since I didn’t propose a solution. > [@](#): > > However this problem is entirely hypothetical, before most states had compulsory education 76% of children in 1890 went to grammar school. That is before cars were available, and the majority of people lived and worked on farms away from cities and with relatively little need for education. First, would you cite this figure? I’m pretty skeptical, and would like to know its parameters. Second, are we okay with a quarter of our kids not being in school? I mean, maybe we are: we’re comfortable with roughly that number living in poverty, having the highest percentage of kids in poverty in the developed world if you don’t count (I think) Romania. Third, that’s not a relevant stat: the question is about the **quality** of education we’d get if we don’t have a democratically-agreed-upon educational system. > [@](#): > > s for quality of schooling the idea that a monopoly provides the best version of an education is hard to argue for theoretically or practically. Think evolutionarily, if you have two systems, one where organizations can not be disbanded no matter how poorly they do and they can not expand no matter how well they do, and another system where organizations that do poorly fail and organizations that do well expand. We would expect the first system to change slowly and stagnate and the second system to start slowly and gradually get better and better. Evolution has nothing to do with it. Even if it did, your proposal suggests that the US military is a far inferior force to mercenary groups–are you comfortable with that implication? And the facts don’t bear out what you suggest, anyway. Private and charter schools perform, once you control for demographics, about on par with public schools. The problem with them is that their structural model is not expansible. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/45 "2014-02-19T17:16:16Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > Current median income from the last census is $42,244 which is still 20% less than the median salary for an elementary school teacher. The average salary of $46k seems to include pre-school teachers and not just public school teachers. Median income for a teacher gives a much better idea of what the teachers who are striking actually make. So you’re saying that teachers using a 6-year degree earn about 10% more than the median of all households, even including families in which the wage earner dropped out of high school, or majored in art history? Apples and oranges. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/46 "2014-02-19T19:21:44Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > I agree, since I didn’t propose a solution. > First, would you cite this figure? I’m pretty skeptical, and would like to know its parameters. Second, are we okay with a quarter of our kids not being in school? I mean, maybe we are: we’re comfortable with roughly that number living in poverty, having the highest percentage of kids in poverty in the developed world if you don’t count (I think) Romania. Third, that’s not a relevant stat: the question is about the **quality** of education we’d get if we don’t have a democratically-agreed-upon educational system. > > Evolution has nothing to do with it. Even if it did, your proposal suggests that the US military is a far inferior force to mercenary groups–are you comfortable with that implication? > > And the facts don’t bear out what you suggest, anyway. Private and charter schools perform, once you control for demographics, about on par with public schools. The problem with them is that their structural model is not expansible. [Cite](http://www.jstor.org/stable/2112383) Alot has happened in the past 125 years so I think school attendance would not fall much at all and may even be greater if school were not compulsory and a government monopoly. Evolution has everything to do with it. Competition is why we carry cell phones around in our pockets with more computing power than the space program had in the 1960s. Monopolies are why the food at the airport is so expensive and why you have to wait so long for a cable repairman. I have no doubt on a per soldier basis mercenaries are much more effective than regular armies, just because all of the merenaries who are bad soldiers are all likely dead or quit the business. However, armies have a return to scale that education just does not have. It is better to have mediocre soldiers and billion dollar weapons than a bunch of small and highly effective mercenary armies. Studies show that private and charter schools provide a similar education for significantly less money. That is just the begining, there is no reason to believe that all methods of schooling and school organizations are equally effective. Having competition means that the less effective methods are shunted aside and more effective methods can be allowed to propogate. It is univerally acknowledged that the US education system is pretty mediocre, I don’t agree, but that is the consensus. However there is one part of that system that is universally acknowledged as the best in the world. The US college system is not a government run monopoly but has thousands of various colleges and universities. As a result the US has 17 of the top 20 universities in the world. The incentives are the same in colleges as the other forms of schooling, yet in the area with competition we have the best in the world by a long way and in the area with no competition expensive mediocrity. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/47 "2014-02-19T19:24:17Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > So you’re saying that teachers using a 6-year degree earn about 10% more than the median of all households, even including families in which the wage earner dropped out of high school, or majored in art history? > > Apples and oranges. I have no position on how much teachers should be paid, that should be up to the market to decide. I am just trying to refute the idea that the school district in question is offering “rock bottom compensation” ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/48 "2014-02-19T20:03:49Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > [Cite](http://www.jstor.org/stable/2112383) > Alot has happened in the past 125 years so I think school attendance would not fall much at all and may even be greater if school were not compulsory and a government monopoly. I read the preview for that cite. I’m unwilling to pay the $14 for the full article, and nothing in the preview mentions the statistic you offered up earlier, nor does it explain their methodology well enough to show whether the stat refers to very young children, high-school-aged children, black Southern children, children of recent immigrants who don’t speak English, Native American children, etc. More importantly, though, it doesn’t cite what you claim it cites. In 1890, [25 of the 44 states in the United States had compulsory education](http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0112617.html). That doesn’t jibe with your claim that “before most states had compulsory education 76% of children in 1890 went to grammar school.” Moreover, it’s not clear whether prior to state compulsory education laws, there were county or municipal compulsory education laws. Moreover, it treats highly populated states like Massachusetts as similar to much more sparsely populated states like Nebraska. If your stat is correct, it may be that 95% of kids in states with compulsory education laws attended school, while only 25% of kids in states without such laws attended. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/49 "2014-02-19T20:05:32Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > I have no position on how much teachers should be paid, that should be up to the market to decide. I am just trying to refute the idea that the school district in question is offering “rock bottom compensation” Right–and you’ve failed to refute that idea, since you’re comparing what people get paid when they’re using their six years of college to what people get paid when they dropped out of high school and pick up odd jobs doing menial labor. Nobody claims that teachers get paid less than hamburger jockeys; the question is whether they’re paid commensurate to other professionals. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/50 "2014-02-19T20:11:01Z")
It’s hard to compare one job to another. Teachers get paid less than a lot of other jobs of comparable education, but their hours tend to be better, particularly with the summer off. (From my own experience - i.e. being married to a teacher - I can attest that there’s a lot of work that gets done that’s not during school hours, marking tests, preparing lessons and the like, but it’s still a lot less hours than some of the better paying but similarly educated fields.) Plus the benefits tend to be pretty good for those working for the public school system. I’m not saying teachers are overpaid. But I don’t think you can just compare salary and education level. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/51 "2014-02-19T20:12:10Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > I have no doubt on a per soldier basis mercenaries are much more effective than regular armies, just because all of the mercenaries who are bad soldiers are all likely dead or quit the business. However, armies have a return to scale that education just does not have. It is better to have mediocre soldiers and billion dollar weapons than a bunch of small and highly effective mercenary armies. This statement alone proves that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, about anything, and that all rational people should just ignore your wastage of electrons. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/52 "2014-02-19T20:20:39Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > I’m not saying teachers are overpaid. But I don’t think you can just compare salary and education level. Agreed. My point isn’t to say they’re paid terribly; rather, I was just refuting the refutation of the idea that they’re underpaid :). Basically, if puddleglum’s stats were to be relevant, they’d need to be an apples-to-apples comparison. Since they’re not, they’re not relevant. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2014, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/53 "2014-02-19T20:21:49Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > I have no doubt on a per soldier basis mercenaries are much more effective than regular armies > [@silenus](#): > > This statement alone proves that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, about anything, and that all rational people should just ignore your wastage of electrons. Also I wonder if puddleglum notices my crazy rhetorical judo that just got him to alienate patriots everywhere :). ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2014, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/54 "2014-02-20T03:26:58Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Same here for the teachers’ unions. They want More. OK, when was that ever not the case? It wasn’t the case five tears ago. Read the OP. The teachers made concessions because there was a recession - with the understanding that they would get a better contract when the recession ended. Now the recession has ended and they want the better contract. If the district is unwilling to honor the agreement, then it’s the district that’s in the wrong. ---
**Author:** ![crucible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@crucible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crucible)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2014, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/55 "2014-02-20T03:47:47Z")
I disagree about the hours. I’ve never known a teacher of any core subject who spent less than 12 hours a day on the job, and the ‘summer’ break is often a myth. When the public can say to their employees, “you can’t strike”, then the way it usually goes is for, over time, the public to demand more and more for less and less so as to keep taxes lower. Teachers take the blame for the result (unmotivated and unable to learn kids) of society and parental misbehavior. All jobs are hard to get these days. Finding one with decent, middle class, pay in balance with the education required to get that skill set is becoming harder and harder. Public employees are, too often, hard working people who are scapegoats for all the slings and arrows suffered by everyone today. ---
**Author:** ![crucible](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@crucible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crucible)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2014, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/56 "2014-02-20T03:56:16Z")
The annals of the Buffalo, NY school system over the last 25 years reveal every mistake possible to make, including giving teachers long term benefits in exchange for no short term ones…and, of course, in due time, the piper had to be paid. How do you handle a huge budget shortfall? Lay off teachers. Not administrators, heaven forfend, teachers. In general, teachers are smarter than school board people. School boards, already overpaid, generally hire consultants to tell them what to think. They implement something, then an election swings control around, and the old is abandoned, something new started…ad infinitum NC now wants, after refusing raises to teachers for a few years (already poorly paid by national standards) to give a nice raise to new teachers, in exchange for all teachers giving up tenure… yes, teachers have been and will continue to be, quitting, moving to Virginia, etc. Taking other work where they can go home after 8 hours and put their feet up. Many just take the training and tests to get into administration, where there is a lot more money and a lot fewer hours and pressure to actually pound information into kid’s unwilling skulls. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2014, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/57 "2014-02-20T16:15:38Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > It wasn’t the case five tears ago. Read the OP. The teachers made concessions because there was a recession - with the understanding that they would get a better contract when the recession ended. > > Now the recession has ended and they want the better contract. If the district is unwilling to honor the agreement, then it’s the district that’s in the wrong. It’s the teachers’ union who are claiming this understanding. I am not willing to take their word that the district made the commitment. Nonetheless, my point remains. The union wants money that the district is apparently unable to give. As I said, things are tough. Teachers are not exempt from this. Sorry, but there it is. [QUOTE=crucible] I disagree about the hours. I’ve never known a teacher of any core subject who spent less than 12 hours a day on the job, and the ‘summer’ break is often a myth. [/QUOTE] Unless I see a cite, I will consider the 12 hour a day average to be a wild exaggeration. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2014, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/58 "2014-02-20T16:30:12Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Unless I see a cite, I will consider the 12 hour a day average to be a wild exaggeration. My first year of teaching, a 12-hour day was par for the course. Today, it’s more of a 9-10 hour day, with a couple hours on the weekend. Certainly there are teachers who put in 12 hours days, but I consider that to be unhealthy. ---
**Author:** ![lance\_strongarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@lance\_strongarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lance_strongarm)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2014, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/59 "2014-02-20T16:34:36Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > It’s the teachers’ union who are claiming this understanding. I am not willing to take their word that the district made the commitment. Such a commitment wasn’t even necessary. It’s implicit. If you give up something during bad times, you ought to get it back when the crisis is over. That’s just the way it is. > [@](#): > > Nonetheless, my point remains. The union wants money that the district is apparently unable to give. As I said, things are tough. Teachers are not exempt from this. Sorry, but there it is. Times aren’t that tough any more. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2014, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640/60 "2014-02-20T17:14:14Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > My first year of teaching, a 12-hour day was par for the course. Today, it’s more of a 9-10 hour day, with a couple hours on the weekend. As I am sure you will agree, that is not a cite, and does not reinforce what **crucible** claimed. [QUOTE=lance strongarm] If you give up something during bad times, you ought to get it back when the crisis is over. That’s just the way it is. [/QUOTE] That is not how taxes, unemployment insurance, or contract negotiations, work. > [@](#): > > Times aren’t that tough any more. They are for the district. > [@](#): > > “The benefits costs have just exploded. Our benefit cost has gone from 20 to 32 million dollars just in the last 10 years.” I also noticed something interesting but unsurprising - the union boss was apparently misrepresenting the offer from the school district. > [@](#): > > Lashley says the district’s statement that it’s offering teachers a 10 percent pay raise over the contract period is misleading, because most of that increase would be eaten up by higher teacher contributions to their pension fund. > > The union’s bottom line, she says, is that they’re not willing to accept a contract in which teachers’ pay will decline in real terms … Notice the not-terribly-subtle misstatement - “ **most** of the increase” goes to the pension contributions changes to a decline in pay. If it were really going to be a decline in pay, **all** of the increase, plus more, would have to go to pension contributions. Regards, Shodan [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-be-done-in-the-medford-school-district-teachers-union-dispute/681640.md?page=4)