# What should the USA do in Iraq? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 17, 2014, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971 "2014-06-17T07:00:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2014, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/61 "2014-06-20T15:14:59Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Iraq Violence: Government Forces Prepare To Strike Back At Sunni Islamists After Obama Offers Military Advisers > Isra’ al-Rubei’iReuters06/20/14 04:24 AM ET > > [Iraq Violence: Government Forces Prepare To Strike Back At Sunni Islamists After Obama Offers Military Advisers | HuffPost The World Post](http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/5514054/) > Will US public lose interest and then press as Iraqi government troops and Shiite Milita’s launch a counter-offense and begin to drive the terrorists back to Syria? Of course. People pay more attention to problems than to solutions. Now, if our military advisors get killed, the counter-offensive fails, or the Shiite militias turn on Sunni civilians, expect to see plenty of interest. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/62 "2014-06-21T02:12:36Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Will US public lose interest and then press as Iraqi government troops and Shiite Milita’s launch a counter-offense and begin to drive the terrorists back to Syria? I think the public will then press. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/63 "2014-06-21T02:47:21Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Cheney, who controlled Bush, stood to make money from oil and Halliburton. I also thought the Bush and Cheney were two peas in a pod (had virtually identical beliefs). ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/64 "2014-06-21T10:32:25Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I think the public will then press. How about you? What if this attack unites Sunni and Shia and a more inclusive government in Baghdad emerges from all this and the government succeeds in driving out the foreign invaders and preventing Iraq from becoming part of their caliphate dream, do your predictions of Iraq collapsing into chaos go back into some secret hidden vault waiting for Heraldo to come open it up someday to see what’s inside? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/65 "2014-06-21T10:49:49Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Of course. People pay more attention to problems than to solutions. > > Now, if our military advisors get killed, the counter-offensive fails, or the Shiite militias turn on Sunni civilians, expect to see plenty of interest. The public’s primary interest more so in bad News than in good news could be seen as a ‘problem’ couldn’t it? So why aren’t they paying attention to that problem? ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/66 "2014-06-21T13:05:58Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > The public’s primary interest more so in bad News than in good news could be seen as a ‘problem’ couldn’t it? So why aren’t they paying attention to that problem? If it’s a problem, it’s one [with a biological basis](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negativity_bias). So what can we do? It’s part of being human. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/67 "2014-06-21T13:31:14Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > How about you? > > What if this attack unites Sunni and Shia and a more inclusive government in Baghdad emerges from all this and the government succeeds in driving out the foreign invaders and preventing Iraq from becoming part of their caliphate dream, do your predictions of Iraq collapsing into chaos go back into some secret hidden vault waiting for Heraldo to come open it up someday to see what’s inside? What if monkeys fly out of al Maliki’s ass? Would Geraldo report that?? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/68 "2014-06-21T15:48:20Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > What if monkeys fly out of al Maliki’s ass? Would Geraldo report that?? You tell me. You are the one who boasted of your ability to predict things three years out and are taking credit for predicting a civil war in Iraq even before a major civil war has actually broken out. If a civil war is averted by Iraq’s sectarian leaders to defeat a common terrorist threat to their existence, are you going to admit your prediction was wrong? Or will you just say it could happen by the year 3014 for sure when Uranus is aligned with Mars under a blue moon. Do you have a prediction for us that the battle for the Baijii Refinery will be won by the terrorists or the Iraqi Army, My view is that the invading terrorists had an element of surprising going for them in the initial invasion, but they have no surprised left and appears their advances have been halted. Fear of civil war will gradually subside as the terrorists for the second time will be driven out of Sunni populated regions of Iraq. This is not civil war yet - and my frame if reference is the civil war that was ignited in 2006 when the Golden Mosque in Samara was bombed by Sunni insurgents. It appears Maliki and Kurd and Sunni leaders are trying to avoid a repeat of the violence that occurred under US occupation; > [@](#): > > Late Tuesday, the prime minister appeared on television with Sunni and Kurdish leaders. They issued a joint statement about the need to close ranks and stick to “national priorities” in the face of the threat posed by the militants. > **[Latest News & Current Event Updates | Yahoo News Singapore](https://sg.news.yahoo.com/)** > > Discover the latest news and headlines on breaking news stories and in-depth coverage with photos and videos from trending hot topics to viral news. See excerpts from a report about the Mosque bombing: > [@](#): > > The United States condemns the bombing February 22 of the Golden Mosque in Samarra, Iraq, one of the holiest places for Shi’a Muslims, as a blatant attempt to foment sectarian strife, and promises to contribute to its reconstruction, according to statements from the White House and the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad. > > U.S. Ambassador to Iraq Zalmay Khalilzad and General George Casey, the commander of the coalition troops in Iraq, said, "Given the historic, cultural, and religious importance of this shrine, this attack is a crime against humanity. The Shrine should be rebuilt and the United States will contribute to its reconstruction.” > > The bombing of the mosque comes at a time of delicate negotiations among Iraq’s Shia, Sunni and Kurdish political groups to form a government of national unity. > THE WHITE HOUSE. Office of the Press Secretary. February 22, 2006. STATEMENT BY THE PRESIDENT > > On behalf of the American people, I extend my deepest condolences to the people of Iraq for the brutal bombing of the Golden Mosque in Samarra, one of the holiest sites in Shi’a Islam. > > Embassy of the United States of America. - Baghdad, Iraq > > February 22, 2006. NEWS RELEASE. Joint Statement by Ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad and General George Casey Denouncing Terrorist Destruction of the Golden Mosque > > We denounce in the strongest terms the terrorist destruction of the Golden Mosque – the Shrine of the Askareyen Imams. This heinous crime is a deliberate attempt to foment sectarian strife in Iraq and the region. Given the historic, cultural, and religious importance of this shrine, this attack is a crime against humanity. The Shrine should be rebuilt and the United States will contribute to its reconstruction. > > The Iraqi people, in this hour of sadness and anger over a despicable crime, must not allow themselves to be divided. Those who commit acts of sectarian violence in the wake of this tragic event are only serving the interests of the terrorists. The terrorists led by Zarqawi wish to see Iraq descend into sectarian conflict. > > This is a critical moment for Iraq. We call on all Iraqis to unite against terror and violence. Coming together in unity to condemn this barbaric act and working for Iraq’s salvation will be the right response. > > This desperate and despicable act shows that terrorists stop at nothing and care for nothing. The United States and our Coalition partners share in the outrage of the Iraqi people against this crime. We stand with the Iraqi people in their courageous efforts to eliminate the criminal and terrorist elements in their country and to build a government of national unity. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/69 "2014-06-21T16:35:30Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > It appears Maliki and Kurd and Sunni leaders are trying to avoid a repeat of the violence that occurred under US occupation; You accidentally forget to quote the next paragraph. Here, let me help you: > [@](#): > > Still, al-Maliki’s outreach remain largely rhetoric, with no concrete action to bridge differences with Sunnis and Kurds, who have been at loggerheads with the prime minister over their right to independently export oil and over territorial claims. This is the 2nd Iraq Civil War, regardless of any arbitrary comparison you might might. You’ve got a rebel force in control of at least 1/5 of the country, and you’ve got the Kurds seizing territory and forming their own army as the Iraqi national army fled in disgrace. It’s an extension of the Civil War in Syria that has been going on for at least 3 years. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/70 "2014-06-21T17:44:05Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > This is the 2nd Iraq Civil War, regardless of any arbitrary comparison you might might. There is potential for a bloody civil war to erupt to the level of sectarian violence that occurred in 2006, but it has not reached that level at the moment. Whike we wait, what is the date of the start of Iraq Civil War II? Is Mosul the Capitol city of the rebellion? Did the people Mosul launch a rebellion or were they invaded by an outside force? > [@](#): > > An estimated 500,000 people fled Iraq’s second-largest city, Mosul, last week after it fell to fighters from the Islamic State in Syria and Iraq (ISIS). On Friday, the International Committee of the Red Cross in Iraq put the number who fled Mosul, with its population of 1.6 million, at about 800,000. > **[More than 1 million Iraqis have fled their homes as ISIS continues armed siege...](https://www.cnn.com/2014/06/20/world/meast/iraq-crisis/index.html?c=&page=1)** > > More than 1 million Iraqis have been forced from their homes by conflict this year, the U.N. refugee agency said Friday. A lot of people fled to the Shiite led government for protection. Instead of the percentage of area/land controlled by the terrorist invaders from Syria, the better measure would be percent of population that is ‘willingly’ under this sadistic and murderous ISIS control by threat of force and how many will join the ranks of its fighters. I don’t see ISIS controlling or having sympathy from enough of the population to label this anything close to the civil war and sectarian conflict that took place in the presence of tens of thousands of US troops on the ground in 2006. Iraq was considered stable in 2012 and it is also true that 2011 was between Civil War I and Civil War II. None of your arguments defend your subjective premise that Obama either lied or was ignorant of reality to portray Iraq as stable when speaking to the troops at Ft Bragg. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/71 "2014-06-21T18:22:44Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > You accidentally forget to quote the next paragraph. Here, let me help you: > > > [@](#): > > > > Still, al-Maliki’s outreach remain largely rhetoric, with no concrete action to bridge differences with Sunnis and Kurds, who have been at loggerheads with the prime minister over their right to independently export oil and over territorial claims. What could be your point with that? Do you have anything in mind for the US government to do something militarily to intervene in anyway to paraphrase it: (…“to bridge differences … over rights … to independently export oil and over territorial claims.”) between Sunnis and Kurds and Shiite? We would not bomb Kurds or Simnis if they sought autonomy from Iraq. The question is wouid we recognized doing what Biden thought should be considered done a long time ago. Partition. The current issue being examined here is an organized militaristic terrorist attack on sovereign Iraq and what should be done about it. Trumping up charges of lying or cluelessness by the President is not where one should take the discussion. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/72 "2014-06-21T18:38:18Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > What could be your point with that? Noting that your snipped quote was meaningless. > [@](#): > > Do you have anything in mind for the US government to do something militarily to intervene in anyway to paraphrase it: (…“to bridge differences … over rights … to independently export oil and over territorial claims.”) between Sunnis and Kurds and Shiite? I’ve already posted in this thread what I thought the US should do. > [@](#): > > The current issue being examined here is an organized militaristic terrorist attack on sovereign Iraq and what should be done about it. I don’t know what a “militaristic terrorist attack” is, but if you’re implying this is simple terrorism, you’re wrong. This is an organized military assault against the sovereign territory of Iraq, with some terrorism thrown in for good measure. And, as noted above, I’ve already posted what I thought the US should do. > [@](#): > > Trumping up charges of lying or cluelessness by the President is not where one should take the discussion. And where, exactly, have I done that in this thread? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/73 "2014-06-21T18:53:06Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > . You’ve got a rebel force in control of at least 1/5 of the country, and you’ve got the Kurds seizing territory and forming their own army as the Iraqi national army fled in disgrace. How much of the population and infrastructure do they really control? The terrorists are outnumbered a thousand to one just to the Peshmerga. And how don’t you know that the Kurds formed an army of its own ages ago and had long long long been active and operational. > [@](#): > > It was estimated that in 2005 there were 180,000 Peshmerga fighters in Iraqi Kurdistan, the article estimating their number to be 270,000 in total. > **[Peshmerga](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peshmerga)** > > The Peshmerga (Kurdish: پێشمەرگه, romanized: Pêşmerge, lit. ''Those Who Face Death'') are the armed forces of Iraqi Kurdistan, an autonomous region in northern Iraq. According to the Constitution of Iraq, regional governments are responsible for "the establishment and organization of the internal security forces for the region such as police, security forces, and guards of the region". Other Kurdish defence and security agencies include the Zêrevanî (gendarmerie), Asayish (security and co Form... > [@](#): > > The Peshmerga were an active partner in the American-led coalition in Iraq. Many Peshmerga are fluent in Arabic, in contrast to foreign coalition troops, and they therefore played an important role in the Sunni triangle of Central Iraq. On the strategic level the Peshmergas are ready to fight a guerrilla war of any invasion of Iraqi Kurdistan. You have concerns about Kurds seizing territory. We had darn near the same thing happen in 2004: > [@](#): > > In late 2004, when Arab Iraqi Police and ING (Iraqi National Guard) units in the city of Mosul collapsed in the face of an insurgent uprising, Kurdish Peshmerga battalions, who had recently been converted into ING forces, led the counter-attack alongside US military units. Kurds “forming their own army” … Where did that one come from? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/74 "2014-06-21T19:07:21Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > How much of the population and infrastructure do they really control? The terrorists are outnumbered a thousand to one just to the Peshmerga. Oh, the Kurds are going to be OK. I’ve already said that in at least one of these Iraq threads (can’t remember which ones). In fact, the news stories are now noting that: > [@](#): > > [Kurds Emerge as Winners in Iraq Chaos](http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/kurds-emerge-winners-iraq-chaos-24214832) > > The Kurds’ territorial grab is substantial. The recognized Kurdish autonomous region — defined as three northern provinces — effectively expanded by 40 percent, estimated Gareth Stansfield, an expert on Kurdish affairs. Are you still trumpeting this “terrorists” line? Sounds like something Bush would say. This is a Sunni insurgency allied with ISIS against the Shiite dominated Iraqi government. If you search these thread, you’ll find I linked to a NYT article about this several days ago. It would do you good to read it. And the Kurds are (mostly) loving it. They don’t want to be part of Iraq anyway. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/75 "2014-06-21T19:18:09Z")
@NFBW: Not disagreeing with you but I think despite their help in stabilizing the country during the American occupation, the existence of the Peshmerga was always going to be a major issue as far as a unified Iraq goes. And they have seized a lot of new territory. Not just Kirkuk, but pushing the border all over the place. Some estimates are they’ve increased Kurdistan’s area by 25% (eta: ok, maybe I misremembered, 40%?). I am wondering how much their refugee influx is going to be handled longer term. That’s a lot of non-Kurds they are suddenly housing. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/76 "2014-06-21T19:29:59Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > …and you’ve got the Kurds seizing territory and forming their own army as the Iraqi national army fled in disgrace. Perhaps Forbes can help you grasp the geopolitical dynamics that revolve around the Kurds and Peshmerga’s role in the current crisis and challenges to the Maliki government. Christopher Helman, Forbes Staff I’m based in Houston, Texas. Energy capital of the world. 6/12/2014 @ 5:51PM How Iraq’s Kurds May Be The Unlikely Losers In The ISIS Chaos > [@](#): > > Then on Tuesday came the ISIS attack on the northern city of Mosul. It’s not out of the realm of possibility, suggests my source, that Iraq’s federal security forces were encouraged by Baghdad to run away rather than fight ISIS. Why? Because in leaving such a security vacuum it has forced the Kurds to stretch their own security forces thin by occupying Kirkuk and standing on guard against ISIS. This necessarily weakens the Kurds’ security stance along their borders with Turkey, Syria and Iran. > **[How Iraq's Kurds May Be The Unlikely Losers In The ISIS Chaos](https://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherhelman/2014/06/12/how-iraqs-kurds-may-be-the-unlikely-losers-in-the-isis-chaos/)** > > In recent days the Iraqi Kurds have been attacked by car bombs, have failed in their attempt to unilaterally sell their oil abroad, and have been forced by the ISIS offensive to stretch their security forces thin and occupy Kirkuk. More from Forbes: > [@](#): > > The melting away of Maliki’s army has effectively taught the Kurds a lesson: that although they may be capable of protecting their own territory, they need to support and encourage a strong federal government in Baghdad that can unify the nation and stand up an army that can beat back ISIS. > > Let’s assume civil war is averted, ISIS pushed back and Baghdad’s soldiers reassembled into a more reliable force. The Kurdish occupation of Kirkuk, in the name of guarding against ISIS, then will become a political bargaining chip. There’s been talk from Kurdish politicians that they should seize this opportunity to bring the oil-rich city under permanent Kurdish control. More likely, the Kurds will hold Kirkuk until this crisis has passed, then cede it back to federal forces, hopefully in return for promises of a final resolution of the all-important oil issue. This analysis tell me that the some in energy sector are not seeing necessarily a major civil war breaking out in Iraq as you do. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/77 "2014-06-21T19:33:13Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > @NFBW: Not disagreeing with you but I think despite their help in stabilizing the country during the American occupation, the existence of the Peshmerga was always going to be a major issue as far as a unified Iraq goes. And they have seized a lot of new territory. Not just Kirkuk, but pushing the border all over the place. Some estimates are they’ve increased Kurdistan’s area by 25% (eta: ok, maybe I misremembered, 40%?). > > I am wondering how much their refugee influx is going to be handled longer term. That’s a lot of non-Kurds they are suddenly housing. As noted in that article, the Kurds may use that as justification to sell even more oil on the market independent of the central government. No doubt these borders of controlled areas are going to shift as this civil war plays out. ISIS and their Sunni allies swept easily across the non-Shiite Arab areas, but I can’t see them taking over significant areas in the south with majority Shiite population. De facto partition seems like the most likely outcome. Assad has been pretty masterful at stopping the insurgents in Syria from gaining ground, and I imagine that if he finally wins against them, they’ll flood into Iraq making things even more difficult for the Shiite dominated government there. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/78 "2014-06-21T19:39:02Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Perhaps Forbes can help you grasp the geopolitical dynamics that revolve around the Kurds and Peshmerga’s role in the current crisis and challenges to the Maliki government. > > Christopher Helman, Forbes Staff I’m based in Houston, Texas. Energy capital of the world. 6/12/2014 @ 5:51PM > How Iraq’s Kurds May Be The Unlikely Losers In The ISIS Chaos > > [How Iraq's Kurds May Be The Unlikely Losers In The ISIS Chaos](http://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherhelman/2014/06/12/how-iraqs-kurds-may-be-the-unlikely-losers-in-the-isis-chaos/) > > More from Forbes: > > This analysis tell me that the some in energy sector are not seeing necessarily a major civil war breaking out in Iraq as you do. Dude, you are fucking hilarious. Once again you went fishing for cites to support your argument, and just grabbed the first one you could latch onto without actually understanding it. If you read this exact same guy just a few days ago, you’d know he has repudiated that article.: [Iraqi Kurdistan Set To Become An Independent World Oil Power](http://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherhelman/2014/06/16/iraqi-kurdistan-set-to-become-an-independent-world-oil-power/) > [@](#): > > Last Thursday, after ISIS forces captured Mosul and Kurdish fighters had moved into Kirkuk, I wrote a piece about how the Kurdish Regional Government might end up being the “unlikely losers” in the ensuing chaos. Its peshmerga forces were in danger of being stretched thin. Its two renegade tankers full of oil had no buyers. Surely, it seemed last Thursday, that President Obama would never dream of allowing Baghdad (and especially the Green Zone) to come under ISIS attack. Wouldn’t the U.S. prop up Maliki and ensure the survival of Iraqi federalism? > > No. That article was wrong. As numerous readers were all too happy to point out. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/79 "2014-06-21T20:04:58Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally Posted by NotfooledbyW How much of the population and infrastructure do they really control? The terrorists are outnumbered a thousand to one just to the Peshmerga. > > > [@John\_Mace](#): > > > > Oh, the Kurds are going to be OK. . I was talking about how much of the population and infrastructure the terrorists really control? The terrorists are outnumbered a thousand to one just against the Peshmerga. When Iraqi Security Forces are added in - things don’t look good for ISIS for holding territory seized for a long period of time. Your opinion that Kurdish actions thus far are part of your conclusion that Iraq Civil War II had begun is quite baseless. They are fighting to defend Iraq from a terrorist threat and would not be doing so if it were not for the threat to all of Iraq’s existence. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2014, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971/80 "2014-06-21T20:05:17Z")
That first article was clearly informed by sources dreaming of their perfect outcome. “haha, maybe the Maliki government tricked the Kurds into taking a massive prize to stretch their forces!”. Never mind that the Kurds have been handily repelling ISIS attacks already. It also mentions that the Kurds might have to lower security on the Turkish border, like that’s a real concern. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-should-the-usa-do-in-iraq/690971.md?page=5)