# What the fuck is wrong with Huey Freeman? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 8, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427 "2019-01-08T20:43:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![WernhamHogg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a587f6/32.png) [@WernhamHogg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WernhamHogg)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/361 "2019-01-20T12:21:54Z")
The Mismeasure of Man by Stephen Jay Gould covers and rebuts the premises of scientific racism; I highly recommend it. ---
**Author:** ![WernhamHogg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a587f6/32.png) [@WernhamHogg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WernhamHogg)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/362 "2019-01-20T12:27:54Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Yeah if you redefine words to suit a particular ideology of course the redefined word will not apply to those that are needed to help advance that ideology. Friendly fire when weaponized language is employed is very inconvenient. To me the argument over what the word itself is pointless. It is crucual to understand that racial prejudice against people in power that stems from a history of oppression is completely different than racial prejudice that comes from a position of power against people you have oppressed. Before we continue, can you confirm that you understand this? Without hastening to qualify it or compromise it in any way? ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/363 "2019-01-20T13:11:25Z")
For the record, I called him a black supremacist because, when people pointed out there is black autism, he blamed that on mixing with white people. That sure sounds like he thinks black people are the superior race and shouldn’t mix with the others. And **pool** , please don’t post shit that could be used to support scientific racism unless you have your cite and are 100% sure of its veracity. A quick Googling showed nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/364 "2019-01-20T13:30:31Z")
There are studies showing traumatic childhoods (and even traumas experienced by the mother while in utero) do indeed impact cognitive development due to heightened levels of cortisol over long periods of time. This isn’t specific to black kids, but to all at-risk kids. It does disproportionately affect black kids, though, who overall are more likely to be at risk. Note that this is not “mental retardation,” as pool mentions. The effects of overexposure to cortisol are wildly variable. They’re also hereditary - studies have found that the children of Holocaust survivors had weird cortisol markers. That means that a comfortably middle-class black kid is **still** more likely to suffer from certain problems if his parents had shitty childhoods but managed to pull themselves out of it. It also means that experiencing racism (and the associated stress) can directly impact your mental health. Of course, the solution here is the same as the solution always is: more effective interventions and support structures for at-risk children, more effort spent reducing socioeconomic disparity, and more effort spent shitkicking racist fuckers no matter what color their skin happens to be, because ‘prejudice plus power’ is a stupid, inherently racist ideology with little purpose except to excuse heinous bigotry. ---
**Author:** ![WernhamHogg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a587f6/32.png) [@WernhamHogg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WernhamHogg)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/365 "2019-01-20T13:50:00Z")
I don’t want to be seen defending pool’s claim, but [here is a reference to it](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK332877/). > [@](#): > > In the United States, the prevalence of ID varies by race/ethnicity, probably due to confounding by socioeconomic status (SES). Black non-Hispanic children are approximately twice as likely, and Hispanic children approximately one and a half times as likely, to be diagnosed with ID as white non-Hispanic children (Bhasin et al., 2006; Boyle and Lary, 1996; Boyle et al., 2011; Camp et al., 1998; Van Naarden Braun et al., 2015). **Language differences and poverty likely contribute to the racial and ethnic differences in performance on cognitive tests and to the corresponding disparities in prevalence. Even after taking the effects of SES into account, there is evidence that test bias and diagnostic bias affects the rates of the diagnosis of ID** (Jencks and Phillips, 1998). Environmental factors play a huge role in intellectual development. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/366 "2019-01-20T14:07:39Z")
> [@WernhamHogg](#): > > I don’t want to be seen defending pool’s claim, but [here is a reference to it](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK332877/). > > Environmental factors play a huge role in intellectual development. His claim was that the deficiencies existed **even after those issues are controlled**. ] Your cite actually contradicts his claim. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/367 "2019-01-20T14:18:43Z")
> [@WernhamHogg](#): > > To me the argument over what the word itself is pointless. It is crucual to understand that racial prejudice against people in power that stems from a history of oppression is completely different than racial prejudice that comes from a position of power against people you have oppressed. Before we continue, can you confirm that you understand this? Without hastening to qualify it or compromise it in any way? I totally recognize the difference, but I don’t agree that we can ignore the attempts to change the word itself. Yes, the latter is worse than the former, but the former still is not a good thing. And the attempt to say it isn’t racism is an attempt to make it not seem as bad. Racism has the meaning “prejudice towards or discrimination against anyone for their race.” It achieved its negative connotation because of this definition. And so a lot of people try to redefine it so it doesn’t include them. And I think anything that makes “racism without power” remotely more acceptable only helps make “racism with power” acceptable. It allows arguments that the whole thing manipulation. I get the concepts, but I do think it’s important we don’t let the word be changed. Because, while they are rare, I have met people who genuinely are racist against white people, and that’s still wrong. If you are racist against white people, then racist white people will argue they can be racist towards you, and no amount of “but racism without power isn’t really racism” will change that. The war is with words. Redefining words is one of the goto tactics of the racist right to get their ideology through. I know liberals who crow about PC SJWs who virtue signal. Words are important. ---
**Author:** ![WernhamHogg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a587f6/32.png) [@WernhamHogg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WernhamHogg)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/368 "2019-01-20T14:19:26Z")
Likely he found it [here](https://menghublog.wordpress.com/2012/12/02/race-and-iq-mental-retardation/), since the language he uses closely matches that of the blogger. Note that the article’s first link is to a scientific study that works with a very small population and doesn’t come to the conclusions the blogger pretends. ---
**Author:** ![WernhamHogg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a587f6/32.png) [@WernhamHogg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WernhamHogg)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/369 "2019-01-20T14:26:09Z")
As I said, arguing about the word is a distraction. It’s about whether you understand and accept historical inequities that make it a different thing for one group vs. another. And yes, of course ALL THINGISM IS BAD! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/370 "2019-01-20T15:25:48Z")
From “What the fuck is wrong with Huey Freeman” to Stormfront. Congrats, white people. Huey probably somehow knew it would end up like this. Now, for the educated among us, here’s what you need to take with you from this thread: people who subscribe to Stormfront’s vision of America can become CEO’s of companies. They can become landlords. They can become neighborhood watch vigilantes. They can become bank loan officers. They can become mayors, governors, sheriffs, congressmen, Senators, and even President. The Huey Freemans of the world? Not so much. Think about that. Racism, real racism, is more about actual power and the ability to abuse others than it is about a fantasy to do so. ---
**Author:** ![WernhamHogg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a587f6/32.png) [@WernhamHogg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WernhamHogg)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/371 "2019-01-20T15:45:32Z")
How do you know Huey is none of those things? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/372 "2019-01-20T16:49:09Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I totally recognize the difference, but I don’t agree that we can ignore the attempts to change the word itself. Yes, the latter is worse than the former, but the former still is not a good thing. And the attempt to say it isn’t racism is an attempt to make it not seem as bad. > > Racism has the meaning “prejudice towards or discrimination against anyone for their race.” It achieved its negative connotation because of this definition. And so a lot of people try to redefine it so it doesn’t include them. > > And I think anything that makes “racism without power” remotely more acceptable only helps make “racism with power” acceptable. It allows arguments that the whole thing manipulation. > > I get the concepts, but I do think it’s important we don’t let the word be changed. Because, while they are rare, I have met people who genuinely are racist against white people, and that’s still wrong. If you are racist against white people, then racist white people will argue they can be racist towards you, and no amount of “but racism without power isn’t really racism” will change that. > > The war is with words. Redefining words is one of the goto tactics of the racist right to get their ideology through. I know liberals who crow about PC SJWs who virtue signal. > > Words are important. Besides, power comes and goes, and certain worldviews your group develops when they have no power aren’t that easy to get rid of once that changes. Take it from me. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/373 "2019-01-20T17:27:19Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > WTF is wrong with him is that a blatant troll is growing fat on an audience eager to feed him and a crop of moderators afraid to ban him because they think it might make them look racist. Well, why not drop the ban hammer and just say “Yeah I did it”. What’s he gonna do? If all the other trolls come trolling about freedumb furst mendmint then they can go too. It would be fun to watch. ---
**Author:** ![coffeecat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coffeecat/32/3405_2.png) [@coffeecat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coffeecat)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/374 "2019-01-20T17:32:44Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > From “What the fuck is wrong with Huey Freeman” to Stormfront. > > Congrats, white people. Huey probably somehow knew it would end up like this. > > Now, for the educated among us, here’s what you need to take with you from this thread: people who subscribe to Stormfront’s vision of America can become CEO’s of companies. They can become landlords. They can become neighborhood watch vigilantes. They can become bank loan officers. They can become mayors, governors, sheriffs, congressmen, Senators, and even President. The Huey Freemans of the world? Not so much. > > Think about that. Racism, real racism, is more about actual power and the ability to abuse others than it is about a fantasy to do so. **Huey Freeman** is a black dumbass. The world is full of black dumbasses, white dumbasses, dumbasses of every race, religion, color, sex, national origin, age, state of physical or mental health, sexual preference, gender identity, marital status, citizenship status, hair color, eye color, sock color, and styling of pubic hair. That’s called equality. I will probably continue to have little power. I will continue to define racism as prejudice against those of a certain race, continue to treat people like people, continue to think Louis Farrakhan is an enormous dildo and Harriet Tubman was a superhuman badass. The worst thing a hater can do isn’t to hate us, but to implant hatred for them in our heart. There was a storm here last night, and the dark trees are standing amidst the white snow. I am drinking black coffee out of a white cup, because I’m out of milk. Evil continues to be stupid, ugly, and boring, and the world is still the same. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/375 "2019-01-20T18:44:00Z")
If this sidebar on scientific racism continues, I’ll join **iiandyiiii** and leave the discussion. We’ve had that conversation many times and the topic is as racist and wrong as it always is. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2019, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/376 "2019-01-20T18:48:35Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > If this sidebar on scientific racism continues, I’ll join **iiandyiiii** and leave the discussion. We’ve had that conversation many times and the topic is as racist and wrong as it always is. I believe we already have a thread open for that, anyways. (Didn’t **SlackerInc** open up another one for his bullshit?) ---
**Author:** ![Huey\_Freeman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/huey_freeman/32/251_2.png) [@Huey\_Freeman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huey_Freeman)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/377 "2019-01-21T02:55:37Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Gee. I’m betting to the multitudinous women raped tortured and humiliated by the likes of R Kelly, Bill Cosby, Chris Brown and any number of wanna be pumps I’m guessing white supremacy might come up as number 2 on the worst things in their lives. Unless you have some evidence to link this to white supremacy. Hip hop culture has devalued and debased women for decades. White supremacy? Absolutely. If you watched\* Surviving R Kelly,\* one of the _white jurors flat-out said that he didn’t believe the victims because of what they looked like. When the black families sought law enforcement to help get their daughters from R. Kelly, the white cops told them there was “nothing we can do”. The R. Kelly case where he was acquitted: the judge was white, the prosecutors were white, and the majority of the jurors were white. Chris Brown? The judge was white_ and the prosecutor was _white_. Bill Cosby? The judge was \*white \*and the jurors were comprised of 10 \*white \*jurors (_7 or which were white men_). White fingerprints are all over this shit. I mean, are you so stupid that you think these cases were brought in front of black judge, black jurors, and a black prosecutor? Either you are naive (unlikely) or fucking stupid (most likely). By the way, you’re talking devaluing and debasing women? How do you square that with how you treat your imported handbag? I’d really, really like to know. It’s pathetic how you white folk will marry or adopt a person of color, allow them to be discriminated against, and hand-wave it away as benign. It’s not benign, and, if you doubt this, tell your handbag how you dismissed the discrimination she suffered. How do you think your imported handbag would feel? Go on, show her that post. You know which one. Let me tell you something about your handbag. Your handbag is courageous because she is still with you despite suffering discrimination _because of you_. Despite her sacrifice, you feel nothing because you’re an empty, soulless husk. She is too good for you, and, I hope she gets her citizenship and leaves your racist ass for someone who will cherish her poise and appreciated sacrifice(s) she has endured to come to this country _for you_. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/378 "2019-01-21T03:38:37Z")
> [@Huey\_Freeman](#): > > Absolutely. If you watched\* Surviving R Kelly,\* one of the _white jurors flat-out said that he didn’t believe the victims because of what they looked like. When the black families sought law enforcement to help get their daughters from R. Kelly, the white cops told them there was “nothing we can do”. The R. Kelly case where he was acquitted: the judge was white, the prosecutors were white, and the majority of the jurors were white. Chris Brown? The judge was white_ and the prosecutor was _white_. Bill Cosby? The judge was \*white \*and the jurors were comprised of 10 \*white \*jurors (_7 or which were white men_). White fingerprints are all over this shit. I mean, are you so stupid that you think these cases were brought in front of black judge, black jurors, and a black prosecutor? Either you are naive (unlikely) or fucking stupid (most likely). By the way, you’re talking devaluing and debasing women? How do you square that with how you treat your imported handbag? I’d really, really like to know. It’s pathetic how you white folk will marry or adopt a person of color, allow them to be discriminated against, and hand-wave it away as benign. It’s not benign, and, if you doubt this, tell your handbag how you dismissed the discrimination she suffered. How do you think your imported handbag would feel? Go on, show her that post. You know which one. Let me tell you something about your handbag. Your handbag is courageous because she is still with you despite suffering discrimination _because of you_. Despite her sacrifice, you feel nothing because you’re an empty, soulless husk. She is too good for you, and, I hope she gets her citizenship and leaves your racist ass for someone who will cherish her poise and appreciated sacrifice(s) she has endured to come to this country _for you_. So a so-called group shares all traits and responsibilities for each member?:dubious: I’m actually surprised you are getting any pushback on this site aside from you being a bit too inconveniently obvious. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/379 "2019-01-21T04:15:36Z")
> [@Huey\_Freeman](#): > > It’s not benign, and, if you doubt this, tell your handbag how you dismissed the discrimination she suffered. How do you think your imported handbag would feel? Go on, show her that post. You know which one. Let me tell you something about your handbag. Your handbag is courageous because she is still with you despite suffering discrimination _because of you_. **madsircool** isn’t the sexist buttmunch calling her a “handbag”. Do you always refer to women as objects, or treat foreign children like that? ---
**Author:** ![Elmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e9a140/32.png) [@Elmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmore)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2019, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427/380 "2019-01-21T05:39:53Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > **madsircool** isn’t the sexist buttmunch calling her a “handbag”. Do you always refer to women as objects, or treat foreign children like that? Yes, he does. Because he’s bigoted trash. If Huey caught bubonic plague it’d immediately become the best thing about him. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-is-wrong-with-huey-freeman/827427.md?page=20)