# What the fuck was Boeing thinking when they designed the 767 and 777 carryon bins? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 25, 2011, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553 "2011-02-25T06:41:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/21 "2011-02-25T18:24:46Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > The whole boarding and deboarding process would be easier if they checked bags for free and charged a token fee for carry-ons. I wonder why they don’t. Interesting idea. I can tell you that when I travel with my family, each kid gets a backpack, my wife has a purse, I have a backpack, and at a minimum we have a diaper bag. If we get charged per carry-on, all of those things are getting crammed into 1 container and it would be a giant hassle getting things in and out. They’d have to draw a line somewhere between a small purse and a “rollaboard.” ---
**Author:** ![Pai325](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pai325](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pai325)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/22 "2011-02-25T18:41:59Z")
They could eliminate the overheads for passenger use and make you check anything that doesn’t fit under the seat in front of you - or tell you to buy another ticket if you want to bring a suitcase on. ---
**Author:** ![Moonlitherial](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4bbf92/32.png) [@Moonlitherial](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moonlitherial)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/23 "2011-02-25T18:42:19Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Interesting idea. I can tell you that when I travel with my family, each kid gets a backpack, my wife has a purse, I have a backpack, and at a minimum we have a diaper bag. If we get charged per carry-on, all of those things are getting crammed into 1 container and it would be a giant hassle getting things in and out. They’d have to draw a line somewhere between a small purse and a “rollaboard.” Charge by weight! Although I hate the wait at the baggage claim it’s still better than the hassle of carting and finding a place for bags in the passenger compartment. Of course this is post kids - I can’t imagine traveling with small children without an arsenal of diversions. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/24 "2011-02-25T18:43:44Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > The whole boarding and deboarding process would be easier if they checked bags for free and charged a token fee for carry-ons. I wonder why they don’t. 1. Many short-term travelers like the convenience of not having to pick up their luggage at baggage claim. 2. More checked-in bags increases the chances of lost luggage. 3. With oil prices so high, they want to reduce the weight of the plane. This was one of their stated reason for charging fees. Speaking of #3, I wonder if the weight of planes have significantly decreased on airlines that impose a fee. Because it doesn’t make sense to charge for overweight luggage if they don’t weigh carryons. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/25 "2011-02-25T18:45:12Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Interesting idea. I can tell you that when I travel with my family, each kid gets a backpack, my wife has a purse, I have a backpack, and at a minimum we have a diaper bag. If we get charged per carry-on, all of those things are getting crammed into 1 container and it would be a giant hassle getting things in and out. They’d have to draw a line somewhere between a small purse and a “rollaboard.” there is - it’s called a personal item handbag, laptop bag, small tote bag? personal item thing with wheels and fits a trip’s worth of clothes? not personal item unfortunately, charging for it won’t help - the business traveler douchebags would just business expense it and nothing would be solved. no, what they need to do is require anything wtih wheels get checked. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/26 "2011-02-25T18:49:12Z")
> [@PunditLisa](#): > > 1. Many short-term travelers like the convenience of not having to pick up their luggage at baggage claim. obviously that’s a personal thing but a) that is countered with the inconvenience of dragging the bag through the terminal, separating out your liquids, carrying it on the plane, hoping that you get carry on space, and dragging it off the plane, and b) in most every airport i’ve been through, you pass by the luggage check-in gates when you depart, and you pass by baggage claim when you arrive. all in all, you’re not really enhancing your convenience > [@](#): > > 1. More checked-in bags increases the chances of lost luggage. why? the system exists, it’s computerized. whether there’s one bag or 1,000,000 isn’t going to change the probability of lost luggage. > [@](#): > > 1. With oil prices so high, they want to reduce the weight of the plane. This was one of their stated reason for charging fees. no, they want to offset the cost of fueling the plane by charging for discretionary weight, i.e. luggage. whether you check or carry on, you’re not going to appreciably change the weight of the aircraft ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/27 "2011-02-25T18:49:51Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > no, what they need to do is require anything wtih wheels get checked. I can get on board with this. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/28 "2011-02-25T19:09:04Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > no, what they need to do is require anything wtih wheels get checked. Disagree. If it fits within the specs for an item to be stowed in an overhead bin, it is a carry-on. I have a bag with wheels (I think it is about 21 by 14 or so) and have never once had any problem fitting it in any overhead bin, except on the regional jets. Also, Spirit Airlines instituted a policy last year in which anything that fits under your seat is free, and things that have to go overhead have a $45 fee on them. Checked baggage costs $30. But as part of this policy, ticket prices were reduced by something like $60 or so. For many reasons, I have no interest in flying Spirit Airlines – mostly because they mostly go where I have no interest in going (primarily Florida, yuk). ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/29 "2011-02-25T19:21:35Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Disagree. If it fits within the specs for an item to be stowed in an overhead bin, it is a carry-on. I have a bag with wheels (I think it is about 21 by 14 or so) and have never once had any problem fitting it in any overhead bin, except on the regional jets. I’m not denying that things with wheels can be carry ons, i’m suggesting that they change the rules to require that things with wheels get checked. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/30 "2011-02-25T19:22:36Z")
> [@Ex\_Chemist](#): > > One trick I was shown was to flip the rollaboard around so the wheels point out. I’ve found that rollaboards which don’t fit wheels in will often fit wheels out. Seems odd, but it works. Continental flight staff actively tell passengers to point wheels out. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/31 "2011-02-25T19:26:04Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > I’m not denying that things with wheels can be carry ons, i’m suggesting that they change the rules to require that things with wheels get checked. Should be also require green bags to be checked? How about anything with a luggage tag? To make my point a little more clearly, if my 21x14 bag has wheels, and your 21x14 bag does not, to require me to check my bag while you can stroll on with yours makes no sense. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/32 "2011-02-25T19:31:05Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Should be also require green bags to be checked? How about anything with a luggage tag? > > To make my point a little more clearly, if my 21x14 bag has wheels, and your 21x14 bag does not, to require me to check my bag while you can stroll on with yours makes no sense. simply because many more people utilize wheeled bags as luggage. not many people, especially business travelers, can or do use duffel bags. this is a numbers issue - there aren’t enough overhead bin spaces for everyone to carry their luggage for their trip on board. edit: also, for the same size piece of luggage, the one with wheels can carry significantly more weight (in that most people won’t carry 35 lbs on their shoulders or hands, but would gladly wheel it), which only adds to the delay and bothersomeness of that type of luggage. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/33 "2011-02-25T19:41:36Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > simply because many more people utilize wheeled bags as luggage. not many people, especially business travelers, can or do use duffel bags. > > this is a numbers issue - there aren’t enough overhead bin spaces for everyone to carry their luggage for their trip on board. Or maybe all duffel bags should be checked so we can get the wheeled luggage in the overhead. This “no wheels” idea is not very logical. As **Ravenman** pointed out, it’s pretty arbitrary. ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/34 "2011-02-25T19:42:51Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > simply because many more people utilize wheeled bags as luggage. not many people, especially business travelers, can or do use duffel bags. > > this is a numbers issue - there aren’t enough overhead bin spaces for everyone to carry their luggage for their trip on board. > > edit: also, for the same size piece of luggage, the one with wheels can carry significantly more weight, which only adds to the delay and bothersomeness of that type of luggage. So you’re proposing making the policy inconvenient to the most people possible. Maybe you should work for the airlines. The luggage industry evolved to meet the needs of travelers. The airlines specified dimensions that were allowed and the luggage companies made pieces to fit those requirements. They did things like make them the correct size and put convenient little wheels on them. Many airlines have started weighing carry ons btw. I’d expect in the next couple years it will be universal policy. ---
**Author:** ![RaftPeople](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@RaftPeople](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RaftPeople)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/35 "2011-02-25T19:46:29Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > edit: also, for the same size piece of luggage, the one with wheels can carry significantly more weight (in that most people won’t carry 35 lbs on their shoulders or hands, but would gladly wheel it), which only adds to the delay and bothersomeness of that type of luggage. The people I see with that type of luggage often seem to be experienced travelers and pretty efficient. It’s a generality, but seems to be true more often than not. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/36 "2011-02-25T19:46:59Z")
I happen to have a piece of luggage that is basically two duffel bags which zip together to make one big duffel. The bottom duffel has wheels and the top has a standard duffel handle. They’re both virtually the same size but **Rumor** says I’d have to check the bottom one. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/37 "2011-02-25T19:49:22Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > To make my point a little more clearly, if my 21x14 bag has wheels, and your 21x14 bag does not, to require me to check my bag while you can stroll on with yours makes no sense. Well, it does if yours is 21" _plus_ wheels. ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/38 "2011-02-25T19:52:27Z")
> [@RaftPeople](#): > > Or maybe all duffel bags should be checked so we can get the wheeled luggage in the overhead. > This “no wheels” idea is not very logical. As **Ravenman** pointed out, it’s pretty arbitrary. I imagine the ratio of wheeled bags to non-wheeled ones in the overheads is something like 8:1. getting rid of the non-wheeled ones wouldn’t make much of a difference. really, though, i’d be happy with everyone having to stick their luggage in those metal getups. 80% of passengers would fail. ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/39 "2011-02-25T20:06:58Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > why? the system exists, it’s computerized. whether there’s one bag or 1,000,000 isn’t going to change the probability of lost luggage. I know many, many people whose luggage has been lost by the airline but I don’t know one person whose had their carry-on lost by the airline. Me? I still check-in a bag most trips but that is mainly because I am a leisure traveler and am not on a tight schedule. [Quote=Rumor\_Watkins] obviously that’s a personal thing but a) that is countered with the inconvenience of dragging the bag through the terminal, separating out your liquids, carrying it on the plane, hoping that you get carry on space, and dragging it off the plane, and b) in most every airport i’ve been through, you pass by the luggage check-in gates when you depart, and you pass by baggage claim when you arrive. all in all, you’re not really enhancing your convenience. [/quote] Seasoned travelers know how to pack very efficiently. And if it meets the space requirements, I see no reason why they should be forced to check it in. In larger airports, the luggage may very well arrive by the time you get to baggage claim. Not so in smaller airports. Just two weeks ago, we had to wait 15 minutes for our luggage because another flight was ahead of us on the one of few carrousels that they had in operation at the Sarasota airport. And the extra time needed to grab our bags gave all the road warriors a chance to make it to the car rental before the leisure crowd arrived. As it should be. ---
**Author:** ![MilTan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@MilTan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MilTan)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2011, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553/40 "2011-02-25T20:28:20Z")
I think one of the big points the OP is missing is that while the 777 and 767 are both newish Boeing jets, neither of them are actually that new. The 777 was launched in 1994, well before everyone and their mother started bringing roller bags on board. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-fuck-was-boeing-thinking-when-they-designed-the-767-and-777-carryon-bins/572553.md?page=3)