# What the hell, Arizona? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 25, 2014, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268 "2014-02-25T23:21:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/21 "2014-02-26T12:22:51Z")
[QUOTE=askthepizzaguy] Arizona, the torch of knowledge sputters in your hands. [/QUOTE] Well, who’s the Einstein gave it to them in the first place ? Had to know they were going to use it to set a stack of evolution textbooks on fire or something, it’s _Arizona_. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/22 "2014-02-26T12:47:09Z")
The Onion has pointed out some provisions in the law: > [@](#): > > •If refusing service, business owners required to spit tobacco before saying, “We don’t take kindly to you folk” > •Gays can still buy muffins at the bakery, but they have to wait until the straight people have taken their pick > •Requires straight customers to spend a little extra money to make up the difference ---
**Author:** ![campp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@campp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/campp)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/23 "2014-02-26T12:51:26Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > No kidding. The OP’s home state is filled and run by some of the most reactionary assholes in the entire country. It’s not a new development. Broad brush there. The state is full of wonderful people. The **Legislature** , on the other hand, is filled and run by some of the most reactionary assholes in the entire country. That is true. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/24 "2014-02-26T13:14:12Z")
> [@campp](#): > > Broad brush there. The state is full of wonderful people. > > The **Legislature** , on the other hand, is filled and run by some of the most reactionary assholes in the entire country. That is true. ☹ So most of the members of the legislature openly defied the wishes of most of their constituents? How did these guys get voted into office? :dubious: The claim that this bill protects people’s exercise of their religious beliefs is suspect. I have yet to see an answer to the following question: Where in the bible is the proscription against christians engaging in business transactions with homosexuals? If this is about avoiding interactions with sinners, then they should add [the fat, the lazy,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_deadly_sins) and a [whole bunch of other people](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_commandments) to their blacklist. What if my religion requires me to avoid contact with black people? Or christians? Can I get a law that protects my religious freedom to keep all of these infidels out of my place of business? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/25 "2014-02-26T13:15:02Z")
> [@campp](#): > > The state is full of wonderful people. > > The **Legislature** , on the other hand, How, exactly, do you believe these shitbag Legislators got their jobs? ---
**Author:** ![campp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@campp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/campp)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/26 "2014-02-26T13:52:10Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > How, exactly, do you believe these shitbag Legislators got their jobs? **Ignorance**. This is a conservative state for sure, lots of retirees. That’s why guys like Arpaio can thrive here; they know how to scare people just enough to get the votes. Also, the legislators themselves pull some nasty tricks. Witness the [Russell Pearce sham candidate Olivia Cortes incident.](http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/bastard/2011/10/russell_pearces_sham_candidate_5.php) I love my state, but have no respect for that worthless legislative body. ---
**Author:** ![DummyGladHands](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/49beb7/32.png) [@DummyGladHands](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DummyGladHands)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/27 "2014-02-26T14:07:13Z")
[http://www.azcentral.com/opinions/articles/20140225pearce-stand-up-god-country-family.html](http://www.azcentral.com/opinions/articles/20140225pearce-stand-up-god-country-family.html) :mad: Welcome to Arizona, it’s a dry hate. I apologize to the world for my state. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/28 "2014-02-26T15:01:01Z")
> [@DummyGladHands](#): > > [http://www.azcentral.com/opinions/articles/20140225pearce-stand-up-god-country-family.html](http://www.azcentral.com/opinions/articles/20140225pearce-stand-up-god-country-family.html) > :mad: > > Welcome to Arizona, it’s a dry hate. > > I apologize to the world for my state. This almost never happens, but the user responses on that page are actually _encouraging_. ---
**Author:** ![yanceylebeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yanceylebeef/32/12290_2.png) [@yanceylebeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yanceylebeef)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/29 "2014-02-26T15:08:05Z")
Remember, you can’t spell crazy without R-AZ. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/30 "2014-02-26T15:16:20Z")
> [@yanceylebeef](#): > > Remember, you can’t spell crazy without R-AZ. I’m stealing this! ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/31 "2014-02-26T15:18:03Z")
> [@DummyGladHands](#): > > [http://www.azcentral.com/opinions/articles/20140225pearce-stand-up-god-country-family.html](http://www.azcentral.com/opinions/articles/20140225pearce-stand-up-god-country-family.html) > :mad: > > Welcome to Arizona, it’s a dry hate. > > I apologize to the world for my state. What is encouraging is that most commenters are not in favor of the opinion of the recalled Pierce. > [@](#): > > Eric Kurland · Top Commenter · Works at Gummy Bears > Mother! Come and get Russell…he got out again! And he supports Melvin. That figures. (and some commenters also notice that and disapprove) Russel Pierce really wants Arizona to hire a governor that will do more damage to the Arizona [del]Home[/del] state. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/32 "2014-02-26T15:24:13Z")
That home reference BTW is coming from a funny coincidence, there is a local contracting company that has billboards showing a hapless construction worker making a mess of a job, the advise in big letters: “Don’t hire a Melvin!” ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/33 "2014-02-26T15:30:04Z")
> [@Askthepizzaguy](#): > > Remember, Republicans can’t do the right thing unless they shift the blame onto someone else. Like when they had to pass the debt ceiling, they had to limit the number of Republican votes to the bare minimum, so they can blame the Democrats for the country continuing to operate. Real conservatives want none of that kind of crap going on. This. Clearly the state of AZ would sanction religious discrimination against gays if nobody said anything. Now if they permit gays to exist there, like you say, they can say, “we tried, but it is just too bad for business to force them gays into exile.” My next reaction is: what bigger story is this distracting us all from? I suspect a lot of these flashy headline moves are meant to divert attention away from other things. What is it this time? ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/34 "2014-02-26T16:17:27Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > If this is about avoiding interactions with sinners, then they should add [the fat, the lazy,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_deadly_sins) and a [whole bunch of other people](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_commandments) to their blacklist. Yeah; frankly I’m a bit surprised that the legislation apparently doesn’t include persons who have had, or facilitated, abortions on the list of folks who can be refused service on religious grounds. Anyway, I propose a new state slogan: “Not quite Uganda, but give us time.” No charge for that. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/35 "2014-02-26T16:21:01Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > My next reaction is: what bigger story is this distracting us all from? I suspect a lot of these flashy headline moves are meant to divert attention away from other things. What is it this time? Probably nothing. The era of cold blooded, amoral-but-pragmatic Republican leaders who whip up the fanatics for votes or cover while having an entirely different agenda is pretty much over. This is the era of the True Believer, where the Republican party is crazy from top to bottom. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/36 "2014-02-26T16:21:02Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > I don’t believe their claims of ignorance of the purpose of bill at all (Pierce was on some show the other day claiming he had _no idea_ that it could even be interpreted as anti-gay even a little bit; BS), but it’s good to see that even the Arizona GOP is feeling the heat. No, I don’t believe their excuses at all. Nobody should. > [@campp](#): > > Broad brush there. The state is full of wonderful people. > > The **Legislature** , on the other hand, is filled and run by some of the most reactionary assholes in the entire country. That is true. ☹ If you take any large group of people, you will find some very good ones. That’s true in Arizona or anyplace else. But the people of Arizona keep electing assholes like this to run the state, and that means a substantial number of them support this brand of insane bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Askthepizzaguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askthepizzaguy/32/9405_2.png) [@Askthepizzaguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askthepizzaguy)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/37 "2014-02-26T16:22:23Z")
Trying to suppress outrage… trying… trying… failing. So these “moral crusaders” trying to protect family and country from the immorality of teh gay largely insist they’re doing it to uphold freedom and to protect the good moral character of their community, and not because they’re hateful little trolls. They don’t hate anybody. They care deeply about the poor people who have chosen a life of immorality, and simply wish to indicate that they don’t support immorality. That’s all, no hatred required. Yes, yes, yes, that’s precisely the same excuse used during every other act of oppression towards socially acceptable targets throughout history. You see, the Nazis didn’t “hate” anyone. They just thought that the Jews were all traitors with poor moral character, best removed from the community. Same with the gays. They were dangerous people with poor morals. Same with any Catholics who stood up and said “hey, that’s not right”. Those people were spineless traitors who didn’t have the decent moral character to stand up for the good and proper values of the greatest nation on the planet. What they did, they claim they didn’t do it out of hatred, they were just protecting the community from the dangerous people in their midst who were weakening the moral fabric. And if you opposed the action of removing the traitors from the community, then you were also a traitor who hated freedom. :rolleyes: If all you’re asking for is the “freedom” to make sure a certain class of person can’t get a job anywhere, can’t get a home anywhere, can’t be legally married anywhere, can’t eat at a restaurant anywhere, and thus, incapable of freely participating within the community in any meaningful way, then what you’re asking for is **not freedom.** Maybe it doesn’t take hatred to oppress people. Maybe you’re that effing deluded that you think this is an act of goodness and mercy. In that case, you’re a moron of legendary caliber. As for hatred? I do hate certain people. I hate what they believe, and I hate how they choose to go about expressing it. I think their mind is filled with absolutely sickening garbage that is dangerous to themselves and others, and I think teaching it to children is the most saddening form of child abuse there is. I am grateful for the day that they finally keel over and die of natural causes, and I am grateful for every single one of their children who gains enough awareness to reject their idiocy and grow up to be a **decent human being** who is **decent towards other human beings.** Which, incidentally, is how you can be considered a decent human being. Fun fact. And despite my personal feelings on their lack of moral character, I still refuse to do a single thing to prevent these people from speaking their filth, I mean fail, oh why not just combine the two and call it “faith”. I do nothing to stop them from voting their beliefs, or from getting a job, or owning a home, or buying things at the store, or getting married. Why is that? Because unlike them, I actually \*do \*support freedom. You have the freedom to be a total douchebag in your own private space, on your own private time, and think your douchebag thoughts and even raise your kids to be total douchebags just like you. You _don’t_ have the freedom to oppress people. That’s not a kind of freedom. You think you’ve got great moral character, oppressing gay people. You think it shows how superior your values are. I think it puts you right up there with the crusaders who didn’t mind pillaging a few Christian cities while on their way to go pillage some Muslim cities. I think it puts you in the same good company as inquisitors who tortured people to death to make them confess the divinity of Jesus. I think it makes you as noble a defender of the community as those who put on trial and then executed witches, and later, hunted down and exposed all the evil communists in our midst, whether or not they were actually communist. I think you’re right up there with those fine and decent folks who just wanted to eliminate the corrupt Jewish threat to the otherwise morally superior German community. You’d make a sterling segregationist, protecting the pure and decent white community from those blacks who want to come in and learn at the same schools as the rest of us. How dare they, how dare they. You see, it doesn’t take hatred at all to oppress others. You just have to consider yourself to be superior to them, and know in your heart that they don’t really deserve equality, because they’re naturally evil people. Not like you, O paragon of virtue, so proud of your superior moral values. They say that hatred must be taught, and they’re right. Without folks like this who run around demanding the freedom to make others miserable, I probably wouldn’t understand why people hate one another. You have taught me to hate, and I hate you for that, too. I even Godwinned the thread. This is why I try to suppress the rage. I’m not proud of it, feel free to just scroll past any post I make larger than a few sentences. ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/38 "2014-02-26T16:26:39Z")
Maybe I’ve got a case of the dumbs, but couldn’t a private business already refuse service to anyone it wanted? ---
**Author:** ![Rhiannon8404](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rhiannon8404/32/17929_2.png) [@Rhiannon8404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhiannon8404)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/39 "2014-02-26T16:41:21Z")
> [@Kimballkid](#): > > Maybe I’ve got a case of the dumbs, but couldn’t a private business already refuse service to anyone it wanted? That’s what I was thinking. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2014, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268/40 "2014-02-26T16:45:52Z")
> [@Kimballkid](#): > > Maybe I’ve got a case of the dumbs, but couldn’t a private business already refuse service to anyone it wanted? Unless the would-be customer is a member of a legally protected class. In Arizona that precludes refusing service on the basis of race, sex, religion…but teh gheys are fair game, and on a Federal level as well. Which was part of AC’s point in his “conversation” with Al Melvin. Arizona _already_ allows discrimination against gays and lesbians, and the vast majority of towns and cities in AZ do as well. No bullshit “preemptive” law makes a difference to that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-arizona/682268.md?page=3)