# What the hell happened to contemporary animation? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 1, 2013, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759 "2013-03-01T20:16:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/41 "2013-03-03T01:28:22Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > [Here’s some characters from _Out There_.](http://www.animationmagazine.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/Out-There-post-1.jpg) > > [Here’s some characters from _Adventure Time_.](http://www.saywhatonline.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/Adventure_Time_Chibi.png) > > Can you identify the specific graphic elements from either cartoon that you feel were imported from Japanese animation? Those look more like web animation than japanimation to me. The sort of thing you’d used to get a ~5min flash animation of but now turned into a full blown show but retaining the same style. Note, I’m just commenting on the looks from those images, I have not watched either of these shows. ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/42 "2013-03-03T03:29:20Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > In a strange way that’s why it works - the stiff animation makes the over-the-top dialogue even funnier. In a way, Archer is the television equivalent of [Partially Clips](http://partiallyclips.com/). Indeed. The “hilariously” was meant as a compliment (as in, it adds to the hilarity of the show). But yeah, come on. I mean. Hailing Archer’s animation/art style as “fine” or an example of “good”? No way. It works for the show because of the premise of the show but it’s not a shining example of great animation! Haha. Courage the Cowardly Dog is the last cartoon that had a unique/distinct art and animation style that really blew me out of the water (and admittedly it was just a more refined/better Ren and Stimpy if you ask me). ---
**Author:** ![TaoPilot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/77aa72/32.png) [@TaoPilot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TaoPilot)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/43 "2013-03-03T06:38:00Z")
> [@Hail\_Ants](#): > > Nor do they need to. One of the things I think is so wrong with the past ten or so seasons of _The Simpsons_ is that the animation has gotten way, \*way \*too good. It’s not supposed to be a Disney show (far from it)! The emphasis is supposed to be first & foremost on the writing, and amping up the animation quality does absolutely nothing to help the poor scripts. Thank you!! I was starting to wonder if I was the only person who had this opinion. Older Simpsons episodes had odd, scribbly animation at times, but that was a definite part of its charm! ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/44 "2013-03-03T12:50:40Z")
> [@NitroPress](#): > > I don’t know anyone doing full-motion animation for TV. Some is optimal limited-motion, but far too much of it descends to HB and that awful anime trope where they just move a still image around a lot. Ok, that’s a fair assessment. I would say more of the stuff we are talking about is optimal limited than not though. And if it’s not it’s usually for a good reason. I think Archer is a good example of this, as is South Park. Neither one needs to be as limited as they are, they chose to be. I was watching Dora the Explorer with my daughter last night, and that is genuinly limited animation. Watch something like that and then compare it to something like Archer or South Park. I haven’t seen enough of Adventure Time to get a solid sense of the desired effect,I think it is to create something that recalls shows like Dora but I am not totally sure, but the intention of Archer becomes really obvious when put next to something that is just being done on the cheap like Dora. > [@](#): > > I think it’s “intentional” because they can get away with saying so. I think you get into dangerous waters, critically speaking, when you start assuming that the creators are not in full control of their art and making decisions for artistic reasons when there is an valid artistic argument to be made for the results. ---
**Author:** ![LawMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@LawMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LawMonkey)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/45 "2013-03-03T16:50:58Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > But yeah, come on. I mean. Hailing Archer’s animation/art style as “fine” or an example of “good”? No way. It works for the show because of the premise of the show but it’s not a shining example of great animation! Haha. I thought I made it clear in the OP that I was talking about the art style rather than the animation. I’m not talking about the FPS or the fluidity of the characters, I’m saying that if you take a still of _Archer_ and put it next to a still of _Adventure Time_, one will look purdy, the other will look derpy. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/46 "2013-03-03T17:00:37Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > I thought I made it clear in the OP that I was talking about the art style rather than the animation. I’m not talking about the FPS or the fluidity of the characters, I’m saying that if you take a still of _Archer_ and put it next to a still of _Adventure Time_, one will look purdy, the other will look derpy. Which takes us back to the reason for the art styles being chosen. At is playing on the conventions of children’s cartoons and following a tradition of simple expresive line work going back to the 40s ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/47 "2013-03-03T19:03:05Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > I thought I made it clear in the OP that I was talking about the art style rather than the animation. I’m not talking about the FPS or the fluidity of the characters, I’m saying that if you take a still of _Archer_ and put it next to a still of _Adventure Time_, one will look purdy, the other will look derpy. Ignoring animation completely and JUST considering Archer based on stills, it is completely derivative, unimaginative and boring. I don’t think it looks “purdy” at all. It looks like… nothing really. Just “ok”. Again, huge fan of Archer but really? You think the art style is fantastic? I disagree, _strongly_. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2013, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/48 "2013-03-03T19:06:42Z")
To my eye AT is creative and beautiful artwork. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2013, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/49 "2013-03-04T04:28:42Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I’m going to go out on a limb here and say that guy was full of shit. From my experience, he is right - I know I’ve made the same complaint about the art classes I’m currently taking. There’s been a lot of time devoted to the different mediums but except for a couple of half sessions on shadow and perspective there’s been nothing on how to represent things as they really are. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2013, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/50 "2013-03-04T21:12:07Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > From my experience, he is right - I know I’ve made the same complaint about the art classes I’m currently taking. There’s been a lot of time devoted to the different mediums but except for a couple of half sessions on shadow and perspective there’s been nothing on how to represent things as they really are. I graduated from an art school last December, and the curriculum was pretty rigorous, with a strong emphasis on life drawing skills and the importance of regular practice. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2013, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/51 "2013-03-04T21:17:28Z")
> [@Arkcon](#): > > So I’m guessing, the oldsters in this thread would also hate graphical style of _The Simpsons_ – yellow skin, Bart has no hair line, etc. Early Ulman-era Simpsons looked atrocious and the first season was still pretty weak in the art department before they cleaned it up in subsequent seasons. Heck, even the show has poked fun at its terrible looking roots. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2013, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/52 "2013-03-04T22:51:16Z")
And yet in post 43 the sentiment was already expressed that its early rougher animation was part of “its charm” and how The Simpsons lost something as its animation quality putatively "improved ". It’s important to have the right look for the right show. You do not want smooth post production sound mixing for a punk rock album. Or perhaps better yet as an analogy: Bing Crosby had a great voice, smooth, great range, but him singing Dylan or Springsteen would not have worked well, even though his voice was of much higher quality, or maybe even because of that. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2013, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/53 "2013-03-04T23:02:50Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > [Here’s some characters from _Out There_.](http://www.animationmagazine.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/Out-There-post-1.jpg) > > [Here’s some characters from _Adventure Time_.](http://www.saywhatonline.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/Adventure_Time_Chibi.png) > > Can you identify the specific graphic elements from either cartoon that you feel were imported from Japanese animation? I’d say there’s a recognisable Japanese influence. I’m not sure how to isolate, distil and describe graphic elements, but compare those Adventure Time characters to [these](http://comicbuzz.com/wp-content/uploads//2012/10/Katamari-Designs.jpg). I think the style might be ‘Japanese Cute’. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2013, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759/54 "2013-03-04T23:12:03Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > And yet in post 43 the sentiment was already expressed that its early rougher animation was part of “its charm” and how The Simpsons lost something as its animation quality putatively "improved " Sure. One guy’s opinion and different strokes, etc. The show’s creators felt it was worth it to clean up the animation between the original shorts and S1 and clean it up more between S1 and S2. I side with their thinking as the original animation, in my opinion, was more detriment than “charm”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-the-hell-happened-to-contemporary-animation/651759.md?page=2)