# What TV shows exist in the universes of other TV shows? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 18, 2006, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464 "2006-01-18T03:08:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Gozu\_Tashoya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/7993a0/32.png) [@Gozu\_Tashoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gozu_Tashoya)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/1 "2006-01-18T03:08:36Z")
I just watched, last night, the episode of _The West Wing_ where Josh talked to someone on his staff about her _Star Trek_ pin, and this led me to wonder to what extent TV characters talk about other “real world” TV shows, movies, or personalities. Off the top of my head, I know that a lot of “real” TV exists in the _Simpsons_ universe. Patty and Selma are big _MacGyver_ fans, Abe Simpson and the other retirement-home residents are fans of _Matlock_, and I’m sure many other shows are mentioned by name (as opposed to simply being parodied). The core of the _Buffy the Vampire Slayer_ crew refer to themselves as the Scoobies, so _Scooby-Doo_ apparently exists for them. As does _Snoopy_. If I remember correctly, _Star Wars_ references were also fairly commonplace. (Actually, tons of pop-culture references were commonplace; it’s a sad testament to how long ago I watched BtVS that this is all I came up with.) Colin Farrell and, presumably, his body of work exists in the _Angel_ universe. _Sports Night_ acknowledged the existence of ESPN and, I believe, Fox Sports, though I don’t believe they named any actual programming or on-air personalities. So, what other characters are watching the same shows we are? ---
**Author:** ![bouv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bc8723/32.png) [@bouv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bouv)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/2 "2006-01-18T03:13:16Z")
Figure this one out: In the Futurama universe, The Simpsons is regarded as a real TV show from the 20th century, and Matt Groening is the real person who created it. In The Simpsons, Futurama is a real TV show and Matt Groening in the real person who created it. To further complicate things, in one episode of The Simpsons, Bender is presented as a real character (granted, it was in a “future” episode, which might be considered outside continuity, like the Treehouses of Horror.) But still, both TV shows acknowledge that the other exists in their respective universe. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/3 "2006-01-18T03:14:46Z")
_Buffy_ also has _Star Trek_, as Spike says in one episode “Help me, Spock. I don’t speak nerd!” ---
**Author:** ![Tarrsk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/97f17d/32.png) [@Tarrsk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarrsk)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/4 "2006-01-18T03:17:02Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > _Buffy_ also has _Star Trek_, as Spike says in one episode “Help me, Spock. I don’t speak nerd!” Xander also refers to Giles as “Locutus of Borg,” and Andrew erroneously claims that Faith killed a Vulcan. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/5 "2006-01-18T03:23:27Z")
_Buffy_ also had _Star Wars_, as the NerdTrio has the Death Star painted on the side of their van. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/6 "2006-01-18T03:24:50Z")
> [@bouv](#): > > Figure this one out: > > In the Futurama universe, The Simpsons is regarded as a real TV show from the 20th century, and Matt Groening is the real person who created it. …and people still argue that the first 500 years is better than the second 500 years. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/7 "2006-01-18T03:28:38Z")
…slightly off-topic but more related to your thread title, thanks to _St Elsewhere_, nearly every television show is related to everything else… [http://www.poobala.com/cheersandelsewhere.html](http://www.poobala.com/cheersandelsewhere.html) > [@](#): > > An addendum to all St. Elsewhere entries: The final episode of St. Elsewhere revealed the entire series to be the daydream of an autistic child (man did this show have balls!). Given this, an argument could be made that all the crossovers with St. Elsewhere are invalid. That all the crossovers were merely part of the kid’s dream. Like he watched Cheers on TV and worked it into his little fantasy and thus the shows don’t really exist as part of the same reality. I count the crossovers as valid however. When all these crossovers were aired it was with the idea they were real. No one new the whole show was supposed to be a kids dream. So, since they were intended as real, I say they’re legit. I actually like the idea that the kid dreamed ALL the shows connected to St. Elsewhere. In that case if you check all the pertinent crossovers you’ll discover that the show Newhart was the dream of Bob Newhart’s character from the Bob Newhart show who was in turn only a character in an autistic kid’s head. Don’t think about that too long or your head will explode. [Every cross-over you could ever think of…](http://www.poobala.com/crossoverlistb.html#byreality) ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/8 "2006-01-18T03:29:54Z")
Elroy Jetson watched Fred Flinstone on his watch TV (hardly surprising since they had the same producers and network). Archie Bunker mentioned _Laverne & Shirley_ (though he called them ‘Levine & Shelley’). Sanford & Son went on _The Gong Show_, as did Eunice Higgins from _Carol Burnett/Mama’s Family_. _Friends_ mentioned several TV shows, but I specifically remember _What’s Happenin’!_ being refrerenced (by Chandler). ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Fight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/90ced4/32.png) [@Cat\_Fight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Fight)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/9 "2006-01-18T03:31:00Z")
I believe _Buffy_’s Spike was a big \*Passions \* fan. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/10 "2006-01-18T03:31:30Z")
In a David E Kelly stupid mind thing - **Ally McBeal** and **The Practice** were in the same universe, and the characters crossed over a few times. In one episode, however, Ally’s tv was turned on to an episode of **The Practice**. Which was incredibly stupid. Also, in **Mad About You** , **The Alan Brady Show** (the fake show that Rob Petrie worked on in **Dick Van Dyke** ) was a real tv show. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/11 "2006-01-18T03:49:09Z")
In **Seinfeld** , the **Merv Griffin Show** was real, though Kramer’s fake Merv Griffin Show was not ;). ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/12 "2006-01-18T03:52:49Z")
In the **Dr. Who** episode, _Rememberence of the Daleks_, Sylvester McCoy’s doctor leaves the room just as the premiere episode of Dr. Who is about to be broadcast. In **The George Burns and Gracie Allen Show** , George would occasionally turn on the TV to watch **The George Burns and Gracie Allen Show** to see what Gracie was up to behind his back. **Hill Street Blues** is evidently broadcast in **Newhart’s** world: Bob makes a big deal about Daniel J. Travanti of the show planning to stay at the Inn. Similarly, in **Bob** , Newhart is established as being an old friend of George Wendt, who is known to everyone else as “They Guy Who Plays Norm on Cheers.” **Arrested Development** had the Bluth family watching **Mad Money** with Jim Cramer and being happy that he has upgraded their stock to “Don’t Buy.” Similarly, George Michael goes with Ann to picket the home of **Desparate Housewives** producer Marc Cherry. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/13 "2006-01-18T03:53:50Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > In **Seinfeld** , the **Merv Griffin Show** was real, though Kramer’s fake Merv Griffin Show was not ;). Isn’t **Murphy Brown** a real show, too? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/14 "2006-01-18T03:55:44Z")
_Spenser: For Hire_ exists in the _Cheers_ universe. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/15 "2006-01-18T03:55:57Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Isn’t **Murphy Brown** a real show, too? Not sure, but I remember that **Melrose Place** was a real show as well, which Jerry tried to pretend he didn’t like, but he couldn’t outsmart the polygraph (“Who do you think you are? Costanza?!”) ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/16 "2006-01-18T03:57:35Z")
I remember one extremely obvious promotion ploy on _The Monkees_ when Davy not only watched [The Iron Horse](http://imdb.com/title/tt0059996/) (a short lived western) but explained its premise to Peter. _Sigmund & the Sea Munsters_, a Sid & Marty Kroft production, had an episode with Jack Wild as Jack Wild, the star of _H.R. Puffnstuff_ (oy, how pathetic am I for knowing that?). _Days of Our Lives_ exists on _Friends_ but 1- it’s based in NYC, not LA 2- it features characters who never occurred on the actual soap 3- no mention is made of Victor Kyriakis, the Greek born sometime villain/sometime less so character played by Jennifer Aniston’s real-life (estranged) father John Aniston. One episode of _Taxi_ (in which Jim gives each cabbie $1000 to buy gifts for their loved ones) featured Scatman Crothers as a shut in who watches old TV shows all day long. He specifically mentions the episode of _Gilligan’s Island_ where Gilligan thinks he’s Mary Ann and an episode of _Bonanza_ involving a dog who traps the bad guys. Scatman guest starred on an episode of _Bonanza_ that I’ve never seen, and I’ve wondered if he was describing the episode he appeared on as a joke. _Roseanne_ and family watched _Bewitched_ (great in-joke about switching cast members) and _The Beverly Hillbillies_. They also did a spoof of _The Patty Duke Show_ credits once (complete with William Schallert) but I don’t know if they ever referenced the show. I think pretty much every long running sitcom has mentioned _I Love Lucy_. _The Jeffersons_ mentioned _Dallas_ and parodied it in one episode. I don’t think they ever mentioned another Norman Lear show. {Not really relevant, but a Jeffersons nitpick moment- in one episode Louise is thrilled to learn that Sammy Davis, Jr., her idol, is staying across the hallway; she apparently has no recollection of the fact that she once met him at Archie Bunker’s house.) ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/17 "2006-01-18T03:58:40Z")
> [@Mr. Blue Sky](#): > > _Spenser: For Hire_ exists in the _Cheers_ universe. As does _St. Elsewhere_. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/18 "2006-01-18T04:01:55Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > As does _St. Elsewhere_. :smack: Sorry. The doctors from St. E were in character on the crossover. ---
**Author:** ![Casey1505](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@Casey1505](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Casey1505)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/19 "2006-01-18T04:06:27Z")
The three people in my kitchen reminded me that _Jeopardy!_ and the _Tonight Show with Johnny Carson_ both existed in the _Cheers_ world as well. I don’t remember, but I assume \*This Old House \* existed in the _Home Improvement_ world, given Tim’s rivalry with Bob Vila. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2006, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464/20 "2006-01-18T04:18:48Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Isn’t **Murphy Brown** a real show, too? Two references: One, Elaine was writing a “Murphy Brown,” which Jerry and George discovered the early manuscript for when they were looking for Jerry’s spare key. The other, when Kramer took off for California, he landed a spot as Murphy’s secretary. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-exist-in-the-universes-of-other-tv-shows/340464.md?page=2)