# What TV shows have ended by killing off the lead?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [December 22, 2005, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822 "2005-12-22T17:36:20Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 4
### Author:  [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)
#### Post date: [December 23, 2005, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/61 "2005-12-23T18:35:58Z")
> [@TV time](#):
>
> **Newhart** (the one in Vermont) sort of qualifies. It seems he is killed. If he was indeed alive in the first place. On one plain of existence he is dead - ah… maybe.
>
> **Magnum P.I.** would qualify if the series had ended when it should have. So if you think of it ending without that last lame season, it would be one of the first ones thought of.
I don’t see either of those qualifying. “The whole series was just a dream” is a far cry from “the lead character dying.” And if Magnum was alive as of the last minute of the last scene of the last episode, then he’s disqualified.
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### Author:  [@rabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rabbit)
#### Post date: [December 23, 2005, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/62 "2005-12-23T18:42:47Z")
> [@Mr. Blue Sky](#):
>
> At least after the first three incarnations, Black Adder came back as his ancestor. Not so after the fourth series.
Slight nitpick, there is [this link](http://www.bbc.co.uk/comedy/guide/articles/b/blackadderbackfo_7770795.shtml) which has an descendant of blackadder in 1999. Don’t know if he died in this one though (haven’t seen).
I also remember seeing some blackadder special where there is a blackadder space tyrant or some such (a spaceadder perhaps? 😛 ) but I can’t remember what that one was called. I think it came out in blackadder the second time frame.
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### Author:  [@parthenokinesis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/parthenokinesis)
#### Post date: [December 23, 2005, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/63 "2005-12-23T18:49:35Z")
> [@rabbit](#):
>
> Slight nitpick, there is [this link](http://www.bbc.co.uk/comedy/guide/articles/b/blackadderbackfo_7770795.shtml) which has an descendant of blackadder in 1999. Don’t know if he died in this one though (haven’t seen).
> I also remember seeing some blackadder special where there is a blackadder space tyrant or some such (a spaceadder perhaps? 😛 ) but I can’t remember what that one was called. I think it came out in blackadder the second time frame.
That was in the Blackadder Christmas Special, and it had flashbacks to stuff from Blackadders the second and third. I believe it was made prior to Blackadder Goes Forth.
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### Author:  [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)
#### Post date: [December 23, 2005, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/64 "2005-12-23T22:45:44Z")
> [@Fabulous Creature](#):
>
> I don’t see either of those qualifying. “The whole series was just a dream” is a far cry from “the lead character dying.” And if Magnum was alive as of the last minute of the last scene of the last episode, then he’s disqualified.
Possibly- But in the Newhart series he ceases to be. In other words he is killed in that series; even if he wakes up in another series.
And as for Magnum, he wasn’t supposed to be alive. In the final scene of that last show or what should have been that last show they were covering his face with a sheet. It was only in subsequent reruns of that show is he still alive.
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### Author:  [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)
#### Post date: [December 23, 2005, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/65 "2005-12-23T23:14:52Z")
> [@TV time](#):
>
> Possibly- But in the Newhart series he ceases to be. In other words he is killed in that series; even if he wakes up in another series.
>
> And as for Magnum, he wasn’t supposed to be alive. In the final scene of that last show or what should have been that last show they were covering his face with a sheet. It was only in subsequent reruns of that show is he still alive.
I never watched MAGNUM with any regularity–in fact I don’t think I’ve ever seen a complete episode–so I’ll defer to your knowledge there. As for Newhart, all I remember is Bob waking from a dream in which he was Dick Loudon. I still don’t think that qualifies as dying; it just means that Bob, Joanna, Stephanie, Larry, Daryl, et al were all PARTS of Bob-Newhart-the-psychotherapist.
YMMV of course. I’m actually glad you brought up Newhart, though, as it brings back fond memories of the very hot Mary Frann.
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### Author:  [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)
#### Post date: [December 23, 2005, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/66 "2005-12-23T23:29:27Z")
> [@rabbit](#):
>
> Slight nitpick, there is [this link](http://www.bbc.co.uk/comedy/guide/articles/b/blackadderbackfo_7770795.shtml) which has an descendant of blackadder in 1999. Don’t know if he died in this one though (haven’t seen).
> I also remember seeing some blackadder special where there is a blackadder space tyrant or some such (a spaceadder perhaps? 😛 ) but I can’t remember what that one was called. I think it came out in blackadder the second time frame.
:smack:
I forgot about that.
There was some talk of doing a fifth BA series. It was to have taken place in the early 60s. Black Adder was supposed to be a rock manager who just misses out getting the Beatles.
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### Author:  [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/67 "2005-12-24T00:45:15Z")
> [@Fabulous Creature](#):
>
> YMMV of course. I’m actually glad you brought up Newhart, though, as it brings back fond memories of the very hot Mary Frann.
Not only was she hot, but she **preferred** _younger_ guys! 🆒 It’s a shame she’s no longer with us.
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### Author:  [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/68 "2005-12-24T01:13:26Z")
Hehe, Brimstone one upped everyone by killing of the main character in the premier. 🙂
What ever happened at the end of Beauty and the Beast? Didn’t Vincent bite it?
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### Author:  [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/69 "2005-12-24T01:30:23Z")
> [@silenus](#):
>
> A) Angel was already dead.
> B) Joss has said that Angel, Spike and Illyria all survived the battle. Gunn’s status is…indeterminiable.
Where and when did Joss say this? And did he offer any explanations as to how they could have survived? It looked to me as if a significant percentage of the demons in LA were coming down the alleyway at them. Even if the area was confined enough to keep them from getting flanked, that’s a lot of slicing and dicing to do.
And, you know, that’s puzzled me ever since I saw the last show. Why the alleyway? It’s horrible defensive ground and, if I recall correctly, it had 2 open ends and no roof, so there were at least 3 easy ways to get behind Our Heros.
Putting yourself into a box may cut off all your escape routes, which is usually not a good idea, but it does make sure the enemy is coming at you from only one direction, and when you’re that outnumbered, that is a good idea.
(Why no, I haven’t spent much time thinking about this at all.)
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### Author:  [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/70 "2005-12-24T04:10:08Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#):
>
> What ever happened at the end of Beauty and the Beast? Didn’t Vincent bite it?
I’m not sure that I want to admit to knowing this, nut no, Vincent did not die. Catherine died, and the series carried on for a season or two without her, but [del]Lion-O[/del] Vincent was alive and well at the end.
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### Author:  [@Scissorjack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scissorjack)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/71 "2005-12-24T05:00:22Z")
> [@rabbit](#):
>
> I also remember seeing some blackadder special where there is a blackadder space tyrant or some such (a spaceadder perhaps? 😛 ) but I can’t remember what that one was called. I think it came out in blackadder the second time frame.
That was only a _possible_ future Blackadder {actually, Blackadders, since we saw him as either Galactic Tyrant and Baldrick’s slave depending on whether the Dickensian Blackadder was nasty or nice}, as revealed to him by Robbie Coltrane’s Ghost of Christmas Future.
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### Author:  [@Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hey_It_s_That_Guy)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/72 "2005-12-24T05:11:24Z")
> [@Morgyn](#):
>
> Where and when did Joss say this? And did he offer any explanations as to how they could have survived? It looked to me as if a significant percentage of the demons in LA were coming down the alleyway at them. Even if the area was confined enough to keep them from getting flanked, that’s a lot of slicing and dicing to do.
We know Spike survived because Whedon has talked a lot about making a Spike movie, which would very likely also include Illyria, Willow, Andrew, and possibly Oz.
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### Author:  [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/73 "2005-12-24T05:15:27Z")
> [@Morgyn](#):
>
> Where and when did Joss say this?
The outline for Season 6 featured Illyria, and both Spike and Angel are “alive” and kicking in comics. IIRC, Joss was going to pick up the next season “after the battle,” with no details given. This is from a conversation at Comic-Con, and interviews he has given since then.
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### Author:  [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/74 "2005-12-24T05:18:29Z")
> [@Diceman](#):
>
> I’m not sure that I want to admit to knowing this, nut no, Vincent did not die. Catherine died, and the series carried on for a season or two without her, but [del]Lion-O[/del] Vincent was alive and well at the end.
Since you went first, I’ll join you in confessing to Beauty-Beast-geekhood:
At the beginning of the final season, Vincent was beginning to go mad because of the psychological torment Paracelsus had put him through at the end of the previous season. There may also have been some pseudo-Vulcan pon-farness going on there, though, as Catherine cured him by boinking him. She becomes pregnant, but continues her work in the DA’s office, during which she arouses the ire of the season’s primary villain, Gabriel. During the search for her, the replacement beauty, played by the lovely redhead Jo Anderson, joined the cast. Catherine died during childbirth, and Vincent spends the rest of the season searching for his son (and his lover’s killer), with Jo Anderson (whom he did not know at first) running a parallel investigation. During the VERY rushed final episode, Vincent and Jo Anderson finally rescue the baby, and Vincent relieves Gabriel of the burden of his spleen.
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### Author:  [@critter42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/critter42)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/75 "2005-12-24T05:44:30Z")
> [@Art Vandelay](#):
>
> At any rate, Jessica at least did survive the last episode.
She had to, considering she showed up on an episode of _Benson_ about two years later 🙂
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### Author:  [@SSG\_Schwartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SSG_Schwartz)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/76 "2005-12-24T14:51:53Z")
> [@Finagle](#):
>
> Soap. The last episode was a cliff hanger with just about everyone being shot.
>
> Offhand, I remember Jessica was in front of a firing squad and Burt and Danny had just kicked down a door and met a hail of gunfire. Not sure about the rest of the cast – it was probably 20 years ago…
Jessica was shot by a firing squad, Burt (Bat) was met by gangsters in a darkend hotel room, Danny was presumably shot by Chester for being in bed with Chester’s wife. The final scene shows Danny in bed with her and Chester pointing a gun at Danny. If I remember right, Chester says something about suicide. Mary has become and alcoholic and has considered ending her life with pills.
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### Author:  [@anyrose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anyrose)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/77 "2005-12-24T17:50:12Z")
> [@Morgyn](#):
>
> Where and when did Joss say this? And did he offer any explanations as to how they could have survived? It looked to me as if a significant percentage of the demons in LA were coming down the alleyway at them. Even if the area was confined enough to keep them from getting flanked, that’s a lot of slicing and dicing to do.
I’ve mentioned before, I envision all the slayers showing up suddenly, because afterall the former Scoobies have been watching the Fangsters and even tho they initially mistrusted them for teaming up with Wolfram & Hart, the Fangsters subsquent actions have impressed the former Scoobies and they come to fight the good fight. Minus Buffy, of course, since she’s still dancing her feet off in some Italian disco.
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### Author:  [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/78 "2005-12-24T20:10:53Z")
> [@Rilchiam](#):
>
> Dallas.
Later they found out he wasn’t quite as dead as previously suspected and brought him back for several TV movies.
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### Author:  [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2005, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/79 "2005-12-24T23:01:57Z")
> [@jjimm](#):
>
> Chief Inspector Morse.
>
> (Or Morph Inspector Cheese, as my savant friend once spontaneously verbal-anagramized.)
Didn’t Rumpole die also?
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### Author:  [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)
#### Post date: [December 25, 2005, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-tv-shows-have-ended-by-killing-off-the-lead/336822/80 "2005-12-25T01:34:01Z")
> [@silenus](#):
>
> The outline for Season 6 featured Illyria, and both Spike and Angel are “alive” and kicking in comics. IIRC, Joss was going to pick up the next season “after the battle,” with no details given. This is from a conversation at Comic-Con, and interviews he has given since then.
Comics of course don’t count toward the TV continuity. I’m wondering how much of the outline for a projected S6 relied on a radically different last several episodes of S5.
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