# What U.S. CIty Has Had The Worst Decline? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 7, 2003, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664 "2003-05-07T14:30:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Governor\_Quinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d26b3c/32.png) [@Governor\_Quinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Governor_Quinn)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/81 "2003-05-12T21:56:20Z")
Sorry, but Butte is ineligible, due to the Governor’s Addentium, and, most likely, due to Rule 1 (the “decline must have been after 1950” rule). ---
**Author:** ![Doctordec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/cdc98d/32.png) [@Doctordec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctordec)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/82 "2003-05-12T23:01:55Z")
Akron, Ohio deserves mention here. Good economy in the 50’s and 60’s, headquarters for Firestone, BF Goodrich, General Tire, and Goodyear. Akron used to be known as “The Rubber City” and I remember the acrid smell of sulfer almost every day when I was in elementary school. Everybody worked in the tire shops, it was a 24x7 town and you had to have Firestone tires on your car if your old man worked there or he’d disown you. We were a Goodyear family and I still buy only Goodyear tires because they still support some of my relatives with pensions. All the tire manufacturing jobs are long gone and the only headquarters still remaining is a much leaner Goodyear. I still go there once in awhile to visit family but every place I used hang out at is closed. ---
**Author:** ![Doctordec](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/cdc98d/32.png) [@Doctordec](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctordec)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/83 "2003-05-12T23:03:45Z")
Spelling, minus 5 points. sulfur. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/84 "2003-05-13T00:24:44Z")
> [@](#): > > Sorry, but Butte is ineligible, due to the Governor’s Addentium, and, most likely, due to Rule 1 (the “decline must have been after 1950” rule). You’re probably right but I was just trying to think of a city in the Western U.S. that might’ve qualified under the OP’s rules. Just out of curiosity, can anybody think of the western-most city that has been in decline since 1950? ---
**Author:** ![Governor\_Quinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d26b3c/32.png) [@Governor\_Quinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Governor_Quinn)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/85 "2003-05-13T02:04:22Z")
I’d like to say Oakland, California, but I’m not as well-informed about that city as I should be (I live just 90 miles away) ---
**Author:** ![fruitbat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/58f4c7/32.png) [@fruitbat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fruitbat)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/86 "2003-05-13T02:06:38Z")
I can’t believe that in all this talk of Newark and Camden I forgot to nominate Elizabeth NJ. Now granted I only saw a couple square blocks, but those were hellish. The only place where crack vials crunched under my feet. ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 10:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/87 "2003-05-13T10:15:29Z")
But were any of those northern NJ cities great at some point? Always thought of them as the armpit of America. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/88 "2003-05-13T13:20:02Z")
I think the decline of cities has a lot to do with crime ( and the perception of it). A few years ago, I went to Miami, FL. At the car rental area, they gave you a flyer courtesy of the Miami PD.It told you how you should NEVER stop for a light if you are being followed, and told you how to get to the nearest police station. Not a good start for a Miami vacation! Once crime gets out of control, you can kiss your city goodby! ---
**Author:** ![blanx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f04885/32.png) [@blanx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blanx)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/89 "2003-05-13T13:22:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by 5-HT \* > \*\*That’s OK, no one pays attention to the traffic signals at night in Detroit.🙂 But seriously, now I’m really wondering about my city. Is it really that scary, and I’m just used to it? Hell, I _still_ hang out down around the old Tiger Stadium on Friday nights sometimes. \*\* Where, Nemo’s, or the Lager House? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![tramp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4491bb/32.png) [@tramp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tramp)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/90 "2003-05-13T13:28:56Z")
Another vote here for Allentown. I was born in Allentown in 1980 and I still have family there and it is such a sad place to visit. I live near DC now and I think Allentown is so much more depressing than DC. Ugh. My mom grew up in Wilkes-Barre and they used to drive into the “big city” of Allentown to go to all the nice stores. No more. Wilkes-Barre is a craphole too but it was never as nice as Allentown. ---
**Author:** ![5-HT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/5/f19dbf/32.png) [@5-HT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/5-HT)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/91 "2003-05-13T14:53:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by blanx \* > \*\*Where, Nemo’s, or the Lager House? 😃 \*\* Actually, the Works and Corktown Tavern on Michigan Ave. ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/92 "2003-05-13T15:37:54Z")
I thought [this list](http://www.forbes.com/lists/results.jhtml?passListId=1&passYear=2003&passListType=Misc&searchParameter1=unset&searchParameter2=unset&resultsStart=1&resultsHowMany=25&resultsSortProperties=%2Bnumberfield1%2C%2Bstringfield1&resultsSortCategoryName=Rank&category1=category&category2=category&passKeyword=) of the “Best Places to do Business in 2003” might be of some import to this discussion. Forbes Magazine ranked the largest 150 metropolitan areas in the US in a number of business categories, including “Cost of Doing Business,” “Job Growth,” and “Educational Attainment.” Of the cities mentioned in this thread which appear in the survey: 1. Oakland, CA 2. Hartford, CT 3. Philadelphia, PA (the MSA includes Camden, NJ) 4. Allentown, PA 5. Baltimore, MD 6. Buffalo, NY (the MSA includes Niagara Falls) 7. Jersey City, NJ 8. Detroit, MI 150 (dead friggin’ last). **Flint, MI** Though I’d still argue that Niagara Falls, NY takes some beating, I think we can hereby declare Flint to be the “winner” here. ---
**Author:** ![blanx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f04885/32.png) [@blanx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blanx)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/93 "2003-05-13T15:58:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by 5-HT \* > \*\*Actually, the Works and Corktown Tavern on Michigan Ave. \*\* Ah yes… been there. What about Nancy Whiskey’s, on the other side of the Freeway? ---
**Author:** ![5-HT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/5/f19dbf/32.png) [@5-HT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/5-HT)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/94 "2003-05-13T16:19:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by blanx \* > \*\*Ah yes… been there. What about Nancy Whiskey’s, on the other side of the Freeway? \*\* never been there. I mostly go wherever there’s techno playing. The Works, corktown, Foran’s, the shelter, Carbon Lounge(ok that ones in hamtramck). ---
**Author:** ![CrankyAsAnOldMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crankyasanoldman/32/11670_2.png) [@CrankyAsAnOldMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrankyAsAnOldMan)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/95 "2003-05-13T17:36:09Z")
Allentown has Lehigh, though. Doesn’t that redeem it somewhat, and mean that it will always have some life to it? For my money, a dead city is one that no one goes to by choice. More specifically, a place where (a) no one wants to go to for a job and (b) no one would go to on vacation. DC is out on both counts. Where I went to school, DC was a huge destination for people after graduation. Yeah, a lot of people lived (and worked) in Nova but not all. Plus hundreds of thousands of people go there for pleasure every year! I’m headed there this weekend. Baltimore is also knocked out for (b). The Inner Harbor is a legitimate vacation destination. Nobody in their right mind would go to Detroit on vacation. Same with Akron. And Newark. ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/96 "2003-05-13T17:40:48Z")
I went to Detroit on vacation. Stayed at the Allen Park Motor Lodge. ---
**Author:** ![blanx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f04885/32.png) [@blanx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blanx)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/97 "2003-05-13T17:45:18Z")
Vacation in Detroit! Come for the squalor, stay for the street drugs! ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/98 "2003-05-13T17:47:18Z")
Regarding Flint, MI-remember that very funny (though inaccurate) movie by Micheal Myer “ROGER AND ME”? The part about Flint was hilarious-Flint actually paid to have a movie made, touiting the city as a vacation destination! Who would ever go to such a place for vaction? ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/99 "2003-05-13T18:04:03Z")
Here’s one candidate: **New Orleans**. In the last 50 years, I believe its population has dropped sharply, its economy has declined, and crime there is way up (even with the general decrease in crime nationally over the last ten years). Granted, it still is a tourist destination so it might be exempt under Cranky’s “vacation spot” exception. ---
**Author:** ![tramp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4491bb/32.png) [@tramp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tramp)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664/100 "2003-05-13T18:36:26Z")
Lehigh University does not redeem Allentown in an shape or fashion. Allentown is a steaming pile of crap these days and it is so sad for my parents to look upon it with eyes that saw the city in its glory days. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-u-s-city-has-had-the-worst-decline/173664.md?page=6)