# What was the deal with Star Trek Nemesis? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 18, 2003, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835 "2003-11-18T03:35:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Call\_me\_Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/90ced4/32.png) [@Call\_me\_Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Call_me_Frank)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2003, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/1 "2003-11-18T03:35:22Z")
Alright, I’m an avowed Star Trek TNG fan, and I have all the movies either on DVD or VHS. But what was the deal with Nemesis? I don’t want to spoil it for anyone, but I would be extremely saddened if that’s how the TNG movies end, because ST VI was such a great ending for the TOS movies. I guess I just want to hear other people’s commiserations, but if you loved the movie and want to say why, I’d like to know. ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2003, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/2 "2003-11-18T04:25:28Z")
**Moderator’s note:** Hi and welcome, **Frank**. Since this is asking opinions of arty-type stuff it would fit better into the **Cafe Society** forum. That’s the hangout for fans of Buffy, Trek, LoTR, the Matrix, Shakespeare and once in while even Madonna. You know, the arts: major, minor and the hopelessly off-tune. I’ll move it on over for you. TVeblen, for the SDMB ---
**Author:** ![Tradnor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/cab0a1/32.png) [@Tradnor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tradnor)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2003, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/3 "2003-11-18T04:31:55Z")
Eh, I didn’t really care for any of the TNG movies. Some were better than others, but none of them were great in the way ST II or VI were. I’m disappointed with the current ending, but it doesn’t matter to me whether they make another TNG movie, because with the current people at the helm of the franchise it would just be more of the same. There’s no chance for a “great ending”, any more than there’s a chance _Enterprise_ will ever become a great series. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/4 "2003-11-19T03:45:25Z")
I agree that this would be a bad ending for TNG. They need to make a movie that ends with the Enterprise-E being destroyed, and the crew being broken up. Similar to the way ST VI ended. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/5 "2003-11-19T03:50:04Z")
TNG’s played out. I want a DS9 movie! Something about the Dominion getting antsy again. That would be cool. As long as they find a good way to bring Jadzia back. And get her naked. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/6 "2003-11-19T03:51:25Z")
A Doctor Who / DS-9 / Firefly crossover! ---
**Author:** ![captainQwark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e68b1a/32.png) [@captainQwark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/captainQwark)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/7 "2003-11-19T06:13:27Z")
that Picard clone reminded me too much of Dr. Evil. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/8 "2003-11-19T11:22:42Z")
Yeah a DS9 movie, Odo’s back and this time he’s kickin’ ass with a gazillion Jem’adar. Turns out that Odo was always on the founders side, but was just REALLY deep undercover 🙂 as a side plot Bashiirs genetic manipulation makes a turn for the worse and he starts evolving into all kinds of werid stuff 😉 ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/9 "2003-11-19T12:15:09Z")
I didn’t see it myself, but… > [@](#): > > [http://www.stardestroyer.net/Nemesis/Pictorial.html](http://www.stardestroyer.net/Nemesis/Pictorial.html) ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/10 "2003-11-19T12:57:15Z")
The problem with a DS9 movie is that the characters were dispersed at the end of the series. Odo and Garak went back to their homeworlds, apparently permanently. Worf is back on the Enterprise. Sisko is some kind of spirit or energy being or something (try explaining _that_ within the constraints of a 2 hour movie). The commander of DS9 would be Super-Bitch, errrr, Kira. Maybe we could have a plot where Kira is an oppressive tyrant of a commander, and is secretly involved in some sort of illegal activity. Quark, O’Brien, Bashir, and that last Dax girl (what was her name?) have to work together to stop her. ---
**Author:** ![Gorgon\_Heap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f475e1/32.png) [@Gorgon\_Heap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorgon_Heap)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/11 "2003-11-19T13:15:17Z")
I put all of the TNG movies below Star Trek V. Sorry, but they just seemed like lame, long episodes with more expensive special effects to make up for lack of plot and character development. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/12 "2003-11-19T13:18:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diceman \* > \*\*Worf is back on the Enterprise. \*\* Wasn’t Worf the new Federation Ambassador to the Klingon Empire? p.s. Ezri Dax ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/13 "2003-11-19T13:23:02Z")
Worf is the Federation’s Ambassador to Q’onos and Sisko said he would be back at some point. The most problematic character to bring back would be Odo. ---
**Author:** ![SirRay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@SirRay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SirRay)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/14 "2003-11-19T14:42:23Z")
I’ve read a few of the post-Dominion war DS9 novels (set after Sisko disappears, Jake disappears trying to find him, and Odo, Garak, Worf, etc. are stationed elsewhere). Actually the novels were not too bad, considering a.) Some of the more interesting characters were missing b.) Latter-day Star Trek novels usually stink, just on principal One thing they did do was station a very seasoned (\> 100 year old) Captain (Vaugh?) with an interesting-enough crew at DS9. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/15 "2003-11-19T14:46:08Z")
Vaughn’s only a commander but due to his history (black ops), has considerable pull. He _is_ the acting Captain of the Defiant though. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/16 "2003-11-19T19:56:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diceman \* > \*\* Sisko is some kind of spirit or energy being or something (try explaining _that_ within the constraints of a 2 hour movie). \*\* Deux e machina (sp) and the reason entire 🙂 The Founders restore his humanity and send him back to save the Federation in its most deadly peril. He would gather the dispersed crew and hurry to the rescue, be it to resurrect Kirk, kill Wesley or make sure that Archer’s parents never meet. Well, OK, save the Federation and the Worm Hole Aliens from a Founder and or Romulan plot. ---
**Author:** ![drewcosten](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@drewcosten](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewcosten)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2003, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/17 "2003-11-19T22:45:57Z")
\*\*\* SPOILERS FOR DS9 RELAUNCH \*\*\* We’ve already pretty much finished off season 8 of DS9 with the relaunch series of novels that I understand are considered canon (though I could be mistaken), starting with “Avatar part 1” (or possibly with “A Stitch in Time”) ending with the new novel “Unity”. And yes. the return of Ben Sisko was pretty much a “Deus ex machina”, but the rest of the novel was amazing. I do enjoy the new (and old) characters in the relaunch. For those of you who haven’t read them but are curious we’ve got the new first officer, the human Commander Elias Vaughn who is over 100 years old and has been estranged from his daughter Prynn Tenmei who happens to be the new pilot of the Defiant (and who we don’t know much about at all besides the reason she doesn’t speak to her father). There’s our new chief of security, Lieutenant Ro Laren who has rejoined the Bajoran militia after being pardoned for her Maquis activity thanks to the part the Maquis played in the Dominion war. There’s (human) Lieutenant Sam Bowers the new tactical and communications officer of whom we know next to nothing about. Nog has replaced Chief O’Brien as chief of operations after a brief stint as chief of security before Ro showed up. We have chief science officer Ensign Thurishar ch’Thane (I think, Shar for short), an Andorian who’s mother is a Federation ambassador. And there is a Jem’Hadar “ambassador”, Taran’atar, sent by Odo to learn about the ways of the Alpha Quadrant. Also interesting is new side character Gul Macet, a cousin of the late Gul Dukat, who may or may not be evil. I’ve left out a couple new side characters but I don’t want to give too much away (not like I haven’t already). 🙂 So read the relaunch novels, they are worth it. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2003, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/18 "2003-11-20T12:36:12Z")
Worf was back on the Enterprise in _Nemesis_, so I guess we can assume that his ambassador stint didn’t work out. (How did the most un-diplomatic guy in Starfleet become an ambassador anyways?) I always thought he was out of place on DS9 anyways. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2003, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/19 "2003-11-20T13:09:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diceman \* > \*\*Worf was back on the Enterprise in _Nemesis_, so I guess we can assume that his ambassador stint didn’t work out. (How did the most un-diplomatic guy in Starfleet become an ambassador anyways?) I always thought he was out of place on DS9 anyways. \*\* well he was fairly well placed to become the ambassador to the Klingons, him being the adopted brother of the Chancellor and all, as to him being on Enterprise for Nemesis, they probably had some lame plot device to get him there, same as when they had to pick him up off of the Defiant ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2003, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835/20 "2003-11-20T14:21:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by drewcosten \* > \*\* > We’ve already pretty much finished off season 8 of DS9 with the relaunch series of novels that I understand are considered canon (though I could be mistaken)… Lieutenant Ro Laren \*\* I thought her death with all the other Maquis was canon. ☹ [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-the-deal-with-star-trek-nemesis/213835.md?page=2)