# What was wrong with "The Postman"? (spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 9, 2006, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158 "2006-01-09T15:31:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Dunderman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecb155/32.png) [@Dunderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dunderman)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/1 "2006-01-09T15:31:49Z")
I just watched _The Postman_ for the first time. Hey, I had an afternoon to spare and felt like watching something dumb, and given the movie’s reputation as a truly truly shitty movie I thought I was in for a treat. But you know what? I liked it. Sure, virtually no-one in the movie could act worth beans. The ending was almost as formulaic as they come. And yes, there was a lot of flagwaving and unabashed patriotism which I’m usually allergic to (I can’t watch _Independence Day_ without gagging, for example), but it was pretty inoffensive in this movie. Appropriate, even. At times, almost beautiful. So why does this movie have such a bad reputation? It wasn’t any dumber than any other movie, it didn’t have any huge plot holes I could spot, there was no deus ex machina or anything… I’m worried, because this is the second panned Kevin Costner movie that I like (the first being _Dragonfly_, but truth be told I can watch _Waterworld_ without feeling like I’m wasting time), and I don’t even consciously like the guy. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/2 "2006-01-09T15:42:48Z")
Dunno; I thought it was a reasonably good movie; as a post-apocalyptic offering, better than Mad Max (although that may not be saying much). I thought it could have been better with someone other than Costner in the lead though; the character he plays in _The Postman_ could be swtiched unnoticeably with the one in _Waterworld_, or, for that matter, _The Bodyguard_ and _Message In A Bottle_ and doubtless a handful of movies I can’t remember or have never watched. For that matter, can someone suggest a movie where his character _isn’t_ a detached (or borderline sociopath), deadpan, self-interested, wannabe strong-silent-type? I want to see a range of facial expressions beyond _supercilious glare_ and _offended pout_ (which, to be honest, aren’t all that different from each other when he does them). ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/3 "2006-01-09T15:57:23Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > For that matter, can someone suggest a movie where his character _isn’t_ a detached (or borderline sociopath), deadpan, self-interested, wannabe strong-silent-type? I want to see a range of facial expressions beyond _supercilious glare_ and _offended pout_ (which, to be honest, aren’t all that different from each other when he does them). Well, he played that one character _best_ in **Bull Durham** , one of my favorite movies. Really, I don’t like the movie of **The Postman** because I really liked the book. ---
**Author:** ![FatBaldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecd19e/32.png) [@FatBaldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FatBaldGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/4 "2006-01-09T16:10:08Z")
My complaint with Kevin Costner’s movies in general is that he doesn’t know how to edit. If he shoots a scene, it goes into the movie. The end result is that a one hour story is told in 2 1/2 to 3 hours. I know, I’m over-generalizing and exaggerating, but that’s how I feel watching his movies. ---
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/5 "2006-01-09T16:37:15Z")
“you give out hope like it was candy in your pocket” Sure reads pretty until yousay it out loud… Bad dialogue… bad bad dialogue. It is slow, Which normally I don’t mind as long as there is a reason for it. Here there no reason for the terrible pacing. Normally Costner has the charisma of a chunk of wood, here he is a post appocalyptic chunck of wood, with a creamy cheeze filling. Oh there is more, but that would require me reliving those two plus hours again, and I swore I’d never do that again. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/6 "2006-01-09T16:47:33Z")
Perhaps we should have a thread about how we’d edit movies; what’s the shortest time any of you think you could edit _The Postman_ down into, using existing footage and preserving all of the important elements (and don’t just say there aren’t any). ---
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/7 "2006-01-09T16:53:15Z")
Now that is an interesting experiment… I’d almost be tempted to take that one up… even if it means having to watch the damned thing again. too bad that may be against copywrite laws so I guess I couldn’t do that. Or could I? It does give me an Idea though… hmmmm (to be continued on another thread later) ---
**Author:** ![Malodorous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e47774/32.png) [@Malodorous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malodorous)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/8 "2006-01-09T16:59:25Z")
Tom Petty playing himself as a post-apocalyptic Tom Petty was simulataneously awesome a idiotic. I saw the movie on TV on a lazy afternoon while I was doing housework, and really liked it. I think it plays well in that kind of setting, where you got no place to be so that the pacing doesn’t bother you (and on TV, with commercials, it goes on like 5hrs). I like it, but if I had 10$ to see it in a theater I think I might have a problem with it. 'course I saw Waterworld in theaters, and liked that, so who knows. ---
**Author:** ![Balduran](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cc9497/32.png) [@Balduran](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balduran)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/9 "2006-01-09T17:49:55Z")
> [@kingpengvin](#): > > “you give out hope like it was candy in your pocket” Heh, saw an interview with Costner where he said it was because of lines like these that the movie is so long. He couldn’t bear to cut any of them out because they are so good. I saw both the Postman and Waterworld on video and found them enjoyable enough. I don’t think I’d like them as much in a theater where you couldn’t just stop the film and have a break or have it on in the background while you do something else. ---
**Author:** ![ArrMatey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/arrmatey/32/3522_2.png) [@ArrMatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArrMatey)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/10 "2006-01-09T18:52:40Z")
Heh. Honestly, I thought the movie was okay. nothing to write home about. Then my friend lent me the book. The book is amazing, especially if you put yourself in the soon-apocalypse mindset of the 80’s. It’s good stuff, I highly recommend it, and, well, it’s not -that- much like the movie, except the ‘basic’ plot. As for the climax of the book, The battle with Powhatan finally revealing the difference between his ‘strength’ and his opponent’s made me quite literally sit up in bed and cheer! ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/11 "2006-01-09T19:21:01Z")
> [@kingpengvin](#): > > “you give out hope like it was candy in your pocket” I don’t think the problem is that line. It’s the way she says it. She says it more wistfully than cutting. At that point isn’t she trying to shame him into coming out of hiding? In my head I always hear her say “asshole” after that line. Makes it much better. I really like the Postman. Except for the epilogue which is atrocious. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/12 "2006-01-09T22:13:49Z")
I liked it. Not one of my favorite movies or anything, but certainly not worthy of the contempt it engenders in some people. It was an entertaining movie. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/13 "2006-01-09T22:37:49Z")
To the OP: the one part of the movie that irked me was the really long sex scene, which smacked of an indulgent director/star. I don’t mind the pacing, & I saw it in the theater. Don’t people check running times? Do y’all go to movies when you have somewhere to be in two hours? When I watch a movie, I’m still in its world for longer than the movie ran anyway. So, ymmv. I thought the Postman was great. I doubt whether it’s the “patriotism”–I usually say I don’t have a patriotic bone in my body. It’s the stuff like rewriting the postman’s oath, & Ford’s ambition to drive cars (& how that’s presented), & the lies about a reconstituted US giving rise to a reconstituted US (I’m getting chills writing this), & Tom Petty, natch… The general rural quality of the setting is great. It’s such a western US movie, I always figured it was easterners & urbanites who didn’t like it (& hey, they are all dead at the beginning, so I guess that makes sense). Of course we never learn the lead character’s original name, & he’s a slacker, supposed to be born the same year as I was, so I identify with him. And finally, the movie is great because of what it’s thematically about: the basis of law & authority in society. Is government primarily about an army to oppress, or an infrastructure to serve? I can excuse an awful lot of flaws in a movie about great themes. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/14 "2006-01-09T23:04:45Z")
I liked the movie overall. There was a lot of stuff from the book that wasn’t in the movie, but then, there was a lot of stuff in the book that was kinda stupid too. That said, there were some very cool elements from the books that cut out (like the entire war between the RUSA and the Survivalist army, which I guess might not fit in the movie very well) The bit about the guy from the Republic of California was kinda hammy in the movie (in the book, the Californian guy didn’t know about the Postman and the RUSA until he met them in the jail cell, IIRC). The cool ex-Marine dude was totally absent, as were the supersoldiers and the supercomputer with all the scientists. Oh, and a guy riding a horse while shooting at bad guys with a semiautomatic pistol will never not look cool. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2006, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/15 "2006-01-09T23:31:58Z")
> [@Priceguy](#): > > And yes, there was a lot of flagwaving and unabashed patriotism which I’m usually allergic to (I can’t watch _Independence Day_ without gagging, for example), but it was pretty inoffensive in this movie. Appropriate, even. At times, almost beautiful. Actually this was one movie where US patriotism in American-sized doses did _not_ come over as nauseating to me as a foreigner, because the aspiration voiced clearly wasn’t nationalistic but rather a yearning to rebuild civilization, part of which would be to become a country again. The scene where the young girl on the stockade begins to sing “America the Beautiful” is something that worked very well in that respect IMO - it touched me as an expression of that aspiration. I like the movie because it is pro-civilization (having mail carriers rather than soldiers as its heroes). Being strongly pro-civilization myself I think people like mail carriers should be our heroes more often. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2006, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/16 "2006-01-10T03:04:02Z")
I thought the climactic fight on the field was… weird. And crap. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2006, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/17 "2006-01-10T03:09:43Z")
I loved the book and the movie was very disappointing. More, it was one of the few Sci-Fi books my wife has read and enjoyed and the idea of sharing this movie with her was something I was looking forward to. It is a great book and a supremely disappointing movie. Jim ---
**Author:** ![SkeptiJess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@SkeptiJess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkeptiJess)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2006, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/18 "2006-01-10T03:22:40Z")
I liked it too. It was patriotic, but I have no problem with that – I’m pretty patriotic, myself. More than patriotic, though, it was generally optimistic about humankind – that, even brought to our lowest point, we will rebuild civilization, blah, blah, blah. I like an apocolypse story with hope. And I think Kevin Costner is cute. Well, _was_ cute. Judging from _The Upside of Anger_, he isn’t aging all that well. ---
**Author:** ![SkeptiJess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@SkeptiJess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkeptiJess)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2006, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/19 "2006-01-10T03:23:56Z")
Forgot to say – I haven’t read the book. I don’t read much science fiction. Who wrote it? ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2006, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158/20 "2006-01-10T03:33:45Z")
While it wasn’t the best movie I’ve ever seen, it wasn’t the worst. In the scene where he finds the lighter and lights it, I had to laugh, as would anyone who has ever owned a Zippo. Retaining enough naptha to light is measured in weeks, not months or years. 😃 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-was-wrong-with-the-postman-spoilers/339158.md?page=2)