# What were you THINKING? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 13, 2023, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532 "2023-10-13T19:36:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 208
**Author:** ![FluffyBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecb155/32.png) [@FluffyBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FluffyBob)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2025, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4440 "2025-03-28T22:04:07Z")
I get it For me subtitles are painless. I hear the actor’s voice and emotion, and my brain fills it in with the subtitles. I rather hear the original acting than some out of place voice dubbing. Not everyone is like that though, my wife really struggles with subtitles. Strangely, I am the visual one, she is much more verbal / literal thinker and usually much more capable than me when it comes to multitasking. Brains are weird. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2025, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4441 "2025-03-28T22:04:17Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > As weird as you think it would have been, I promise you, it was actually much weirder. You sent me stumbling down a ten minute rabbit hole and I ran across this [1997 article](https://www.spokesman.com/stories/1997/jul/20/hogans-heroes-a-hit-in-germany-creative-dubbing/). Apparently creative dubbing/editing that eased the war angle into a more absurdist farce (clearly still Nazis, but not ones who yelled “Heil Hitler!”) caused it take off in popularity. Very weird, indeed. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2025, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4442 "2025-03-28T22:15:10Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > I’m just unimpressed by the phonetic violence done to an Italo-Arabic word by the katakana, changing [g] to [dʑ]. And @LSLGuy , I’m not defending them, but It looks the studio was founded in 1985 and I’m not surprised that Italian phonetic rules weren’t understood or were ignored back then. This isn’t the worst case of “phonetic violence”. Harakiri and karaoke are at least as bad. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2025, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4443 "2025-03-28T22:41:14Z")
Yeah. I wasn’t meaning at all to call you out. There’s a reason the Japanese did it the way they did when they did it. Which might have been ignorance or might have been well-founded. But whatever it is, It’s their company and they can pronounce it however they want. Even like “luxury yacht”. 😉 It is interesting to me how much countries all over the world used to ignorantly and happily butcher words and place names and such imported from other languages. I recall Margaret Thatcher taking great satisfaction in pronouncing “Argentine Junta” with a long “i” in “Argentine” and an English “j” in “junta”. Then, say 1980s to 2010s, there was a counter-movement to move closer (at least some) to how the natives pronounce their words. When e.g. India wanted “Bombay” to become “Mumbai”, everybody went along happily enough. I expect that sensible idea is being actively slaughtered by the forces of nationalistic know-nothing anti-“woke” all over our benighted globe these days. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2025, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4444 "2025-03-28T22:54:06Z")
Like Denali? ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2025, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4445 "2025-03-28T23:28:28Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > _Spirited Away_ is Ghibli’s and Miyazaki’s masterpiece and one of the best animated films ever made. I’d start with it. If someone is sampling anime in general and Miyazaki/Ghibli in particular I recommend [_Porco Rosso_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porco_Rosso). It has a more linear plot like western audiences are accustomed to and a fantastical element without being all weird or needing to know Japanese mythology. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4446 "2025-03-29T00:18:12Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Just imagine watching a classic like _Das Boot_ dubbed in English! 😲 Ehh, I don’t have to imagine. I believe the first time I saw the 3 1/2 hour director’s edit, it was the dubbed version. It works very well, since most of the actors speak English as well, so they dubbed their own parts. On top of that, the languages aren’t _that_ different in structure and words, so most of the mouth movements are closer than they are when you dub over wildly different languages. I prefer a well done dub because I’m not focusing on the bottom third of the screen in order to read. So I can pay attention to the cinematography and the actor’s faces. ETA: One can watch that version over at the Internet Archive for free if you want to try it out yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4447 "2025-03-29T00:26:08Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > I expect that sensible idea is being actively slaughtered by the forces of nationalistic know-nothing anti-“woke” all over our benighted globe these days. Names of a person should follow that person’s preferences, but places and things don’t have preferences. Living at a place doesn’t give a person authority to override someone else’s native language. For example, the city in Italy called “Firenze” by locals is called “Florence” in English. The place names are cognate, both from Latin “Flōrentia”. The place name is different in English than Italian, because they’re different languages. So while some people are fine with ignoring cultures other than their own, other people are respectful of other cultures. And sometimes that means letting people use their own languages. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4448 "2025-03-29T00:55:38Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > Apropos of not very much, a few weeks after we first moved to Europe, I was flipping channels and stumbled on an old rerun of “Hogan’s Heroes”… _dubbed into German._ Did the “Americans” speak German with an American accent? ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4449 "2025-03-29T00:55:45Z")
ETA: @Pleonast two posts up. Good example. I suppose as an American I’d say “Florence” and pronounce that word as an American would. If I had reason to say “Firenze” (perhaps it’s in the name of the hotel I’m staying at), I’d like to say that word in the way the hotel owners, presumably Italians, would say it. Which is probably not “fye-RENZ” which would be a literal American pronunciation of that string of letters. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4450 "2025-03-29T00:57:39Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > > [@Cervaise](#): > > > > Apropos of not very much, a few weeks after we first moved to Europe, I was flipping channels and stumbled on an old rerun of “Hogan’s Heroes”… _dubbed into German._ > > Did the “Americans” speak German with an American accent? Damn I bet that was funny. Do tell about who spoke which languages with what good and bad accents. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4451 "2025-03-29T01:10:26Z")
[![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/SoXI4w2r5AQ/maxresdefault.jpg "Hogan's Heroes Best of S3E25 German Dub English Sub") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SoXI4w2r5AQ) ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4452 "2025-03-29T01:11:01Z")
Check it out for yourself here. This is sort of a clip sampler, not an actual episode, so it’s pretty choppy, but it gives you the flavor. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/G8oeH-Q621Y/maxresdefault.jpg "Hogan's Heroes Best Of S2E07 German Dub English Subs") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8oeH-Q621Y) The Americans don’t speak “Americanized” German to indicate their Americanness. Their German is pretty standard. But that contrasts with some of the Nazis, who speak in regional dialects that are perceived as comical stereotypes (not “hillbilly,” exactly, but sort of the equivalent effect). Also note that the jokes have been rewritten for additional absurdity and scatological profanity. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4453 "2025-03-29T01:43:45Z")
_Married With Children_ is apparently much funnier [in the original German](https://www.csmonitor.com/1993/0324/24142.html). ---
**Author:** ![peccavi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peccavi/32/388_2.png) [@peccavi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peccavi)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4454 "2025-03-29T02:16:29Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I like watching these movies in Japanese (with subs) because, well, they’re Japanese movies. Many of them are set in Japan, and even those that aren’t, the characters and stories are distinctly Japanese. Hearing the people in them speak American English just doesn’t feel right. When the anime _Look Back_ (on my list of the best movies of 2024) was released in the U.S., it had a 15(ish) minute interview with the director and the two main voice actors. Watching this featurette reminded me how much of voice acting is a performance, requiring specific acting skill and technique. If I watch a dubbed animated film, I’m aware that I’m watching different performances than the subtitled original. For me, this makes a difference. _Look Back_ is available on YouTube, but I can’t find the interview segment anywhere in the net, so I can’t link to it. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4455 "2025-03-29T04:37:43Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > > [@Alessan](#): > > > > _Spirited Away_ is Ghibli’s and Miyazaki’s masterpiece and one of the best animated films ever made. I’d start with it. > > If someone is sampling anime in general and Miyazaki/Ghibli in particular I recommend [_Porco Rosso_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porco_Rosso). It has a more linear plot like western audiences are accustomed to and a fantastical element without being all weird or needing to know Japanese mythology. Whereas the things i loved most about stories away was the introduction to Japanese mythology. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4456 "2025-03-29T04:52:03Z")
> [@scabpicker](#): > > > [@wolfpup](#): > > > > Just imagine watching a classic like _Das Boot_ dubbed in English! 😲 > > Ehh, I don’t have to imagine. I believe the first time I saw the 3 1/2 hour director’s edit, it was the dubbed version. It works very well, since most of the actors speak English as well, so they dubbed their own parts. I think I read something about that, and though it may make a difference from the typical shit dubbing of most movies, it still didn’t work for me. I saw a small portion of that film with English dubbing and couldn’t stand it. It’s a great movie and the dubbing just ruins it, IMHO. The only version ever I’ve watched – and I think I’ve watched it at least twice – is the original German with English subtitles. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4457 "2025-03-29T05:22:01Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > The only version ever I’ve watched – and I think I’ve watched it at least twice – is the original German with English subtitles. Heheh, I’ve watched it so many times in all it’s incarnations that an accurate number would be difficult to come by (I watched the aforementioned English dub on an impulse tonight). In fact, I’ve watched the whole miniseries. IMHO, the chaos of the most dire moments for the sub are better communicated by the dub than subtitles. The simultaneous cross-talk of everyone exclaiming the problems that are occurring and the orders being given are easier to perceive. I haven’t checked, but I’d guess that a bunch of it is simply omitted in the subtitled version. Fun fact: even the German version is a dub. Due to the fact that the gyros in the camera system used to film in the cramped confines of the reproduction sub made too much noise, all of the audio in any version is completely dubbed later. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4458 "2025-03-29T11:34:07Z")
> [@FluffyBob](#): > > Not everyone is like that though, my wife really struggles with subtitles. Strangely, I am the visual one, she is much more verbal / literal thinker and usually much more capable than me when it comes to multitasking. Brains are weird. Interesting. I’m sort of like that. When a show has strong/unfamiliar accents (e.g., Great British Baking Show), my wife prefers to have the subtitles on. For me, if there are words on the screen, I can’t help but hyperfocus on reading the words, since I’m more verbal than visual. As a result, I miss a lot of the visual information, and prefer to have the subtitles off except when they’re absolutely necessary. It may be that precisely _because_ your wife (and I) are more verbal, it takes us more effort to focus on the visual, and subtitles make it harder to maintain that focus. A more visual person may be able to flick back and forth between the words and the image more easily. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2025, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/4459 "2025-03-29T18:55:11Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > It may be that precisely _because_ your wife (and I) are more verbal, it takes us more effort to focus on the visual, and subtitles make it harder to maintain that focus. That’s another big problem I have, and that’s something I was alluding to before when I talked about missing dialog when I’m looking away for a moment (or as you say if you’re paying attention to the visuals). It’s worse if there’s a tiny bit of dialog that’s gone in seconds. Depends on how they do the subtitles. I read very fast, and I still can miss dialog. I won’t refuse subtitled stuff, I watch it, but it can be stressful which is not conducive to being entertained. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532.md?page=207) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532.md?page=209)