# What were you THINKING? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 13, 2023, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532 "2023-10-13T19:36:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 273
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5743 "2025-10-19T03:32:47Z")
Well, just one job, it seems. And, ironically, with a lot of bullshit and not much ROI to it: > [@Four years at my job - time to ponder my next career move](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/four-years-at-my-job-time-to-ponder-my-next-career-move/1019070/28): > > First I spent 6 months on “the bench” where I would get staffed to a client but then they would cancel the contract for budget reasons before I could start. Not my fault at all, but my numbers still suck for the year so no raise or bonus. > > Then the past year I spent months on a crappy toxic client with a crappy empty suit of a manager and got my first ever shitty performance review at this firm. Then I rolled onto a project that was much better that was supposed to last a year or more. But then the client fired our firm for cost reasons. So no raise or bonus this year. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5744 "2025-10-19T04:08:42Z")
> [@ASL\_v2.0](#): > > Then I guess I’d better not tell him I went to a top law school only to take a job in legal aid (where we live and die by grants and our compliance to them, as an essential precursor to doing real good for real people). I find it very satisfying… I think it blows some people’s mind that you can be highly ambitious and yet not really interested in making a ton of money. I went to the schools i did because I wanted to be the best of the best, and fuck it, I am. I think after fifteen years in the industry I’m allowed to say that. I climbed the career ladder just like anyone else. The main difference is I had to put up with a lot fewer assholes. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5745 "2025-10-19T04:30:13Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > He’s suffering. If previous posts are any indication he’s struggling for a sense of meaning in his life. A lot of people are right now. He makes comments like that pretty regularly about me, my life choices, my education, my marriage, etc because, and this is just my WAG, I don’t fit with his idea of the way the world is supposed to work. You’ve admirably shown him far more grace than I would have have been able to. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5746 "2025-10-19T04:41:52Z")
I think I’m in a really good mood because of the protest. My first in 17 years! I shoulda been out there more often. But now I know. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5747 "2025-10-19T15:59:53Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I think it blows some people’s mind that you can be highly ambitious and yet not really interested in making a ton of money. Yeah? If you’re so smart why ain’t you rich? 🙃 ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5748 "2025-10-19T16:01:30Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > He’s suffering. If previous posts are any indication he’s struggling for a sense of meaning in his life. A lot of people are right now. He makes comments like that pretty regularly about me, my life choices, my education, my marriage, etc because, and this is just my WAG, I don’t fit with his idea of the way the world is supposed to work. You’re supposed to get an elite education, get a high paying job and make money and be “successful” and ironically that’s what we’ve been talking about so much in that thread, the fundamental lie that status as defined by some corporate worldview equates to happiness. > > My unremarkable little life is overflowing with meaning and I think that’s hard for him. I think it’s especially hard because I _did_ get the fancy education and then deviated from the path “successful” people are supposed to take. I’m not maximizing my earning potential but I’m somehow, against all odds, happy. I think he feels like I cheated! > > But I’m not inside his head. Just a guess. > > My whole point in saying the admin part of my job seems like bullshit was to explain that bullshit is in the eye of the beholder. Admin is not bullshit work if you find meaning in it. _Nothing_ is bullshit work if you find meaning in it. My comments are not meant to criticize your life choices or offend. But yes, they often seem very different from my own experiences on how the world works so maybe my questions or comments can be a bit more probing or challenging than intended. In all fairness, my job is literally the exact opposite of yours - building pretty Powerpoint decks to help investment banks build systems so their wealthy clients can become even wealthier. The other thread is probably a better venue to discuss but meaning and purpose is one thing. Perhaps more importantly there is the practical need for a job so I can pay my bills. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5749 "2025-10-19T16:23:29Z")
My BIL was some kind of management something or other for several years. He had the MBA and everything. But he was not terribly good at that. He eventually switched to becoming an HVAC technician. It is not the kind of job where you get to fly business class or get wined and dined, but it pays reasonably well, there’s a lot of demand, and you know that you have actually helped another human being when you repair their heat or AC. He’s just retired, but he was much happier as an HVAC technician than he had been in corporate America. (I don’t think he was super-good at that, either, truth be told. But he was competent. And competent tradesmen are valuable and appreciated.) ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5750 "2025-10-19T16:26:50Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > If you’re so smart why ain’t you rich? Because of the idiots. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5751 "2025-10-19T16:27:34Z")
> [@Mighty\_Mouse](#): > > What a fucking, self-absorbed, assholish thing to say. > > Helping women and children who are abused has no ROI to a sociopath, I suppose. That’s because you’re taking one comment out of context of a much larger conversation across a couple different threads, you dummy. The point I was trying to make was that most of us have these administrative, managerial, paper-pushing jobs that tend to be abstracted from the end results. That’s what I meant by “bullshit”. But the work becomes meaningful to us because they fulfill some need and contributes to the end results. @Spice_Weasel is part of a complicated process where her contribution probably lets her help more people than if she were directly working in a battered women’s shelter. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5752 "2025-10-19T16:30:02Z")
That’s all well and fair. Maybe what works for me and has helped me won’t work for you, and I get that. I really just wish I could help you. And you know, I’m not claiming to be without problems or concerns. My boy is struggling in school right now. And I’m working on a grant we aren’t going to get because the people around me didn’t move their asses fast enough to get the supporting documentation needed to make it a compelling application. Sometimes I have to turn in shit knowing that it’s shit just because someone told me to. I think everyone’s job has some of that. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5753 "2025-10-19T19:20:00Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > That’s because you’re taking one comment out of context of a much larger conversation across a couple different threads, you dummy. I have read dozens of your posts across many threads and your monomaniacal self absorption is just staggering. I’m comfortable calling you a narrow-minded asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5754 "2025-10-19T19:35:16Z")
I propose a new forum where mods can move topics unsuited to IMHO, GD, P&E, etc., titled “My Heart is a Wounded Fawn in the Forest.” Guaranteed to be chock full o’ threads. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5755 "2025-10-19T19:51:35Z")
> [@Mighty\_Mouse](#): > > I have read dozens of your posts across many threads and your monomaniacal self absorption is just staggering. > > I’m comfortable calling you a narrow-minded asshole. I guess if that makes you feel like a big man go knock yourself out. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5756 "2025-10-19T20:10:52Z")
> [@Slithy\_Tove](#): > > I propose a new forum where mods can move topics unsuited to IMHO, GD, P&E, etc., titled “My Heart is a Wounded Fawn in the Forest.” > > Guaranteed to be chock full o’ threads. I get it’s a joke, but please no. I can’t imagine moderating it. Really. Seriously, the balance and nuance to moderate the Pit is more than I would ever be able to manage. Miller’s post on how and why Pedro earned his ban despite posting mostly in the Pit is a beauty of deep thought on his role here. The Pit can be a great place to have open, free-ranging discussion even if you don’t want to throw a cuss out from time to time, but you’ll restrict visibility from some of the posters - still nothing wrong with starting serious threads here if you want the freedom. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5757 "2025-10-19T20:30:35Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I guess if that makes you feel like a big man go knock yourself out. The irony (or maybe lack of self awareness) in this is quite remarkable. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5758 "2025-10-19T22:21:17Z")
Not to attack or defend @msmith537 or you, but this > [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > And I’m working on a grant we aren’t going to get because the people around me didn’t move their asses fast enough to get the supporting documentation needed to make it a compelling application. is exactly the part of your post in the other thread that lit me up. You have often commented in many threads about the irresponsible children you work with who refuse to do their jobs and so you’re cleaning up for all of them just as much as you’re cleaning up after your neurospicy 5yo. I totally believe you’re telling us the truth and I totally believe your high level of frustration with this situation is completely justified. And to me, that’s 100% bullshit. It is unacceptable that a competent organization or leadership would permit this kindergarten class you’re stuck supervising from below to continue to operate that way. You are wallowing in other people’s bullshit while they pile more on you every day. It’s for an excellent cause, but it’s also coming at a terrible price inflicted upon you by lazy incompetent management and lazier incompetenter workers. And that’s bullshit right down to the foundation of your building. You deserve better. Your cause deserves better. But your org needs about 75% of its employees replaced with people who are as together as you are. They’re fiddling while you’re burning. And that’s just wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2025, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5759 "2025-10-19T22:46:15Z")
Well you’ve definitely articulated how I feel at my most frustrated. I don’t feel that way all the time. But in this case I fucked up a bit. Well I had a personal crisis related to my son at the beginning of the month, which caused me to fall behind, and though I did clearly say, “you need to start gathering letters of support,” I didn’t really follow up on it for two weeks, because I was utterly swamped playing catch up on other stuff. But it pisses me off what when we finally did have the conversation, and people had their explicit marching orders to start soliciting letters of support, it took them _over a week_ to get the requests out, leaving us with one week to collect signatures. And now I’m going to have to submit a written explanation with the MOU for why it isn’t signed. It shouldn’t have happened but it wouldn’t have happened if things didn’t get fucked up at the beginning of this month and if I had followed up sooner. So I will take partial ownership for this one. But yeah there’s a lot of handholding required. It’s due to blatant favoritism that there is no accountability, but you have to weigh that against the incredible benefits of my job. I make a great salary, I have an outrageous level of autonomy, and they honestly don’t give a shit if I need to drop my kid off late and pick him up early and they won’t even let me submit PTO when I need to do something for him or myself, they just tell me to take it and not worry about it. And I like my coworkers and I’m passionate about the mission. It’s like I have a fair amount of stress on one hand and my dream job on the other. And I’m just trying to find the right mindset to make it less stressful. But yeah, clearly this is not a perfect situation. It’s a human one. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2025, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5760 "2025-10-20T10:26:49Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > > [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > > > And I’m working on a grant we aren’t going to get because the people around me didn’t move their asses fast enough to get the supporting documentation needed to make it a compelling application. > > is exactly the part of your post in the other thread that lit me up. > > You have often commented in many threads about the irresponsible children you work with who refuse to do their jobs and so you’re cleaning up for all of them just as much as you’re cleaning up after your neurospicy 5yo. > > I totally believe you’re telling us the truth and I totally believe your high level of frustration with this situation is completely justified. > > And to me, that’s 100% bullshit. It is unacceptable that a competent organization or leadership would permit this kindergarten class you’re stuck supervising from below to continue to operate that way. You are wallowing in other people’s bullshit while they pile more on you every day. It’s for an excellent cause, but it’s also coming at a terrible price inflicted upon you by lazy incompetent management and lazier incompetenter workers. > > And that’s bullshit right down to the foundation of your building. You deserve better. Your cause deserves better. But your org needs about 75% of its employees replaced with people who are as together as you are. They’re fiddling while you’re burning. And that’s just wrong. Which was really the point I was trying to make. Obviously I’m not against helping abused women and children. But @Spice_Weasel 's job is still an administrative office job, subject to the same office politics, bureaucracy, inefficiencies, and other bullshit of any other corporation or large institution. It sounds like half the people aren’t even doing the job they are paid to do. Ostensibly my company’s job was to go into corporations and try and do all this bullshit more efficiently. We only worked with banks but I’m sure Accenture or Mckinsey or the Big-4 all have practice areas that deal with grants and public sector stuff. But mostly it just seems to generate more administrative bullshit that no one follows and systems no one uses For 5 years everyone got to work remotely. Then suddenly it became an “issue”. Kind of makes me wonder if the whole economic system is BS. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2025, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5761 "2025-10-20T11:36:09Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > It’s due to blatant favoritism that there is no accountability, > [@msmith537](#): > > But @Spice_Weasel 's job is still an administrative office job, subject to the same office politics, bureaucracy, inefficiencies, and other bullshit of any other corporation or large institution. It sounds like half the people aren’t even doing the job they are paid to do. I think you both hit the head on the root cause, which is what I call “everyday, low-level corruption.” Which, in-turn, is rooted in politics and favoritism. Due to this, some people are not held accountable because they’re friends with management. My previous job became toxic because of this. If you were drinking buddies with management, you were completely “protected,” and you literally did not have to do any work. Zip. Zero. I blew the whistle on one person (who reported to me!) for being _completely_ useless, and I almost lost my job over it. Employees who are No Value Added (NVA) aren’t the problem. The problem is when management won’t deal with the NVAs, either due to fear or politics. This hurts team morale, which means it drags down _everyone_. ---
**Author:** ![scudsucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scudsucker/32/14101_2.png) [@scudsucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scudsucker)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2025, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532/5762 "2025-10-20T12:09:39Z")
> [@Slithy\_Tove](#): > > “My Heart is a Wounded Fawn in the Forest.” My heart is a Wounded Faun in the Forest. Mostly because I hurt myself during Bacchinalia. Must not drink red wine to excess… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532.md?page=272) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-were-you-thinking/991532.md?page=274)