# What will the UK do wrt Brexit? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 18, 2019, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799 "2019-02-18T22:39:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 27
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/521 "2019-03-27T13:35:21Z")
I’m not a compromise-friendly person. Especially when I’m absolutely right, and they’re being wilfully ignorant, or worse. And I mean, that’s the ONLY POINT of a parliamentary monarchy to behin with : to steer popular stupidity to a grinding halt. To let the monarch say “yeah, ok, no, just… no. You’re being dangerous idiots and you know it and that won’t fly in Queenie’s backyard”. That one plus is paid for very heavily, too. If she doesn’t do that, and if Nigel Farage isn’t fed to a pack of hungry adorable furry potatoes, what the fuck is that all \*about \*? ---
**Author:** ![Wrenching\_Spanners](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecb155/32.png) [@Wrenching\_Spanners](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrenching_Spanners)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/522 "2019-03-27T13:36:20Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > You explain the value in your own post, to mitigate the harm done by the intransigence on every side. And a shit compromise is better than no compromise at all, for both sides, given that the EU has made it effectively impossible for the UK to revoke Article 50. > > I would love to tell the extremists who want the EU to harm both itself and the UK to fuck right off, but I think that would be against the rules of this forum. How has the EU made it effectively impossible for the UK to revoke Article 50? I’m not in favour of it, but all it would take is a vote by Parliament and a letter from the government. For that matter, if May resigns, a caretaker leader could probably do the revocation unilaterally using the motion to reject No Deal and failure to pass a withdrawal agreement as justification. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/523 "2019-03-27T13:38:33Z")
> [@Wrenching\_Spanners](#): > > How has the EU made it effectively impossible for the UK to revoke Article 50? Yeah, that too. I mean, we keep suggesting it, wink wink, nudge nudge, say no more. What’s stopping you ? ---
**Author:** ![Wrenching\_Spanners](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecb155/32.png) [@Wrenching\_Spanners](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrenching_Spanners)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/524 "2019-03-27T13:41:50Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > I’m not a compromise-friendly person. Especially when I’m absolutely right, and they’re being wilfully ignorant, or worse. > > And I mean, that’s the ONLY POINT of a parliamentary monarchy to behin with : to steer popular stupidity to a grinding halt. To let the monarch say “yeah, ok, no, just… no. You’re being dangerous idiots and you know it and that won’t fly in Queenie’s backyard”. That one plus is paid for very heavily, too. If she doesn’t do that, and if Nigel Farage isn’t fed to a pack of hungry adorable furry potatoes, what the fuck is that all \*about \*? Farage was being fed to a pack of hungry potatoes earlier today. It’s called the EU parliament. He was asked why he wasn’t walking in the rain and compared to Blackadder’s General Haig. Sounded like he gave back as good as he got. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/525 "2019-03-27T13:43:43Z")
> [@Wrenching\_Spanners](#): > > How has the EU made it effectively impossible for the UK to revoke Article 50? By refusing to allow a long enough extension to enable a public vote on the issue. It won’t be revoked without a referendum or general election, as revoking it is permanent. The EU needs to either extend article 50 and shut up about European elections, or make it very clear that the UK would not be penalised for revoking then retriggering Article 50. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/526 "2019-03-27T13:51:08Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > I’m not a compromise-friendly person. Then you are the problem, and the reason so many people here hate the EU. You are no better that Rees-Mogg, or Trump for that matter. > [@](#): > > And I mean, that’s the ONLY POINT of a parliamentary monarchy to behin with : to steer popular stupidity to a grinding halt. To let the monarch say “yeah, ok, no, just… no. You’re being dangerous idiots and you know it and that won’t fly in Queenie’s backyard”. Not only is that not the ONLY POINT of a constitutional monarchy, it is not a point of it at all. Your complete failure to understand the British political system should be enough to stop you commenting in this thread, although if the EU as a whole is similarly ignorant it would explain why they keep failing on their half of striking a deal. > [@](#): > > That one plus is paid for very heavily, too. [False](https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/02/sovereign-grant-report-how-much-money-the-uk-gives-queen-elizabeth-ii.html). > [@](#): > > The Queen uses income from her personal investment portfolio and privates estates to meet her private expenses Once again you have no idea what you are talking about. I very much doubt your president takes no salary. > [@](#): > > If she doesn’t do that, and if Nigel Farage isn’t fed to a pack of hungry adorable furry potatoes, what the fuck is that all \*about \*? Monarchs killing politicians is not a good thing, regardless of what they stand for. Maybe have a little look at your own history (I remember you being French, correct me if I’m wrong). ---
**Author:** ![Malden\_Capell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malden_capell/32/5274_2.png) [@Malden\_Capell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malden_Capell)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/527 "2019-03-27T13:55:32Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > By refusing to allow a long enough extension to enable a public vote on the issue. It won’t be revoked without a referendum or general election, as revoking it is permanent. The EU needs to either extend article 50 and shut up about European elections, or make it very clear that the UK would not be penalised for revoking then retriggering Article 50. For fucks sake. It still can offer enough time, but only if the UK is prepared to actually hold one. What happens if the EU unilaterally offers tons of time and the U.k opts not to have one, and just runs down the clock again in its internal political civil war? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/528 "2019-03-27T14:02:45Z")
> [@Malden\_Capell](#): > > What happens if the EU unilaterally offers tons of time and the U.k opts not to have one, and just runs down the clock again in its internal political civil war? Nothing much happens. The UK remains in the EU, crisis is postponed, people get on with their lives, and we wait until 2022. It’s far from an optimal solution, but - like just about anything else - it is better foe everyone that leaving, especially leaving with no deal. I understand you don’t give a fuck about the UK, that’s reasonable, and I’d probably feel the same way. What I don’t get is why you are so eager to harm the rest of the EU, including the millions of (non-British) EU citizens living in the UK. The only reason that makes sense is the hope that harming the UK will strengthen the desire of other countries to stay in the union. But harming your citizens to hold on to power is, to put it very mildly, not a good thing. It is why so many people are angry at May, and kit should not be the example others follow. ---
**Author:** ![Wrenching\_Spanners](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecb155/32.png) [@Wrenching\_Spanners](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrenching_Spanners)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/529 "2019-03-27T14:05:19Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > By refusing to allow a long enough extension to enable a public vote on the issue. It won’t be revoked without a referendum or general election, as revoking it is permanent. The EU needs to either extend article 50 and shut up about European elections, or make it very clear that the UK would not be penalised for revoking then retriggering Article 50. Answering the second part first, it’s very clear that the UK can revoke Article 50 without penalty. Unless being pointed at and laughed at, and called a time waster is a penalty. There’s some question on if the UK would be able to re-invoke Article 50 in the near term. But that’s because Article 50 shouldn’t be used as a prop in some unfathomable in-out dance. As for requesting an extension to allow for a referendum or a general election, the EU is still allowing that. However, they’ve set a deadline - April 12. The UK needs to present a plan and ask for a sufficiently long extension by then, or a No-Deal withdrawal will happen. Yeah, the EU will require the UK to take part in the EU Parliament elections. That really doesn’t strike me as a harsh penalty. ---
**Author:** ![Wrenching\_Spanners](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecb155/32.png) [@Wrenching\_Spanners](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrenching_Spanners)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/530 "2019-03-27T14:10:05Z")
> [@Malden\_Capell](#): > > No, Steophan. > > The problem is this. > > The likes of the ERG are _never_ satisfied. Never ever. > > Let’s say the EU does what you say, and caves, and gives the UK a right to unilaterally revoke the customs union backstop. Completely free, with no tradeoff by the UK. > > I tell you what will happen next: the ERG will take this, smile, turn to their supporters, say ‘the EU has blinked!’ And they’ll turn back to the EU and DEMAND MORE CONCESSIONS. > > How much should the EU concede just so it can keep fluffing the delusional Brexiters to save the Uk from itself? Until the UK has completely free access to the Single Market, without tariffs, plus representation on the EU’s institutions, without any obligation to pay or obey anything it doesn’t want to? > > By putting its foot down, the EU has helped to save the UK from these freaks. Already we’re seeing Parliament take control and softer versions of Brexit, more reasonable and less damaging, become more tenable politically. > > Thank you, EU, for doing what you did. You’ve made it easier for the UK and the EU to form a beneficial, stable partnership for the future. > Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Do you actually think that if a soft Brexit is passed, the Remainers will shut up? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/531 "2019-03-27T14:30:49Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > the EU has made it effectively impossible for the UK to revoke Article 50. Would this be the same EU that has said the UK can revoke at any time? ---
**Author:** ![Wrenching\_Spanners](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecb155/32.png) [@Wrenching\_Spanners](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrenching_Spanners)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/532 "2019-03-27T14:33:21Z")
Meanwhile, proving that May isn’t the worst party leader in Parliament: > [@](#): > > Jeremy Corbyn’s spokesman explains that the party only supports a referendum on a “damaging Tory Brexit”. If Labour takes power, he says, it will negotiate a better Brexit, which won’t need a referendum. ---
**Author:** ![Malden\_Capell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malden_capell/32/5274_2.png) [@Malden\_Capell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malden_Capell)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/533 "2019-03-27T14:36:15Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Nothing much happens. The UK remains in the EU, crisis is postponed, people get on with their lives, and we wait until 2022. It’s far from an optimal solution, but - like just about anything else - it is better foe everyone that leaving, especially leaving with no deal. > > I understand you don’t give a fuck about the UK, that’s reasonable, and I’d probably feel the same way. What I don’t get is why you are so eager to harm the rest of the EU, including the millions of (non-British) EU citizens living in the UK. > > The only reason that makes sense is the hope that harming the UK will strengthen the desire of other countries to stay in the union. But harming your citizens to hold on to power is, to put it very mildly, not a good thing. It is why so many people are angry at May, and kit should not be the example others follow. Go fuck yourself. There’s little more important to me than the Uk, but I’m not so self-centred as to think the whole world should indulge our national delusion. Why, please, why should the EU indefinitely extend Brexit negotiations until the UK makes an agreement, when after three years (47?) it hasn’t been able to make up its mind within the _Cabinet_, let alone the Tory party, let alone the government, let alone Parliament, let alone the country. It’s the EU setting a firm deadline of two weeks from now which has allowed Parliament to grow some stones and take control to make a softer Brexit or cancellation actually possible. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Malden\_Capell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malden_capell/32/5274_2.png) [@Malden\_Capell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malden_Capell)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/534 "2019-03-27T14:37:45Z")
> [@Wrenching\_Spanners](#): > > Do you actually think that if a soft Brexit is passed, the Remainers will shut up? Probably not, no, but everyone’s so bloody fed up with it all now I think that those who do will be firmly told to shut up forever by the rest of the country. Same goes for Brexiters. Won’t happen under May’s Deal or No Deal though, as the country will be actively flushed down the toilet. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/535 "2019-03-27T14:46:22Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Nothing much happens. The UK remains in the EU, crisis is postponed, people get on with their lives, and we wait until 2022. It’s far from an optimal solution, but - like just about anything else - it is better foe everyone that leaving, especially leaving with no deal. > > I understand you don’t give a fuck about the UK, that’s reasonable, and I’d probably feel the same way. What I don’t get is why you are so eager to harm the rest of the EU, including the millions of (non-British) EU citizens living in the UK. > > The only reason that makes sense is the hope that harming the UK will strengthen the desire of other countries to stay in the union. But harming your citizens to hold on to power is, to put it very mildly, not a good thing. It is why so many people are angry at May, and kit should not be the example others follow. The EU isn’t harming the UK. The UK is doing that just fine by itself. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/536 "2019-03-27T14:48:51Z")
> [@Malden\_Capell](#): > > Go fuck yourself. There’s little more important to me than the Uk, but I’m not so self-centred as to think the whole world should indulge our national delusion. Charming. Anyway, it has nothing to do with indulging the UK, and everything to do with the EU not harming itself just to harm the UK more. It is fucking stupid behaviour, as stupid as the behaviour of the UK and with even less justification. > [@](#): > > Why, please, why should the EU indefinitely extend Brexit negotiations until the UK makes an agreement, when after three years (47?) it hasn’t been able to make up its mind within the _Cabinet_, let alone the Tory party, let alone the government, let alone Parliament, let alone the country. They should do it to try to ensure the UK doesn’t leave, and if it does, that it does so in the least painful way possible. > [@](#): > > It’s the EU setting a firm deadline of two weeks from now which has allowed Parliament to grow some stones and take control to make a softer Brexit or cancellation actually possible. A softer Brexit? The EU has made it quite clear they will not negotiate such a thing, they have made it politically impossible for Article 50 to be rescinded, and are requiring the UK to go against its usual political processes without being willing to do the same - for example, by not making the European elections a big deal. > [@](#): > > Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Nobody cares. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/537 "2019-03-27T14:51:15Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > The EU isn’t harming the UK. The UK is doing that just fine by itself. They are not mutually exclusive, but once again _that is not the point._ The EU is harming itself instead of acting to prevent harm to both itself and the UK. I don’t understand why people aren’t up in arms about this, why there aren’t millions of people in Europe marching and signing petitions to prevent it. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/538 "2019-03-27T14:52:21Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Then you are the problem, and the reason so many people here hate the EU. **UK:** We hate the EU because you guys make us bend over backwards to do what you want and we’re tired of it! This “union” isn’t worth all the aggravation we have to put up with in order to stay together! We’re leaving you! **EU:** Okay. **UK:** This is our official notification! Two years from now we’re gonna quit your little club and you won’t be able to boss us around any more! **EU:** Okay. _Two years less two weeks later:_ **UK:** We’re not quite ready to leave yet! We want to postpone the official breakup date! **EU:** Okay, but you’ve had nearly two years to decide what you want, and you can’t keep us hanging around indefinitely. If you give us an actual procedure for the breakup then you can have another two months to implement it, but if you just keep on stalling then we’re only going to wait another two weeks. You said you wanted to leave, so leave. **UK:** Why, you meanies! Don’t you realize that it’s worth putting up with some aggravation in order for us to stay together? This is why we hate the EU, because you won’t bend over backwards to do what we want! **EU:** :rolleyes: Honestly, **Steophan** , your rhetoric is not making the UK as a body look any less immature and petulant here. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/539 "2019-03-27T14:55:46Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Honestly, **Steophan** , your rhetoric is not making the UK as a body look any less immature and petulant here. No, probably not. Shame the EU is determined to copy us. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2019, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799/540 "2019-03-27T15:01:02Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > No, probably not. Shame the EU is determined to copy us. Well, I may be just a dumb Yank, but I don’t see any “copying” here. The EU have made up their minds and given you a clear choice of options, which is something the UK doesn’t seem able to do for love nor money. Moaning that they ought to step in and unilaterally save you from your own failure of self-governance seems to me like just further ducking your own responsibilities. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799.md?page=26) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-the-uk-do-wrt-brexit/829799.md?page=28)