# What will Trump do when he starts to face the fact that there are no easy answers to our problems **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 24, 2016, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875 "2016-11-24T04:24:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/61 "2016-11-27T05:05:35Z")
Could be, I guess, that in the beauty shops, truck stops and diners of America, working class white folks are complaining bitterly about trade agreements. Seems a stretch, truth be told. ---
**Author:** ![Llama\_Llogophile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@Llama\_Llogophile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Llama_Llogophile)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/62 "2016-11-27T16:10:53Z")
> [@Corry\_El](#): > > Getting re-elected is the only objective benchmark of presidential success. Oh, good. Now we can close all those history departments, stop publishing books and articles, and no longer think and talk about actual events that occur in reality and how they affect people around the world. Forgive me, but this is one of the most (trying to be polite here) ‘unenlightened’ statements I’ve ever seen on these boards. No easy answers indeed. You’re right that there’s no “objective” benchmark to judge a president, but that doesn’t make reelection a good one. ---
**Author:** ![Corry\_El](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecae2f/32.png) [@Corry\_El](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corry_El)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/63 "2016-11-27T17:02:28Z")
> [@Llama\_Llogophile](#): > > Oh, good. Now we can close all those history departments, stop publishing books and articles, and no longer think and talk about actual events that occur in reality and how they affect people around the world. > > Forgive me, but this is one of the most (trying to be polite here) ‘unenlightened’ statements I’ve ever seen on these boards. > > No easy answers indeed. You’re right that there’s no “objective” benchmark to judge a president, but that doesn’t make reelection a good one. You’re forgiven, but I believe the point stands. It’s fine to have subjective opinions about stuff. But like I said, if ‘success’ is defined by obviously anti-X people in a polarized political system, who we pretty much _know_ are going to deem X a failure, I think your enlightened mind should be able to recognize the limitations of that. If Trump manages to win reelection, that’s an objective fact arguing against some meltdown after he and the voters ‘face the fact’ that the countries problems are not easy to solve. Same goes for Obama, and has been quite frequently used as an argument why he’s not a failure, with some degree of truth (though I don’t personally think Obama’s been much of a success, and now a lot of what he did is liable to be undone), but he got reelected didn’t he? And that fact is not up for debate, unlike almost any other point that would be made either way. ---
**Author:** ![Llama\_Llogophile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@Llama\_Llogophile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Llama_Llogophile)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/64 "2016-11-27T17:12:33Z")
> [@Corry\_El](#): > > You’re forgiven, but I believe the point stands. It’s fine to have subjective opinions about stuff. But like I said, if ‘success’ is defined by obviously anti-X people in a polarized political system, who we pretty much _know_ are going to deem X a failure, I think your enlightened mind should be able to recognize the limitations of that. > > If Trump manages to win reelection, that’s an objective fact arguing against some meltdown after he and the voters ‘face the fact’ that the countries problems are not easy to solve. Same goes for Obama, and has been quite frequently used as an argument why he’s not a failure, with some degree of truth (though I don’t personally think Obama’s been much of a success, and now a lot of what he did is liable to be undone), but he got reelected didn’t he? And that fact is not up for debate, unlike almost any other point that would be made either way. Again, not trying to be dismissive or rude… But that’s a lot of word salad trying to find a way around the fact that life isn’t objective, and requires qualitative analysis. It’s a mistake to then default to the simplest metric. ---
**Author:** ![Corry\_El](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecae2f/32.png) [@Corry\_El](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Corry_El)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/65 "2016-11-27T17:39:27Z")
> [@Llama\_Llogophile](#): > > Again, not trying to be dismissive or rude… But that’s a lot of word salad trying to find a way around the fact that life isn’t objective, and requires qualitative analysis. It’s a mistake to then default to the simplest metric. But still largely succeeding… 🙂 And your shorter word salad still misses the point, which is that getting reelected is an objective benchmark of non-failure. I didn’t say it was the only one, didn’t even say subjective judgments were illegitimate. But again if the measure of Trump’s success is whether most people on this forum judge him successful, we already know the answer: they’ll say he’s a failure, pretty certainly. I think your enlightened mind with a little more work could still see the limitation in such a judgment, or maybe not. ---
**Author:** ![skdo23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@skdo23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/skdo23)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/66 "2016-11-27T18:01:53Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Could be, I guess, that in the beauty shops, truck stops and diners of America, working class white folks are complaining bitterly about trade agreements. Seems a stretch, truth be told. It’s not much of a stretch to think that working class white folks complain about economic conditions that Trump blamed on trade agreements during his campaign. ---
**Author:** ![joemama24\_98](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ce7236/32.png) [@joemama24\_98](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joemama24_98)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/67 "2016-11-27T20:04:32Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > His supporters were more the angry white guys who hate “PC” not the hard core evangelicals. > > Truth be told, I think religious attendance among working class whites is declining. I would not discount the evangenlical vote as not being a key reason for the election result. I know several who despite their strong dislike for Trump voted for him solely because he was the anti-abortion candidate. This is still a pivotal issue for many, and while I doubt Roe v Wade will be revisited even by a conservative Supreme Court, many hold hope that it will be. ---
**Author:** ![Biffster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biffster/32/339_2.png) [@Biffster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffster)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/68 "2016-11-27T20:32:42Z")
Out of respect for the new President-elect, Mr. Trump has requested that certain pictures of him not be circulated any more on the Internet. [![](http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/f7463ba5632695b11e66a3b91a012571.jpg) ](http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/f7463ba5632695b11e66a3b91a012571.jpg) Also closeup of said pictures like this. [http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/e4b19b37bc43591ca559e677ed6ac90c.png](http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/e4b19b37bc43591ca559e677ed6ac90c.png) Or unflattering photos like this. [http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/f36bf08019ac5b8817e2ae1a79d6d59d.jpg](http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/f36bf08019ac5b8817e2ae1a79d6d59d.jpg) Or even pictures of bad hair days (admittedly plentiful). [http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/ff9a941b15afa765145b136258c310fd.jpg](http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/ff9a941b15afa765145b136258c310fd.jpg) Your cooperation in this regard is kindly appreciated. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/69 "2016-11-27T20:58:33Z")
Beauty is only skin deep, but ugly goes to the bone. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2016, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/70 "2016-11-27T21:25:15Z")
> [@Biffster](#): > > Out of respect for the new President-elect, Mr. Trump has requested that certain pictures of him not be circulated any more on the Internet. > > [http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/f7463ba5632695b11e66a3b91a012571.jpg](http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161127/f7463ba5632695b11e66a3b91a012571.jpg) > > … I’m no fan of Trump. But you have to admit he’s clearly indicating what he’s really thinking at that moment. Compared to more wooden campaigners in both this election and earlier ones (Romney anyone?) you can see a certain attractiveness in the reality of it. ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2016, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/71 "2016-11-28T20:02:04Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Could be, I guess, that in the beauty shops, truck stops and diners of America, working class white folks are complaining bitterly about trade agreements. Seems a stretch, truth be told. They are bitterly complaining about jobs being shipped to China. Perhaps the truck driver’s father got good money working in a factory that no longer exists. Maybe the waitress at the diner is working because her husband got laid off from the factory job he had. A few days after the election, NPR’s “On Point” was interviewing a Democrat representative from Michigan who’s district voted for Trump. She pointed out that her district voted for Obama (by a large margin IIRC) in the previous two elections, which seems to disprove the excuse that Trump won largely because of racism. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2016, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/72 "2016-11-28T20:52:01Z")
> [@Deeg](#): > > I’m not sure I agree with this. One of his biggest block of supporters (at least the one we talk about the most) are the working class, who are traditionally democrat. I’m very skepitcal that that’s a big block of Trump supporters; the evidence suggest his supporters were largely Republicans, as one would expect of a Republican candidate. Trump turned out some white, working class folks in the right states to win, but he didn’t get a huge number of them. We are, after all talking about a candidate who, of the last six Presidential candidates (counting Obama twice) finished sixth in votes. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2016, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875/73 "2016-11-28T21:11:26Z")
I thought Reagan captured all the white working class Democrats. Did he give them back? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-will-trump-do-when-he-starts-to-face-the-fact-that-there-are-no-easy-answers-to-our-problems/772875.md?page=3)