# What would a Cheney Presidency be like?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [January 22, 2005, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012 "2005-01-22T01:09:12Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/1 "2005-01-22T01:09:12Z")
Over in the “Successful Second Term” thread, **Brain Glutton** roiled the waters by suggesting that Mr. Bush’s resignation and/or suicide would be beneficial to the country. However, it’s not unheard of for Presidents not to serve out a full term, for a variety of reasons, chiefly death but Mr. Nixon resigned.
Assume for whatever reason you care to posit that Mr. Bush is no longer President as of the near future (say the next sixty days). It might be his sudden death from heart attack or stroke, it might be his resigning, either under a cloud or simply that he has burned out and chooses to step down; it might be that he is totally disabled by some tragedy. It matters not what – it’s a presupposition to this thread that for some random reason Mr. Bush is no longer President, and Mr. Cheney steps up to the Oval Office as provided for Constitutionally and in longstanding precedent.
Practically, and without partisan sniping to the greatest extent possible, what would you see as the defining characteristics of a Cheney Presidency? What Bush policies would he continue to pursue? What would he change, and in what ways?
The idea here is to speculate, based on what is publicly known about the man and his views and attitudes. No ill will is intended in this OP toward Mr. Bush; it’s merely hypothecated that Mr. Cheney has replaced him as President for reasons that need not be dealt with, in order to get to the gist of the question posed in the thread title.
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### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/2 "2005-01-22T01:12:07Z")
^^^ _urinates all over self_
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### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/3 "2005-01-22T01:13:24Z")
um, that would be /me, not /him
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### Author:  [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/4 "2005-01-22T01:16:29Z")
I see very little changing. How many instances can you think of within the past four years of Shrub and Cheney really, seriously disagreeing with each other about any policy? How many instances where Bush supported a bill while Cheney opposed it? How many where Bush wanted one course of action on foreign policy while Cheney wanted a different one? They are two men of the same mind, with all available evidence pointing towards the conclusion that Shrub always takes Cheney’s advice. In terms of policy, then, nothing would change.
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### Author:  [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/5 "2005-01-22T01:31:30Z")
Business as usual – complete continuity, a little more articulate, maybe, not as much giggling and smirking, but more of the same with a less personable face. Some cynic might suggest that you are talking about replacing the puppet with the puppet master.
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### Author:  [@Age\_Quod\_Agis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Age_Quod_Agis)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/6 "2005-01-22T01:43:57Z")
> [@ITR champion](#):
>
> How many instances can you think of within the past four years of Shrub and Cheney really, seriously disagreeing with each other about any policy?
Publicly, the only one that comes to mind is the dust-up over gay marriage during the debates (Cheney favors it, but says the President sets Administration policy). Cheney has a reputation for being more discreet than most VPs (possibly because he has no political aspirations himself), but it’s hardly atypical for a VP to set aside his own beliefs and toe the line that his President draws.
[This article](http://archives.cnn.com/2002/ALLPOLITICS/12/23/timep.partners.tm/) suggests that the biggest difference between Bush and Cheney (at least in terms of their political abilities) is that Bush is an affable salesman, and Cheney is a gruff details man. Cheney is more of a CEO than a politician. For example:
> [@](#):
>
> Bush gave Cheney the energy portfolio, only to inspire complaints (and lawsuits) about his secrecy in handling it and his clumsiness in promoting it. In one of the rare moments when Cheney went front and center, he made news by deriding conservation as a “personal virtue,” as opposed to a pillar of any effective national strategy.
>
> Maybe because he is from Wyoming, where the center lies to the right of just about everyplace else, and because he has not run for office in 14 years, Cheney seemed not to realize that protecting the environment had become a core value to voters in both parties. This was, even to the Bush team, something of a surprise. “He’s pretty tone-deaf on this stuff,” conceded a senior White House official at the time.
This also suggests that Cheney might not place as high a priority on environmental regulation as the Bush.
Cheney also opposed campaign finance reform:
> [@](#):
>
> When Bush’s Republican rival, Senator John McCain, showed up at the White House the evening of Jan. 31, 2001, he expected to discuss his campaign-finance-reform bill privately over a drink with Bush in the residence. Instead, he was directed to the Oval Office, where Cheney was waiting as well.
>
> Despite his hostile rhetoric during the campaign, Bush had never studied McCain’s proposal carefully. Cheney stayed silent as McCain leafed through the 38-page bill to explain its provisions, insisting that it would not hurt Republicans. Bush asked a lot of questions; he seemed intrigued. Cheney was not. He sat impassive throughout the presentation. Bush finally turned to Cheney. “So what do you think?” he asked. “Yeah, you haven’t said anything,” McCain prodded. “I’d like to hear it.” “Well, I’m for full disclosure and no limits,” Cheney would only say, which was essentially the opposite of McCain’s approach. Bush and McCain both laughed. “Well, it’s a good thing I’m handling this issue,” Bush said, chuckling. Just over a year later, he signed McCain’s bill.
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### Author:  [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/7 "2005-01-22T02:06:48Z")
Brief.
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/8 "2005-01-22T02:07:13Z")
Milo: PRESIDENT QUAYLE!
Bill: AAUGH!
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### Author:  [@Malodorous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malodorous)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/9 "2005-01-22T03:08:17Z")
We wouldn’t get MLK day off anymore ☹
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### Author:  [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/10 "2005-01-22T03:25:56Z")
> [@Malodorous](#):
>
> We wouldn’t get MLK day off anymore
Why?
> [@ITR champion](#):
>
> How many instances can you think of within the past four years of Shrub and Cheney really, seriously disagreeing with each other about any policy?
Well, at least from the History Channels perspective in their Presidents series, Bush runs a pretty tight ship…and makes all the decisions. If you are implying that Bush is some kind of puppet.
Hm…what would it be like under Chaney? I actually don’t know myself. I’m unsure of Chaney’s stance on things like fiscal policy. Certainly I don’t see a radical change in our Iraq/WoT policies and I think Chaney is mainly in agreement with Bush on those. But Iraq and the WoT aren’t everything. Is Chaney an old style Conservative fiscally?
-XT
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### Author:  [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/11 "2005-01-22T03:26:52Z")
> [@ITR champion](#):
>
> I see very little changing. How many instances can you think of within the past four years of Shrub and Cheney really, seriously disagreeing with each other about any policy?
There might not be a change in **direction** – but it is possible that Cheney, being, as **Age Quod Agis** noted, a “CEO” where Bush is an “affable salesman,” might be less successful than Bush in selling his policies to the public and to Congress.
Also . . . a lot of people seem to think Bush has charisma. I’ve never heard anyone say that about Cheney. He has the charisma of a rotting dog carcass.
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### Author:  [@Malodorous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malodorous)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/12 "2005-01-22T04:01:25Z")
> [@xtisme](#):
>
> > [@Malodorous](#):
> >
> > We wouldn’t get MLK day off anymore
>
> Why?
Cheney voted against making MLK day a holiday while he was in the house.
> [@](#):
>
> Is Chaney an old style Conservative fiscally?
I recall someone (O’Niel, I think) quoted him as saying that “Reagan proved that deficits don’t matter”, when someone was complaining about the fiscal impact of the second round of tax cuts.
The main difference between Cheney and Bush, I think is that Bush is a big gov’t conservative advocating no-child left behind, expanding medicare, etc. Cheney, at least back in his Congress days, was not (he voted against the creation of the dept. of education). It would be interesting to see if Cheney would stick to these beliefs and abandon the politically succsessful “compasionate conservatism” of Bush if he found himself president.
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### Author:  [@kniz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kniz)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/13 "2005-01-22T04:51:15Z")
Who would be Vice President? This is important since a thread like this will be taken more seriously if Cheney becomes President.
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### Author:  [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/14 "2005-01-22T04:59:44Z")
> [@kniz](#):
>
> Who would be Vice President?
Damien Thorne? 🙂
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### Author:  [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/15 "2005-01-22T05:08:55Z")
> [@Polycarp](#):
>
> Over in the “Successful Second Term” thread, **Brain Glutton** roiled the waters by suggesting that Mr. Bush’s resignation and/or suicide would be beneficial to the country.
BTW:
1. :rolleyes: **That was a frickin’ _Blackadder_ reference!** One I would have expected most Dopers to get! Are we nerds, or are we nerds?
2. As I said in the referenced thread – and as I have said several times in other threads – we need **much** more liberal rules on this board – and especially in the GD forum – when it comes to wishing death on named individuals and/or groups. **There are many, many circumstances – and especially here-and-now – where wishing death on people is perfectly legitimate, even inescapably relevant, political discourse!** :mad:
Not that I’m actually wishing death on Bush, you understand. I do proudly and honorably wish all imaginable pain, suffering and humiliation upon him, in personal terms. But in political terms – Cheney would be a worse president in every conceivable respect save personal intelligence.
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### Author:  [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/16 "2005-01-22T13:58:42Z")
President Cheney’s first act would be to nominate a new vice president to be confirmed by the Senate. I think you’d see a cabinet shakeup, certainly there must be at least one that gets in Cheney’s hair (metaphorically speaking). Foreign policy would be much unchanged. In fiscal policy, I would expect that Cheney would be a bit more of a true fiscal conservative than Bush.
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### Author:  [@Demorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Demorian)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/17 "2005-01-22T14:42:13Z")
The neocon movement would suffer for it. As others have noted, Bush is a generally liked frontman. Cheney… well, he lacks the charisma Bush can be said to have by his admirerers. They wouldn’t be able to bully things around like they have been.
But on the other hand, I think Cheney would be a more “dangerous” man than Bush is.
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### Author:  [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/18 "2005-01-22T14:44:01Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#):
>
> BTW:
>
> 1. :rolleyes: **That was a frickin’ _Blackadder_ reference!** One I would have expected most Dopers to get! Are we nerds, or are we nerds?
It was so cunning a reference that **nobody got it** , and thought you were trying to weasel! 😃
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### Author:  [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/19 "2005-01-22T16:59:37Z")
> [@Age Quod Agis](#):
>
> Cheney is more of a CEO than a politician.
He’d probably try to merge the U.S. with someplace really good, like Haiti. It would be just like his brilliant maneuver, when CEO of Haliburton, to acquire Dresser Industries, with all of its highly attractive asbestos liability. (Dresser was also selling stuff to Saddam Hussein as late as 2000). In short, Cheney likes to portray himself as the CEO type, but in real life, he proved to be remarkably inept at it. Sort of like GWB himself and a number of other officials in the adminstration. Josh Marshall referred to this as “the myth of Republican competence” in [a wonderful article from 2001.](http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0209.marshall.html)
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### Author:  [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2005, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-cheney-presidency-be-like/286012/20 "2005-01-22T17:02:30Z")
Make that 2002, not 2001.
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