# What would a society be like without a prison? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 29, 2012, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195 "2012-03-29T19:38:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/21 "2012-03-30T06:08:31Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > And worked poorly. Such historical societies were more violent and chaotic than ours. I don’t really know if that’s true across the broad spectrum of history. No matter. Like I said, I don’t really advocate such a system. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/22 "2012-03-30T06:14:00Z")
> [@Scotty Mo](#): > > Well, what can be said about prisons? Absolutely nothing. They are a huge waste. They keep dangerous people separated in a place where they cannot harm the rest of society. > [@](#): > > I’m of the opinion that most people are good at heart and have to be taught hatred. But what we have is a system that says, “if you do something we deem bad, our boys will take you away. But it’s ok for us to do bad cause we make the rules.” What kind of example are we setting? Are you serious? What do you propose to do with people who murder, rape and steal? ---
**Author:** ![Yakuza](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/bbce88/32.png) [@Yakuza](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yakuza)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/23 "2012-03-30T06:36:23Z")
Boy u talking about 1 f\*cked up scenario. Saying what life would be like with no prison is like saying what life would be like with no hell ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 6:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/24 "2012-03-30T06:53:15Z")
I’m okay with hell being purely fictional. In fact, I’m pretty confident it is. ---
**Author:** ![Yakuza](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/bbce88/32.png) [@Yakuza](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yakuza)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/25 "2012-03-30T07:14:03Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > I’m okay with hell being purely fictional. > In fact, I’m pretty confident it is. Not to get off topic but hell is real. There would be no such thing as good and evil without Heaven and hell. Just like there would be no such thing as a crime if there was no prison ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/26 "2012-03-30T07:32:36Z")
> [@Yakuza](#): > > There would be no such thing as good and evil without Heaven and hell. In that case, it is impossible to definitively say whether Heaven is ‘good’ or ‘evil’ (and the same for Hell). ---
**Author:** ![Yakuza](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/bbce88/32.png) [@Yakuza](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yakuza)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/27 "2012-03-30T07:41:18Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > In that case, it is impossible to definitively say whether Heaven is ‘good’ or ‘evil’ (and the same for Hell). Of course Heaven is good, ehats so bad about a plrce with no poverty, sickness, or violence? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/28 "2012-03-30T07:48:36Z")
> [@Yakuza](#): > > Of course Heaven is good, ehats so bad about a plrce with no poverty, sickness, or violence? So a place of no poverty, sickness or violence is good? So there is such a thing as ‘good’, independently of Heaven/Hell ---
**Author:** ![Yakuza](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/bbce88/32.png) [@Yakuza](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yakuza)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/29 "2012-03-30T09:24:10Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > So a place of no poverty, sickness or violence is good? So there is such a thing as ‘good’, independently of Heaven/Hell Yea, but Heaven is what makes the good have meaning ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 9:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/30 "2012-03-30T09:38:24Z")
> [@Yakuza](#): > > Yea, but Heaven is what makes the good have meaning If heaven is the source of the standard we’re calling good, then it is meaningless to judge heaven as ‘good’ by that standard. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 9:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/31 "2012-03-30T09:39:34Z")
Or to put it another way, unless it’s possible to decide, independently of heaven, that something is ‘good’, then we can’t be sure heaven is good. ---
**Author:** ![Yakuza](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/bbce88/32.png) [@Yakuza](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yakuza)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 11:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/32 "2012-03-30T11:07:25Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Or to put it another way, unless it’s possible to decide, independently of heaven, that something is ‘good’, then we can’t be sure heaven is good. Ok that just don’t make any sense. You’re just tryin 2 use reverse psychology 2 trick me into thinking there is no Heaven ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/33 "2012-03-30T12:01:25Z")
> [@Yakuza](#): > > Ok that just don’t make any sense. You’re just tryin 2 use reverse psychology 2 trick me into thinking there is no Heaven Nope, I’m pointing out that you can’t measure something if that thing is the source of all measurements, but I don’t really think it’s worth hijacking this thread any further. ETA: and reverse psychology probably isn’t what you think it is, either. ---
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/34 "2012-03-30T13:54:51Z")
> [@Scotty Mo](#): > > Ok, so this recent Trayvon Martin case got me to thinking. What if there was no prison for criminals to be sent too? What if we just tried them and even if convicted just let them go free? > > In light of this case, I would say someone like Zimmerman might be in big trouble with some people. (AKA the black panthers). And we all get to save our taxpayer money. > > But in reality, it seems like a very dangerous concept. Vigilantism and hitmen without recourse may be too easy for some. > > What say you, dopers? Or it could be like the book version of Starship Troopers where punishment is quick and physical removing the need for walls and “time outs” that don’t work very well. ---
**Author:** ![panaccione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/94ad74/32.png) [@panaccione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panaccione)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/35 "2012-03-30T15:08:57Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > They keep dangerous people separated in a place where they cannot harm the rest of society. > > Are you serious? What do you propose to do with people who murder, rape and steal? I don’t know. I’ll admit it seems like a wild idea. However, the people you mention above need more care than anything. Sure there’s justice to be had, but what about forgiveness? People make mistakes. Most people who are educated and have self-esteem are good intentioned and feel remorse when they do something bad. Here’s a thought, what if we took all the money out of the prison system we have and put it into welfare, education, and other social services? Would that have an overall good effect or bad? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/36 "2012-03-30T16:33:54Z")
Isn’t the law code described in the Torah (/Pentateuch/Old Testament) an example of a society without prisons? ---
**Author:** ![florez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b9e5f3/32.png) [@florez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/florez)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/37 "2012-03-30T17:15:55Z")
Society without prison, and more forgiveness, and care for criminals…try telling that to victims, or their families. Of course, some criminals may be mentally ill, and need care, but others may be violent psychopaths. The current prison system evolved from public hangings and floggings, people trapped in stocks, and displayed in dirty cages. So, treatment of prisoners has been steadily improving, but many problems still exist. Private ownership of prisons, in many states, may be the answer to over crowded facilities, but prison business as big business? Where is the incentive to seek alternative methods, and positive change? More criminals, no problem, more prisons, more profits? So, like the OP, I see need for change, but I also believe that some people have to be incarcerated. For example Charles Manson. ---
**Author:** ![panaccione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/94ad74/32.png) [@panaccione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panaccione)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/38 "2012-03-30T17:16:20Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Isn’t the law code described in the Torah (/Pentateuch/Old Testament) an example of a society without prisons? I don’t know. What do I look like, a historian? ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/39 "2012-03-30T17:21:38Z")
> [@Scotty Mo](#): > > Ok, so this recent Trayvon Martin case got me to thinking. What if there was no prison for criminals to be sent too? What if we just tried them and even if convicted just let them go free? We pretty much have that now. People rarely do time and when they do, they rarely complete a full sentence. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2012, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195/40 "2012-03-30T18:27:22Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Isn’t the law code described in the Torah (/Pentateuch/Old Testament) an example of a society without prisons? Well, I guess, with a set of fines and other penalties for assault, rape and murder, few of which would mesh with a modern view of “justice”. I daresay if the U.S. wants to _reduce_ its prison population, there are ways to do so that won’t radically affect their society. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/what-would-a-society-be-like-without-a-prison/617195.md?page=3)